Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

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TXBO
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby TXBO » Mon Aug 15, 2016 10:39 am

Jusme wrote:We have won a lot of elections, but, we haven't completely won the hearts and minds of those who still have to fear a left leaning constituency. Even among some of the most staunch conservative members, there is still a lingering .... call it doubt, fear, old school thinking, whatever, that still sees LTC holders as a fringe portion of society. The last session with "in your face" demonstrations, by those who shall not be named, has not helped to sway those attitudes. We have consistently demonstrated our good intentions, good will, and good behavior over the past 20+ years, but old ideas die hard.
Couple that with the fact, that while these things matter to LTC holders, we only represent a small portion of the population. So even other gun owners, who are not LTC holders, aren't greatly concerned about carry restrictions.

So what happens, when more legislation is proposed to "free up" LTC holders, the response is, "What do they want now?' These battles are not won easily, and must be approached with an understanding of the opposition, even if it is a passive opposition. JMHO


You've outlined one of the two main reasons that doing things to increase the number of LTC holders should be a priority.

1) More LTC holders have more political clout.
2) More LTC holders make Texas a safer place.

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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby Jusme » Mon Aug 15, 2016 10:53 am

TXBO wrote:
Jusme wrote:We have won a lot of elections, but, we haven't completely won the hearts and minds of those who still have to fear a left leaning constituency. Even among some of the most staunch conservative members, there is still a lingering .... call it doubt, fear, old school thinking, whatever, that still sees LTC holders as a fringe portion of society. The last session with "in your face" demonstrations, by those who shall not be named, has not helped to sway those attitudes. We have consistently demonstrated our good intentions, good will, and good behavior over the past 20+ years, but old ideas die hard.
Couple that with the fact, that while these things matter to LTC holders, we only represent a small portion of the population. So even other gun owners, who are not LTC holders, aren't greatly concerned about carry restrictions.

So what happens, when more legislation is proposed to "free up" LTC holders, the response is, "What do they want now?' These battles are not won easily, and must be approached with an understanding of the opposition, even if it is a passive opposition. JMHO


You've outlined one of the two main reasons that doing things to increase the number of LTC holders should be a priority.

1) More LTC holders have more political clout.
2) More LTC holders make Texas a safer place.



I fully agree, I'm doing my part, Mrs. Jusme has agreed to take the class this fall. :mrgreen:

And I think there may need to be a push to better educate everyone, both those who are considering it, and the opposition, so that they understand exactly what is required, to be come an LTC holder, and to further demonstrate our record as law abiding, cool under pressure, and how much of an asset we are to to the law abiding public. Not necessarily as acting security guards, but those who may be willing to step up when needed.
So many people either don't become LTC holders, or become opposed to the idea, not because of anyone's actions, but because of misinformation.
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby TXBO » Mon Aug 15, 2016 12:15 pm

Jusme wrote: I fully agree, I'm doing my part, Mrs. Jusme has agreed to take the class this fall. :mrgreen:


Great. Women and minorities both fast growing segments that are becoming LTC members. They also are a target demographic needed at the polls.

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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby TexasTornado » Mon Aug 15, 2016 12:22 pm

I'd be curious as to the % of registered voters amongst LTC holders as compared to the general public. We might be a numerically small minority, but I'd wager we aren't as small of a minority at the polls.
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby Jusme » Mon Aug 15, 2016 1:01 pm

TexasTornado wrote:I'd be curious as to the % of registered voters amongst LTC holders as compared to the general public. We might be a numerically small minority, but I'd wager we aren't as small of a minority at the polls.



I don't know if those stats are available, but I would imagine that not only do we register to vote, but we actually do vote. I think that is one of the reasons, we have won so many seats in the Texas Senate and House. Unfortunately, in large urban areas, the left still manages a decent turnout, like Houston, Dallas, etc. so there are still a lot of dissenting voices to contend with, who have some influence, not only in voters, but business owners, who rely on the labor force in those areas. And as I stated, even our best allies, in office, have to bow to those who don't feel that 2A is #1 priority, every session. There are a lot of issues that have to be decided each session, and so not all of our LTC concerns get the attention we would like.
That's not to say that we don''t continue to write, call, and email our representatives, help campaign against those who are in opposition, or do anything different than we have been doing. We can't let our guard down, or underestimate our opposition.
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby Liberty » Mon Aug 15, 2016 1:15 pm

TexasTornado wrote:I'd be curious as to the % of registered voters amongst LTC holders as compared to the general public. We might be a numerically small minority, but I'd wager we aren't as small of a minority at the polls.

I'm sure it's pretty high, which is one reason why the NRA is so influential that its actually feared by some law makers.
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby XinTX » Fri Sep 02, 2016 6:27 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:Local officials are blatantly ignoring Tex. Gov't Code §411.209 (SB273), playing games with lame excuses that sound like they came from a five year old, and risking taxpayer money while doing so.


Which is why I'd like to see those directing the posting of said signs be held personally liable. If it's taxpayers footing the bill, they don't care. Not their money. Either make them personally liable, or give the taxpayers grounds to recover the fines from those who directed an illegal act under the color of authority. If we mere mortals break the law, we have to pay our own fines. Just because they're gov't employees, they shouldn't be able to pass the cost of their illegal activities onto the taxpayers.
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby Roger Howard » Wed Oct 26, 2016 10:09 am

:iagree: :iagree:
Charles L. Cotton wrote:Unlicensed open-carry will not pass in 2017 and it may not even be filed. Open-carry groups will focus on NRA/TSRA bills and issues trying to once again take credit for bills that we passed last session and that we will pass in 2017. They did that at the end of 2015 and they will do so again in 2017. They show up at a public hearing on NRA/TSRA bills, testify in support, then claim they got the bills passed. Thankfully, only the folks in their echo chamber buy that garbage.

Removal of off-limits areas for LTCs should be the single flagship bill in 2017 and if it is not, then a great disservice has been inflicted on the most law-abiding of Texans. The political climate is perfect to see the bill pass. Local officials are blatantly ignoring Tex. Gov't Code §411.209 (SB273), playing games with lame excuses that sound like they came from a five year old, and risking taxpayer money while doing so.

So-called "gun free zones" are a magnet for criminals whether they come to commit mass murder or to rape or rob a lone victim. With the increased threat of attacks by terrorists, the need to remove unnecessary off-limits areas is greater now than in the past. Even Harvard agrees that "gun free zones" are a magnet for violent criminals.

I don't care if we pass nothing else -- remove off-limits killing zones now!!!

Chas.

:iagree: This would be the best use of political capital in 2017.
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby nonleg » Wed Oct 26, 2016 10:28 am

Maybe the junior version of what you suggest is extra training for junior cops. I've met plenty of "seasoned" officers that understand what the rules are, and a *ton* of young ones that don't. I'll directly reference the Houston Rodeo, when a senior cop overruled his newbie in the golfcart with a "You're not going into the arena are you? OK, don't shoot anyone ok."
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby srothstein » Wed Oct 26, 2016 11:38 am

nonleg wrote:Maybe the junior version of what you suggest is extra training for junior cops. I've met plenty of "seasoned" officers that understand what the rules are, and a *ton* of young ones that don't. I'll directly reference the Houston Rodeo, when a senior cop overruled his newbie in the golfcart with a "You're not going into the arena are you? OK, don't shoot anyone ok."


This is a training solution that is possible. We have several rules now that require officers with a basic certificate to attend specific training but officers with intermediate, advanced, or master certificates do not have to attend. The difference between the certificates is a combination of time as an officer and education, either college or continuing education credits. The amount of time differs based on the level of education.
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby locke_n_load » Wed Oct 26, 2016 11:47 am

nonleg wrote:Maybe the junior version of what you suggest is extra training for junior cops. I've met plenty of "seasoned" officers that understand what the rules are, and a *ton* of young ones that don't. I'll directly reference the Houston Rodeo, when a senior cop overruled his newbie in the golfcart with a "You're not going into the arena are you? OK, don't shoot anyone ok."


You were able to get into the HLRS with your concealed handgun?
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby OldCurlyWolf » Wed Oct 26, 2016 11:49 am

Charles L. Cotton wrote:Unlicensed open-carry will not pass in 2017 and it may not even be filed. Open-carry groups will focus on NRA/TSRA bills and issues trying to once again take credit for bills that we passed last session and that we will pass in 2017. They did that at the end of 2015 and they will do so again in 2017. They show up at a public hearing on NRA/TSRA bills, testify in support, then claim they got the bills passed. Thankfully, only the folks in their echo chamber buy that garbage.

Removal of off-limits areas for LTCs should be the single flagship bill in 2017 and if it is not, then a great disservice has been inflicted on the most law-abiding of Texans. The political climate is perfect to see the bill pass. Local officials are blatantly ignoring Tex. Gov't Code §411.209 (SB273), playing games with lame excuses that sound like they came from a five year old, and risking taxpayer money while doing so.

So-called "gun free zones" are a magnet for criminals whether they come to commit mass murder or to rape or rob a lone victim. With the increased threat of attacks by terrorists, the need to remove unnecessary off-limits areas is greater now than in the past. Even Harvard agrees that "gun free zones" are a magnet for violent criminals.

I don't care if we pass nothing else -- remove off-limits killing zones now!!!

Chas.


:iagree: :thumbs2:
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby mloamiller » Wed Oct 26, 2016 11:58 am

Charles L. Cotton wrote:Removal of off-limits areas for LTCs should be the single flagship bill in 2017 and if it is not, then a great disservice has been inflicted on the most law-abiding of Texans. The political climate is perfect to see the bill pass. Local officials are blatantly ignoring Tex. Gov't Code §411.209 (SB273), playing games with lame excuses that sound like they came from a five year old, and risking taxpayer money while doing so.

So-called "gun free zones" are a magnet for criminals whether they come to commit mass murder or to rape or rob a lone victim. With the increased threat of attacks by terrorists, the need to remove unnecessary off-limits areas is greater now than in the past. Even Harvard agrees that "gun free zones" are a magnet for violent criminals.

I don't care if we pass nothing else -- remove off-limits killing zones now!!!

Chas.


:iagree: 100%
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby ELB » Wed Oct 26, 2016 1:24 pm

As I see it, it is much smarter strategery to work on expanding the areas that LTCers can carry, because it is easier to sell politically, given the outstanding legal records that LTCers have. If "constitutional carry" were tackled first and passed by some miracle, I have no doubt it would be loaded down with the current restrictions on carry plus a few more. It's just an much easier "sell" to expand the LTCers' turf first, then when all the restrictions have been removed, work on dropping the license requirement.
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Re: Political Capital-Prohibited Places vs Constitutional Carry

Postby AJSully421 » Thu Oct 27, 2016 12:01 am

OK, so, who do we want to do the write up on the bill? I can do it...

Bill #1 2017 session:

Penal Code 46.02 and 46.03 shall not apply to a person licensed under Govt Code 411........ and Section 46.035 is hereby repealed.

This bill takes effect as of September 1st, 1995... because these laws NEVER SHOULD HAVE EXISTED IN THE FIRST PLACE.

Thanks, have a good day, bye.
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