UPDATE: 11/14/12

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UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Wed Nov 14, 2012 4:58 pm

Added:

HB153 - Redefining "intoxication"
HB164 - Repealing death penalty

SB11 - Prohibiting certain state-provided funds from being used to purchase firearms
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby canvasbck » Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:10 pm

Please tell me that HB164 has zero chance of seeing the floor.
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby The Mad Moderate » Wed Nov 14, 2012 5:41 pm

canvasbck wrote:Please tell me that HB164 has zero chance of seeing the floor.

If it wouldn't get repealed in commiefornia I don't think it'll happen here.
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby SewTexas » Wed Nov 14, 2012 7:57 pm

canvasbck wrote:Please tell me that HB164 has zero chance of seeing the floor.


not happening, not here, nope
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:21 pm

canvasbck wrote:Please tell me that HB164 has zero chance of seeing the floor.


I'd be in shock if it gets to the floor! That said, if it gets a hearing in committee, I'll issue a call-to-action on this bill. This is probably just Rep. Dutton's grandstanding for his constituents.

Chas.
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby Rrash » Thu Nov 15, 2012 9:57 am

In this day and age, its important to take every stupid HB seriously before it sprouts wings and takes flight. Thanks for your service Chas.
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby koolaid » Thu Nov 15, 2012 12:49 pm

I have always found it odd that the people who express the most distrust in the government and politics of the various courts are also the most adamant supporters of the death penalty.

There have been at least 12 people in Texas alone who sat on death row for years only to be exonerated.

But, it is what it is, I suppose.
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby brainman » Thu Nov 15, 2012 1:42 pm

I'm generally all for the death penalty. But Koolaid, you do make an excellent point. I have no idea how to reconcile that, though.
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby koolaid » Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:31 pm

brainman wrote:I'm generally all for the death penalty. But Koolaid, you do make an excellent point. I have no idea how to reconcile that, though.


I changed my opinion of it over the last couple of years. I think the benefits of the death penalty as a deterrent or to satisfy a desire for the ultimate justice are outweighed by the very real potential of the state murdering even one innocent person.

I really can't even begin to imagine how terrifying that would be.

It has been a debated topic for probably thousands of years.

Ben Franklin and John Adams seem like a decent place to start, but I realize a lot of my opinions put me squarely in the minority here. haha.
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:10 pm

koolaid wrote:I have always found it odd that the people who express the most distrust in the government and politics of the various courts are also the most adamant supporters of the death penalty.

There have been at least 12 people in Texas alone who sat on death row for years only to be exonerated.

But, it is what it is, I suppose.


I don't think there have been 12 in Texas. Please list them, I may be wrong.

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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:14 pm

brainman wrote:I'm generally all for the death penalty. But Koolaid, you do make an excellent point. I have no idea how to reconcile that, though.


12 non-governmental people make the decision. That's a big difference.

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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby The Annoyed Man » Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:18 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
canvasbck wrote:Please tell me that HB164 has zero chance of seeing the floor.


I'd be in shock if it gets to the floor! That said, if it gets a hearing in committee, I'll issue a call-to-action on this bill. This is probably just Rep. Dutton's grandstanding for his constituents.

Chas.

Since I don't know a thing about Dutton, are his constituents more likely to find themselves the beneficiaries of HB164 than say, my representative's constituents?
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby C-dub » Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:38 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
koolaid wrote:I have always found it odd that the people who express the most distrust in the government and politics of the various courts are also the most adamant supporters of the death penalty.

There have been at least 12 people in Texas alone who sat on death row for years only to be exonerated.

But, it is what it is, I suppose.


I don't think there have been 12 in Texas. Please list them, I may be wrong.

Chas.

NAME CONVICTED EXONERATED YEARS BETWEEN REASON DNA **
Vernon McManus 1977 1987 10 Charges Dismissed
Randall Dale Adams 1977 1989 12 Charges Dismissed
Clarence Brandley 1981 1990 9 Charges Dismissed
John C. Skelton 1983 1990 7 Acquitted
Federico M. Macias 1984 1993 9 Charges Dismissed
Muneer Deeb 1985 1993 8 Acquitted
Ricardo Aldape Guerra 1982 1997 15 Charges Dismissed
Ernest Ray Willis 1987 2004 17 Charges Dismissed
Michael Blair 1994 2008 14 Charges Dismissed Yes
Michael Toney 1999 2009 10 Charges Dismissed
Robert Springsteen 2001 2009 8 Charges Dismissed
Anthony Graves 1994 2010 16 Charges Dismissed

I found this list here. I took out the names from other states. I tried lining up the year convicted, exonerated, years between, reason for release, and if DNA was involved, but it didn't work out so good. I thought there were more within the last 4 years that had been released due to DNA tests. Maybe this isn't a full list.
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/innocen ... -death-row
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby brainman » Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:58 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
brainman wrote:I'm generally all for the death penalty. But Koolaid, you do make an excellent point. I have no idea how to reconcile that, though.


12 non-governmental people make the decision. That's a big difference.

Chas.


12 non-governmental people who are guided by a court and a district attorney and generally listening to the testimony of law enforcement officers and government employees (lab-workers and such). By and large, those are all good people, but one can't deny that there are a lot of corrupt, stupid, and/or wrong-headed ones out there. And let's not forget that the intelligence of the average person (and thus the average juror) leaves a lot to be desired. Just look at how people voted in the last election. I don't want them judging me for anything, much less deciding on my (or anyone else's) death.

Recently, I read a posting on facebook of someone who was complaining about hard it is to be on a jury when you're hearing is bad. She said she couldn't hear anything anyone was saying and after asking the judge to have them repeat stuff several times and getting dirty looks, she decided just to stay quiet and "do her civic duty." Another person in the same set of postings, there was another woman who said she finds it so difficult to make the decision on guilt and affect someone's life. She said, "I watched what they said and I'm just not sure if he's guilty, but I followed everyone else." I know that's not a statistically significant sample, but that's two folks who completely missed the point of jury duty and I'm willing to bet there are a LOT more jurors out there just like them.

Having said that, I think I still believe in the death penalty. I just don't know how to reconcile koolaid's excellent point and what I just said with my opinion that the folks that deserve the death penalty definitely deserve the death penalty.
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Re: UPDATE: 11/14/12

Postby MeMelYup » Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:00 pm

Personally I don’t like the death penalty, but I think it is a necessary evil. It is a deterrent.
Several years ago, 3 inmates escaped from Huntsville or somewhere, and killed several people on their way to Oklahoma. They knew what they were doing and didn’t care. One of them made the comment “if I get out again I’ll kill another one.”
Last year (I think) a man in the New England area either killed someone or tried. After he was caught he made a statement that, “he checked to see which state had a death penalty so he would be sure not to do it there because he didn’t want to die.”
Then you have the Prosecutors.
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