This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby anygunanywhere » Thu Nov 08, 2012 8:20 am

TexasCajun wrote: He's going to have to reach across the aisle in order to get anything done.


:smilelol5: :smilelol5:

Like that is going to happen.

All he has to do is pen another executive order and his orks will lock step and do his bidding.

The infected pustule has no intentions of doing anything by the constitution.

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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby AJHutton » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:23 am

Charles L. Cotton wrote:I'm a life-long conservative, death penalty-supporting, white Republican and every day that passes I become more of a minority.

Here are the hard cold facts. Obama won, the Democrats pickup seats in the Senate and in the House, and Romney got about all of the white vote possible. If the Republicans couldn't unseat an absolute failure like Obama, and couldn't gain seats in the Senate, then we had better take a hard, cold look at what we are doing wrong.

The Republican Party better start appealing to Hispanics with whom we have a lot in common, or we will not see a Republican in the White House again. We will also see the Democrats take the House and increase their margin in the Senate. Bush won by the slimmest of margins (lost one popular vote) and he was more popular with Hispanics than any Republican candidate in years. If Republicans concede the rapidly growing Hispanic population to the Democrats, then all of us conservatives will simply have to sit back, complain, and reminisce about the "good old days."

If the Republicans had come up with some form of immigration reform, then we would have taken a much larger percentage of the Hispanic vote. White Republicans and Hispanics share a strong family values ethic and we are natural allies. Letting the immigration issue drive them to the Democratic Party is political suicide.

I know some will argue that conservatives didn't go to the polls for Romney, but that's not the case and that's not why we lost. The sad truth is this: conservatives are in the minority and this is happening at an accelerating rate. The only way to revive conservationism is to attract Hispanics and appeal to all educated young people with a message that resonates with them and doesn't simply sound like bitter old white guys.

I know many of our Members aren't going to like this post. Heck, I don't like it myself, but these are the facts and the ostrich approach never works.

Chas.


+1 for this. The climate was ripe for Republicans to get the Hispanic vote too - the President did nothing special to earn that community's vote... in fact he broke his promises to them and they STILL voted for him. Of course, that was kind of the story in general for the nation, wasn't it. Chas is right, Romney maxed out the white vote and it's just not enough any more. The Republicans better take these next few years to start addressing that fact.
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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby anygunanywhere » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:35 am

AJHutton wrote:
Charles L. Cotton wrote:I'm a life-long conservative, death penalty-supporting, white Republican and every day that passes I become more of a minority.

Here are the hard cold facts. Obama won, the Democrats pickup seats in the Senate and in the House, and Romney got about all of the white vote possible. If the Republicans couldn't unseat an absolute failure like Obama, and couldn't gain seats in the Senate, then we had better take a hard, cold look at what we are doing wrong.

The Republican Party better start appealing to Hispanics with whom we have a lot in common, or we will not see a Republican in the White House again. We will also see the Democrats take the House and increase their margin in the Senate. Bush won by the slimmest of margins (lost one popular vote) and he was more popular with Hispanics than any Republican candidate in years. If Republicans concede the rapidly growing Hispanic population to the Democrats, then all of us conservatives will simply have to sit back, complain, and reminisce about the "good old days."

If the Republicans had come up with some form of immigration reform, then we would have taken a much larger percentage of the Hispanic vote. White Republicans and Hispanics share a strong family values ethic and we are natural allies. Letting the immigration issue drive them to the Democratic Party is political suicide.

I know some will argue that conservatives didn't go to the polls for Romney, but that's not the case and that's not why we lost. The sad truth is this: conservatives are in the minority and this is happening at an accelerating rate. The only way to revive conservationism is to attract Hispanics and appeal to all educated young people with a message that resonates with them and doesn't simply sound like bitter old white guys.

I know many of our Members aren't going to like this post. Heck, I don't like it myself, but these are the facts and the ostrich approach never works.

Chas.


+1 for this. The climate was ripe for Republicans to get the Hispanic vote too - the President did nothing special to earn that community's vote... in fact he broke his promises to them and they STILL voted for him. Of course, that was kind of the story in general for the nation, wasn't it. Chas is right, Romney maxed out the white vote and it's just not enough any more. The Republicans better take these next few years to start addressing that fact.


This maybe partially true, but unless the GOP combines immigration reform with more continued free stuff we will not garner any of the illegal immigrant vote.

Of course immigration reform is tantamount to lots of free stuff anyway so my post is full of redundancies.

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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby TexasCajun » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:57 am

So what is the answer? What do we DO about the current situation? Let's see some solution on here. I'm not of a mind to simply curl up in a corner & hope things get better (or worse, hope things don't go further downhill). I'm willing to take action, just point me in the right direction. I didn't start this thread so that we could sit around & mope about how unfair things are. My original intent was to try to take a step back out of the frustration & feeling of loss in order to begin moving forward.
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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby VMI77 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:37 am

baldeagle wrote:
TexasCajun wrote:
baldeagle wrote:Anyone who thinks Obama gives a hoot about getting along or about helping the United States is deluding themselves. Obama's goal is and always has been to destroy this country, and he was well on his way before being re-elected. What's about to happen will shock those who haven't been paying attention or haven't sought out the truth.

The 1st and 2nd Amendments will be the first to go. The rest is just a matter of time.


Then stand up & fight for it not to be so BEFORE it happens. I believe that Obama's self-interest will move him to try to cooperate. He wants a legacy & he won't leave the rest of the Dems out to dry. The trick for us is to not let him get any momentum.

Your beliefs don't match his actions. The mistake far too many people make is to listen to men's words. What they do tells you who they are. Obama has no interest in a legacy or in helping the Dems. This election was the watershed. His "advisors" are already planning his third term. (The second was planned a long time ago.) It's over. America is over. The Constitutional Republic of our Founders no longer exists.

How are you going to fight? The Senate will stop anything the House tries to do to preserve our rights, and Obama is already on record saying he won't need Congress in his second term. He's already (unconstitutionally) used his office to grant amnesty and shut down the coal industry. What makes you think he won't start enforcing gun control without the "help" of Congress? When the kerfluffle about the UN monitoring Texas elections came up, Obama actually said that Texas had no right to stop the UN poll watchers. What more do you need to know to understand he doesn't care about legacies, political compromise or America? And the media will lie for him every step of the way to keep the sheep in the dark until the shackles are locked.

It isn't giving up to face reality. When you're so grossly outnumbered that you have no chance of winning, you have two choices; stand, fight and die or run and hide and look for another day to fight.


Yep. It's only a question of when now, not if.
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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby VMI77 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:42 am

TexasCajun wrote:So what is the answer? What do we DO about the current situation? Let's see some solution on here. I'm not of a mind to simply curl up in a corner & hope things get better (or worse, hope things don't go further downhill). I'm willing to take action, just point me in the right direction. I didn't start this thread so that we could sit around & mope about how unfair things are. My original intent was to try to take a step back out of the frustration & feeling of loss in order to begin moving forward.


There isn't all that much you can do now but prepare for when conditions make it possible to respond. Not enough people can see what's coming: they have to FEEL the pain first. Rhetoric isn't going to convince anyone who doesn't get it by this point --only the coming stark reality will change minds. Personally, I think our only hope will ultimately be the only institution not totally corrupted by liberal ideology: the US military. Remember, the nails sticking up are the ones that get hammered.
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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby VMI77 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:46 am

Jim Beaux wrote:It's not the minorities, it's not the gays, it's not the give-aways, it's the press; and without an honest press the election process will never be representative. The MSM has become one big propaganda machine.


It's the schools AND the press --and they produce the attitudes that encourages entitlement.
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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby VMI77 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:48 am

TexasCajun wrote:If he had won by an overwhelming majority, I'd be inclined to believe as you do baldeagle. But the fact that about half of the voting public disagrees with him leads me to believe that he'll re-evaluate any plans to railroad his agenda. And even if he doesn't, he can't arbitrarily void the US Constitution and set up his own monarchy. It would have to be a process. And in being so, we, as conciencious citizens can act to prevent the further erosion of our rights. Though the cause may be a bit more difficult than we thought it would be before yesterday, it's far from lost.

Do as you may. But I intend to fight for what I believe may be taken from us if we just lay down and let them. Unfortunately I won't be able to do it alone - but I won't let that deter me either. If we stand together & speak with a unified voice, they won't be able to ignore us.


How can you say that? He already voided the Constitution with the support of both parties: it's called the NDAA. But hey, he won't use those powers, he "promised."
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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby VMI77 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:51 am

philip964 wrote:Imagine if the dems had control of the house right now.

Obama won the popular vote in Houston where I live.

We are a red state.

Romney did not get as many votes as McCain. I waited in line 2 hours to vote.

Rush has an interesting article today. It essentially said you can't win against Santa Claus. http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2012/ ... claus_wins He said Romney ran a campaign endorsing success through hard work. The American Dream, but its not that America anymore, we are outnumbered.

A friend told me today, "we are old it will not really make a difference to us, but for our grandchildren this is a pivotal change."

I can see the mid terms now. "Give Obama a Democratic house so he can achieve the plans America deserves"

After that there will be an assault weapons ban at a minimum.


I disagree with your friend...except for those of us who are very old, we'll all be aboard when the ship goes down.
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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby VMI77 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:53 am

Heartland Patriot wrote:
philip964 wrote:Imagine if the dems had control of the house right now.

Obama won the popular vote in Houston where I live.

We are a red state.

Romney did not get as many votes as McCain. I waited in line 2 hours to vote.

Rush has an interesting article today. It essentially said you can't win against Santa Claus. http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2012/ ... claus_wins He said Romney ran a campaign endorsing success through hard work. The American Dream, but its not that America anymore, we are outnumbered.

A friend told me today, "we are old it will not really make a difference to us, but for our grandchildren this is a pivotal change."

I can see the mid terms now. "Give Obama a Democratic house so he can achieve the plans America deserves"

After that there will be an assault weapons ban at a minimum.


I know there are folks on here who don't care for Rush Limbaugh's style. They have bad things to say about him. That doesn't bother me because I believe he hit the nail on the head. BHO is the "Socialist Santa Claus", giving out "free stuff" to those who support him...it wasn't simply about the color of skin, no minority conservative could have won that race. Only someone promising lots of "free stuff" could have pulled it off.


I don't like Rush, but when he's right, he's right. And on this, he's right. But it didn't happen overnight....it took decades of indoctrination in the public schools and unrelenting media propaganda advocating the entitlement State.
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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:53 am

TexasCajun wrote:So what is the answer? What do we DO about the current situation? Let's see some solution on here. I'm not of a mind to simply curl up in a corner & hope things get better (or worse, hope things don't go further downhill). I'm willing to take action, just point me in the right direction. I didn't start this thread so that we could sit around & mope about how unfair things are. My original intent was to try to take a step back out of the frustration & feeling of loss in order to begin moving forward.


You are absolutely right; we must do something or accept the United States as a 3rd world country with ever-dwindling constitutional rights!

Immigration reform is absolutely the key to getting Hispanics to join the Republican Party and/or vote for Republican candidates. Such reform doesn't have to mean "fee stuff" anymore than being an American citizen means I get "free stuff." Free healthcare is a separate issue and now it's tied directly to Obamacare that's not going away for at least four years, if ever.

As noted in my first post, I'm a life-long conservative and until very recently, I've said what most other conservatives say, "if you are caught illegally in this country, you should be deported on your first offense and jailed on subsequent offenses. Ignoring illegal immigration is unfair to American citizens and to aliens to follow the law and come to this country legally." I still feel this way, but the reality is clear, we either compromise on this issue or lose everything. I know some conservatives feel "compromise" is a dirty word, but that's absurd. We compromise every day with our family, friends, co-workers and many other groups. We'd better do so in the political arena, or we'll be like two old Brits in a pub talking about the glory days when the sun never set on the British Empire.

As for specifics, if I were crowned king tomorrow, here's what I'd do about immigration:

    1. Establish a guest worker program for Mexican nationals (not other countries) that is not the same as a work visa;
    2. People must have a verifiable, written job offer to apply for a guest worker permit;
    3. If you are illegally in the country and have a job in the U.S., you can submit the required paperwork without leaving the country;
    4. If you are illegally in the U.S., do not have a job, then you must leave and follow procedures;
    5. U.S. Dept. of Labor or the Border Patrol maintain a database of jobs available (voluntarily submitted by employers) for which Mexican nationals can apply;
      a. If the jobs are temporary or short term, the guest worker permit will have an expiration date;
      b. If an employee quits or is fired, the employer must notify the U.S. Border Patrol and the guest worker permit would be revoked;
    6. Children of illegal aliens and guest worker permit holders born on U.S. soil would not be American citizens, but they would be eligible for resident alien "Green Card" status upon reaching the age of majority, if they 1) do not have a criminal history; and 2) graduated from high school (not GED).
    7. After a 12 month amnesty period, anyone found illegally in the U.S. will be deported and cannot apply for a guest worker permit for five years;
    8. Provisions for the commission of crimes by guest workers would have to be established, including impact on family members in the U.S.

Obviously, this is just an off-the-cuff plan and much more detail would have to be developed. Such a program would give Hispanics in the U.S. a way for their relatives to legally come to this country and that is key.

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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby VMI77 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:57 am

Charles L. Cotton wrote: The only way to revive conservationism is to attract Hispanics and appeal to all educated young people with a message that resonates with them and doesn't simply sound like bitter old white guys.

I know many of our Members aren't going to like this post. Heck, I don't like it myself, but these are the facts and the ostrich approach never works.

Chas.


That's not going to happen without regaining control of the school system and eliminating liberal media dominance. The school system and media have produced several generations of collectivists and it looks like they're finally reaching critical mass.
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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:18 pm

VMI77 wrote:
Charles L. Cotton wrote: The only way to revive conservationism is to attract Hispanics and appeal to all educated young people with a message that resonates with them and doesn't simply sound like bitter old white guys.

I know many of our Members aren't going to like this post. Heck, I don't like it myself, but these are the facts and the ostrich approach never works.

Chas.


That's not going to happen without regaining control of the school system and eliminating liberal media dominance. The school system and media have produced several generations of collectivists and it looks like they're finally reaching critical mass.


I agree about the school system, so get out and do something! Run for the school board or help find, then support and campaign for good candidates.

The media is not a problem no matter how we like to make that claim. Yes, the mainstream media is ultra-liberal and pro-Democrat, but their sphere of influence is small and it's shrinking. No one cares what the talking heads at NBS, CBS and ABC say. That's why Fox News is killing them. Far more people stay informed by reading Internet media outlets. The Hurst Corporation is in big trouble as its newspapers throughout the nation are seeing subscription rates plummet and advertising revenue are following.

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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby anygunanywhere » Thu Nov 08, 2012 12:58 pm

The reason hispanics vote democrat is not because they like the dem approach to immigration.

Unions no longer are pushing immigration reform and are now in full support of the hispanics.

The reason is that hispanics support big government and free stuff.

Did you know that in Mexico, none of the Catholic churches are owned by the Church? They are all owned by the Mexican government. All Catholic priests are paid by the Mexican government. Mexicans do not contribute to the Church.

The parish I belong to has a large Mexican membership. They contribute literally pennies toward the Church. Our pastor actually released (fired) the Hispanic deacon who ministered to the Mexicans becasue they contributed nothing to support the Church. He flat out told them that if they could not support the Church, which is a tenet of the church, they would suffer the consequences.

No money, no deacon.

Big government, free stuff.

Immigration reform will not do anything to move them to our side.

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Re: This Ain't Over Til We Say It's Over

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Thu Nov 08, 2012 1:02 pm

anygunanywhere wrote:The reason hispanics vote democrat is not because they like the dem approach to immigration.

. . .

Immigration reform will not do anything to move them to our side.

Anygunanywhere


This is flat wrong and every political policy expert agrees. This is your opinion and it's wrong.

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