Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby Liberty » Sun Jan 06, 2013 9:22 pm

Looks like we are going for the big brass ring on this one.
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Sun Jan 06, 2013 9:26 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:I will let people know the results when I get the data necessary to create an updated comparison for LEOs. I spoke with the person who processes Open Record Requests and she seems very helpful and eager to get the information to me timely.

Perhaps I should point out a couple of facts. First, no one should interpret my comments as indicating that the LEO community has a bad track record in terms of criminal convictions. That's not the case. Unless the updated data has changed dramatically, I expect to see that LEOs still have an excellent record, just as it was in 2007. I just point out that Texas CHLs have an even better record.

Secondly, I do not intend to publish the data because I know some intellectually dishonest people (a/k/a anti-gunners) will try to drive a wedge between the LEO community and gun owners by claiming we/I are/am attacking them by publishing data. I will give the overall ratios for LEOs.

Chas.


I have the results and the LEO record is still good and it hasn't changed much since the 2007 data. CHL's track record is 5 times better than LEO's.

Chas.
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby Heartland Patriot » Sun Jan 06, 2013 10:00 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Charles L. Cotton wrote:I will let people know the results when I get the data necessary to create an updated comparison for LEOs. I spoke with the person who processes Open Record Requests and she seems very helpful and eager to get the information to me timely.

Perhaps I should point out a couple of facts. First, no one should interpret my comments as indicating that the LEO community has a bad track record in terms of criminal convictions. That's not the case. Unless the updated data has changed dramatically, I expect to see that LEOs still have an excellent record, just as it was in 2007. I just point out that Texas CHLs have an even better record.

Secondly, I do not intend to publish the data because I know some intellectually dishonest people (a/k/a anti-gunners) will try to drive a wedge between the LEO community and gun owners by claiming we/I are/am attacking them by publishing data. I will give the overall ratios for LEOs.

Chas.


I have the results and the LEO record is still good and it hasn't changed much since the 2007 data. CHL's track record is 5 times better than LEO's.

Chas.


I see what goes there...and I like it. :thumbs2: :lol:
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby TxDrifter » Tue Jan 08, 2013 1:44 pm

C-dub wrote: I'm not sure how that would work with #5 since they don't allow anyone past the security checkpoint without a boarding pass and they are not going to allow me to fly with my concealed weapon.



Actually they do allow you past without a boarding pass if you are picking up/dropping off a minor and some other circumstances.
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby TxDrifter » Tue Jan 08, 2013 2:00 pm

TexasCajun wrote:I like it. Especially the idea of turning the question around -
The question should not be “why would you need a handgun,” it should be “is there a compelling reason to exclude handguns?”
I do have one question and one point to add.

The question: If there is already a prohibition against being intoxicated while carrying concealed, why continue to exclued concealed carry in 51% establishments?

And my one point: Requiring a CHL holder to disarm before entering a prohibited place actually creates more of a public safety issue. When my gun is holstered & concealed, the chance of a negligent discharge is virtually non-existant. However, when I have to unconceal and unholster my weapon to put it in secure storage, the risk of a negligent discharge goes up significantly due to the very nature of having to handle the weapon. Then re-arming after leaving the prohibited place again increases the ND risk. In these circumstances the ND risk is even higher because the weapon-handling is usually taking place in cramped & seated position within a car. Even re-holstering a micro-compact 9mm pistol IWB puts the CHL'er in an awkward, contorting position.


Not to mention some of those places are a feeding trough for those that want to burglarize vehicles. If we go out it is usually to go dancing, karaoke, or listen to live bands. I would much rather have it with me to be sure that trip to and from the car is also not "unprotected". I have a console safe in my vehicle, an alarm and the plates in the doors to prevent as much as I can, but: "A lock is only good enough to keep an honest man out" We also ride motorcycles and frequent places that are 51% that we only are stopping to grab lunch or visit or meet others on a group ride. Securing it on a motorcycle is a royal pain. We hardly ever drink and if we do it is to get one and "nurse" it to not appear unsociable.

I definitely would like to see the sporting event part removed because we go to the Rodeo every year and I hate having to disarm and take that march "cross country" or ride the train from other parking options to get to the stadium and back to my vehicle whilst leaving it there. Late at night coming back is not a comforting walk.
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby dac1842 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:16 pm

Charles,
One area that needs to get addressed are the conflicting laws related to a when a CHL can carry ,but not if acting as a private investigator. I am a licensed investigator, I am a CHL holder, I cannot legally carry as PI.. makes no sense since the requirements are essentially the same..
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby texanjoker » Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:40 pm

dac1842 wrote:Charles,
One area that needs to get addressed are the conflicting laws related to a when a CHL can carry ,but not if acting as a private investigator. I am a licensed investigator, I am a CHL holder, I cannot legally carry as PI.. makes no sense since the requirements are essentially the same..


Actually a licensed PI can carry with a CHL. You just have to have the liability insurance. There is another thread going where I posted the DPS info for somebody.
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby texasmike » Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:28 pm

Charles, under this proposal, would state court security mirror security at the capital, i.e., one line for CHL holders and a separate line for everyone else? Would CHL-holding attorneys actually be permitted to carry in state courts?
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:15 pm

texasmike wrote:Charles, under this proposal, would state court security mirror security at the capital, i.e., one line for CHL holders and a separate line for everyone else? Would CHL-holding attorneys actually be permitted to carry in state courts?


That's not addressed in the proposed bill. That's an operational issue. In Harris County, people with a Frequent Courthouse Visitor badge simply holds that up and walks around the metal detectors. LEOs show their ID or badges, so I suspect Harris County would do the same for CHL's.

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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby RHenriksen » Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:22 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:That's not addressed in the proposed bill. That's an operational issue. In Harris County, people with a Frequent Courthouse Visitor badge simply holds that up and walks around the metal detectors. LEOs show their ID or badges, so I suspect Harris County would do the same for CHL's.

Chas.


Interesting... I'm curious (confused) if you mean Harris County courts would do the same *if* this bill is passed, or already might be doing so?
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:24 pm

RHenriksen wrote:
Charles L. Cotton wrote:That's not addressed in the proposed bill. That's an operational issue. In Harris County, people with a Frequent Courthouse Visitor badge simply holds that up and walks around the metal detectors. LEOs show their ID or badges, so I suspect Harris County would do the same for CHL's.

Chas.


Interesting... I'm curious (confused) if you mean Harris County courts would do the same *if* this bill is passed, or already might be doing so?


I'm guessing that, if the bill were to pass and CHLs could carry in courthouses, Harris County would maintain the current system and CHLs would show their license and walk around the metal detectors.

Chas.
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby RHenriksen » Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:27 pm

That would be a beautiful thing... the status quo where we can roam freely in the Capitol, but not a courthouse, seems rather upside down.


Charles L. Cotton wrote:
RHenriksen wrote:
Charles L. Cotton wrote:That's not addressed in the proposed bill. That's an operational issue. In Harris County, people with a Frequent Courthouse Visitor badge simply holds that up and walks around the metal detectors. LEOs show their ID or badges, so I suspect Harris County would do the same for CHL's.

Chas.


Interesting... I'm curious (confused) if you mean Harris County courts would do the same *if* this bill is passed, or already might be doing so?


I'm guessing that, if the bill were to pass and CHLs could carry in courthouses, Harris County would maintain the current system and CHLs would show their license and walk around the metal detectors.

Chas.
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby Wes » Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:30 pm

That is great to hear about the leo/chl, I just hope it helps to inform people that those they seek to restrict are not the problem. Alas, this is always the problem and will most likely be an uphill battle. The good guys get punished more than the bad some times. I really hope legislation moves forward for reducing the no gun zones as it is frustrating to disarm and feel open to those who ignore the laws anyways. Schools are the biggest it would seem, but none are realistic except bars IMO and I agree there is no reason to remove them.
Last edited by Wes on Wed Jan 09, 2013 5:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:36 pm

I want to point out that the Senator who has had my bill for several weeks now has not filed it. I'm not happy.

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Re: Reduce Off-Limits Areas for Texas CHL’s

Postby RHenriksen » Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:43 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:I want to point out that the Senator who has had my bill for several weeks now has not filed it. I'm not happy.

Chas.


I hate to hear this. I hope you have options, like pulling it from him & getting an alternate author/sponsor?
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