Cell phones and driving?

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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby E.Marquez » Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:19 pm

Songbird wrote:It's been made law in Amarillo. Signs are up and they will begin issuing citations in January. No handheld devices at all allowed.


Is a cigarette a hand held device? How about cup of coffee? or Soda? Sandwich?

My problem with these feel good laws?
1:They make no difference, ,,ie do not work.
2: We already have state laws that deal with driving distracted.
Already on the books for TX
Ban on all cell phone (handheld and Hands-free) for bus drivers (Primary law)
Ban on all cell phone (handheld and Hands-free) for novice drivers (Primary law)
Ban on texting for novice drivers (Primary law)
Ban on texting for bus drivers (Primary law)
Texas has banned the use of hand-held phones and texting in school zones
Note: In Texas bus driver laws pertain to bus drivers with passengers age 17 and under.
Novice drivers are defined as all drivers at the intermediate stage, first 12 months.

Local stuff as well.
At least these city's already have distracted driving laws... Drive in ANY ONE of them, and tell me the LAW is working... :thumbs2:

Dallas, San Antonio, Austin, Amarillo, Galveston, El Paso, Missouri City and Stephenville have
enacted local distracted driving laws. Although these cities are the only ones who have laws against
distracted driving, all Texans should aim to reduce distractions while driving.
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby gringo pistolero » Tue Dec 25, 2012 2:31 pm

Oldgringo wrote:Suits me!

If they're talking/texting on the cell phone when driving AND smoking at the same time, they should have their licenses revoked....for openers.

I don't know what this driver was doing but revoked license sounds like a good start.
http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/20405227/ ... uck-by-car
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby Jim Beaux » Tue Dec 25, 2012 3:22 pm

I very seldom use my cell phone while driving & I get mad enough to seriously hurt the jerks that force me to take extreme measures to avoid being killed by them.

Our world was once a better place when we relied on personal responsibility and consequences for our actions. Now the mindset is, if it isnt against the law we can do it.

There are so many laws on the books that no one knows them. I dont remember the source but I read last year that on Jan. 1, 2011, 40,000 new laws would take affect. That averages to about 800 NEW LAWS per state. Just how many laws that are presently on the books do you know? How many have you unknowingly violated?

I couldnt take my g-kids to see the Christmas lights because letting them ride in the back of the truck was illegal. If we had been hit by a drunk while doing so, I could have been sent to prison.

These laws intrude daily on our personal lives. We have to understand that the term: "there ought to be a law", actually means, "there ought to be more bureaucracy in our lives".

I advocate a new law: pass a law, delete a law.

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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby Moby » Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:01 pm

I'm a little surprised to see such harshness with more laws on this forum.
I do agree texting and driving is a bad thing. I do think it should be a ticketable offense.
But on par with drunk driving? A bit much! In my opinion. I agree all hand held devices
should be bluetoothed to be used while driving. But arrest people? I don't think so.
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby Oldgringo » Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:05 pm

gringo pistolero wrote:
Oldgringo wrote:Suits me!

If they're talking/texting on the cell phone when driving AND smoking at the same time, they should have their licenses revoked....for openers.

I don't know what this driver was doing but revoked license sounds like a good start.
http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/20405227/ ... uck-by-car


I wasn't there, but have y'all noticed that every kid you see and many adults walk around, oblivious to their surroundings, with their face in their little electric gizmo. Just sayin'....
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby srothstein » Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:39 pm

gringo pistolero wrote:
Oldgringo wrote:Suits me!

If they're talking/texting on the cell phone when driving AND smoking at the same time, they should have their licenses revoked....for openers.

I don't know what this driver was doing but revoked license sounds like a good start.
http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/20405227/ ... uck-by-car


Have you noticed that this is not quite what it sounds like at first? This is not a little kid who was hit when they got off the bus, but a teenager who should know how to cross a street by now. Also, it was not someone who stepped off a bus and got hit, but someone who steeped off a bus and went around the bus to cross the street. If the person had stepped off the bus and got hit, the car would have been passing the bus on the right side, not the driving side. I hate inaccurate reporting.

But I have a simple solution, though most people will not agree with it. There is no real problem with someone who id driving while distracted UNTIL they have an accident. If they don't hit someone or something, who really cares or know how much attention they were paying to their driving. Same for speeding, ignoring stop signs, etc.

So, we remove all punishments from all traffic offenses that do not result in an accident. Make the laws there just to establish who has the right of way. Then, if you violate one of the laws in such a manner as to cause or contribute to an accident, you get punished in accordance with the damage and injury done. A minor accident could be a class C ticket, more damage could be a class B or A. Minor injury could be a third degree felony and serious injury could be a first degree felony.

This is just applying the principles of our assault and criminal mischief laws to traffic laws. It frees up police patrol resources since they would not do traffic patrol and traffic stops anymore. There would be more time involved in accident investigation since some cities don't even come to the scene if there are no injuries and this would require it. But it would mean people would have to learn to drive. A simple phone call while you are driving could result in real jail time. That would make people start to pay attention.

Of course, if we start to make traffic laws about safety instead of revenue, it would be a real change in our society. Until then, I don't think we need more laws for people to ignore, especially if the laws don't work. It is not the hand-held device, but the attention paid to the phone call that is the problem. And I fully admit that the same problem exists when talking to others int he car, eating, reading, putting on make up, shaving, or a bunch opf other things I have seen people do while driving.
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby SewTexas » Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:21 pm

there are laws in several of the areas I drive in...and guess what? I still see people talking and texting ...and the cops just drive right on by while the person just weaves in their lane and tries to kill me??? :shock: we don't need more laws! we need to teach responsibility!
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby apostate » Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:54 pm

srothstein wrote:
http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/20405227/teen-steps-off-bus-struck-by-car


Have you noticed that this is not quite what it sounds like at first? This is not a little kid who was hit when they got off the bus, but a teenager who should know how to cross a street by now.

Granted a teen should know how to cross the street (which begs the question why high schools have reduced speed school zones) but someone operating a motor vehicle should also know to stop for a school bus discharging passengers. Texas Transportation Code 545.066 says it's, "a Class A misdemeanor if the person causes serious bodily injury to another."
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby RX8er » Wed Dec 26, 2012 12:46 am

IMHO, more laws are not going to fix the problem unless you make it so expensive. Make the ticket cost based on income level (as done in many European countries) and you may get somewhere. Maybe I am wrong but I think that those that think they can talk/text while they drive will continue to do so law or not. It's the same thing for speed limits. There are studies that show slower speeds save lives but do we still speed even though there is a law for it?

Are there any Europeans here or someone that has lived there for a while? In many countries, Drivers Ed is a very long class period and is a privilege to drive, not a right. Driving is treated way different than here in the US where we feel that it is a right. I remember several (read that as about 15 years) years ago talking to a BMW designer and asking him why they didn't put cup holders in their cars. He looked at me and said that "A car is for driving and not eating or drinking" in and kind of scoffed at the idea that us Americans would want to do something else, other than drive.

SewTexas wrote:.....we don't need more laws! we need to teach responsibility!

:iagree:

I am a libertarian by heart in that I think that there is WAY TOO much government in my life as it is now. I don't want more laws or need to hire more people to cover some new law.
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby Abraham » Wed Dec 26, 2012 9:49 am

srothstein,

Your idea is brilliant!

Bravo!

As for invoking another country's approach as a traffic exemplar for the U.S., no thanks.

I'm not being xenophobic when I say Europe is not a model of how we in the U.S. should conduct ourselves, though I appreciate some revere their every move.
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Wed Dec 26, 2012 9:57 am

sjfcontrol wrote:We need to be repealing "nanny laws", not making more of them.


:iagree:

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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby E.Marquez » Wed Dec 26, 2012 10:09 am

srothstein wrote:Have you noticed that this is not quite what it sounds like at first? This is not a little kid who was hit when they got off the bus, but a teenager who should know how to cross a street by now. Also, it was not someone who stepped off a bus and got hit, but someone who steeped off a bus and went around the bus to cross the street. If the person had stepped off the bus and got hit, the car would have been passing the bus on the right side, not the driving side. I hate inaccurate reporting.


The Driver was at fault. No question, as the car did not fail to stop and drive itself past a bus all by itself.

The Kid was a fault for being lulled into a false sense of safety.. Yes state law says NO ONE should be passing a stopped bus,,,, but it happnes all the time.. he failed to ensure his own safety, and paid a price.

srothstein wrote:But I have a simple solution, though most people will not agree with it. There is no real problem with someone who id driving while distracted UNTIL they have an accident. If they don't hit someone or something, who really cares or know how much attention they were paying to their driving. Same for speeding, ignoring stop signs, etc.


Your right, I disagree..

So as long as someone driving distracted does not crash and or kill me,, No harm no foul? SO if I have to evasively maneuver, putting my self and or others at great risk to avoid that distracted driver while they are texting and driving,, Thats ok? I mean no one crashed ... I fail to see who that is an acceptable solution.. :headscratch

Dump the driving while talking, texting, eatting a BigMac laws.. and call it what it is, distracted driving.

You cause me to panic stop while you blow a stop sign texting your new BFF update on facebook ..You get pulled over and have your license shredded on site, car impounded, and walk home.

When you drop you McFatty burger in your lap, yank the steering wheel to the left and force me into the median on my bike...... You get pulled over and have your license shredded on site, car impounded, and walk home.

You cause an accident while surfing , messaging on the Mobile Computer Terminal... You get pulled over (or wait for the shift supervisor to come meet you at the scene) and have your license shredded on site, car impounded, and be arrested on SITE
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Wed Dec 26, 2012 10:19 am

cyphur wrote:
sjfcontrol wrote:How is a cell-phone ban any different from a weapons ban? Both punish the innocent, while there are already laws on the books to punish the guilty.

We need to be repealing "nanny laws", not making more of them.


Most people do not clean their firearms while driving in busy traffic.

Studies already show using a cell phone while texting is worse than drunk driving. Please show me the laws on the book that treats driving with a cell phone the same as a DUI.

There are no such studies, in spite of claims by the NTSB and the insurance industry. It would be impossible to conduct such an investigation truly as a "study." People use the term "study" incorrectly all the time. At the most, someone might be able to investigate enough auto accidents for many many years (not 1 or 2) and then they might be able to show a correlation, but not causation.

In theory, I don't have a problem with a law against texting while driving, but that's impossible to enforce. What's the difference between dialing a phone and testing, when viewed from an officer's standpoint? Nothing, they can't tell the difference.

The NTSB has now issued a report claiming that all forms of distracted driving should be outlawed. They are demanding that the feds and states enact laws that criminalize or create civil fines for any act within a motor vehicle that is not directly related to the task of driving. What crap!! I presume this means you can't eat or drink a Coke while driving. I feel certain they claim a radio is distracting, as are talking passengers. If we buy into this "distracted driving" garbage, then there's no end to the limitations we'll see coming down the road.

I don't oppose such laws "just for the sake of it;" I oppose them because they are unnecessary, ineffective and yet one more way for elected officials to impose their personal preferences on citizens.

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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby E.Marquez » Wed Dec 26, 2012 10:30 am

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
The NTSB has now issued a report claiming that all forms of distracted driving should be outlawed. They are demanding that the feds and states enact laws that criminalize or create civil fines for any act within a motor vehicle that is not directly related to the task of driving. What crap!! I presume this means you can't eat or drink a Coke while driving. I feel certain they claim a radio is distracting, as are talking passengers. If we buy into this "distracted driving" garbage, then there's no end to the limitations we'll see coming down the road.

I don't oppose such laws "just for the sake of it;" I oppose them because they are unnecessary, ineffective and yet one more way for elected officials to impose their personal preferences on citizens.

Chas.


Chas, then how does one effect and mitigate those that are a menace to other drivers, due to, well I know you dislike the term, but "Distracted driving"?
Only punishing after they have wreck, maimed or killed someone? Seems a little reactive..

I as well would not like to be told (punished) for inserting a CD when it DID NOT cause me to come out of lane, impede another driver or cause an accident. But I do want the driver that can not control the vehicle they are driving FOR WHAT EVER REASON .. talking, texting, calling, eatting,, to have his actions rebuked, and punished.. even if it does not cause an accident.

Perhaps there are enough statutes, laws on the books now for a LEO, ADA, Judge to charge and convict a person for these things.. I DONT KNOW :headscratch If so, them Im ok with doing away with ALL specific forms of law that deal with distracted driving.
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Re: Cell phones and driving?

Postby Abraham » Wed Dec 26, 2012 10:37 am

Yes, we all have very strong opinions regarding distracted driving, with texting while driving leading the pack and cell phone blabbing taking a solid second place.

Opinions vary on what to do about this newest driving distraction, but in the past I heard little in the way of the general public expressing a strong outcry against other distractions such as: driving while eating, tuning the radio, etc. Such distractions simply didn't loom large as a general public outrage.

Cell phone use while driving does...

So, for all you cell phone usage while driving apologists - why do you think this is so?
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