Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

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Ruark
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Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby Ruark » Wed Sep 28, 2016 6:22 pm

I would like to see an amendment to modify the "holster" requirement for open carry, to include carrying the gun in a pocket. This could be a pants pocket or maybe a purse's side pocket. My 9mms (SIG and Walther) fit perfectly and snugly in the front pockets of my jeans and work pants, with the grip just partially exposed. It'd be a real luxury to be able to just stick it in my pocket with having to hassle with a holster, belt clips and loops, etc. etc.

Anybody?
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby FastCarry » Wed Sep 28, 2016 6:58 pm

Do you dress primarily with your shirt tucked in?


Soccerdad1995
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Wed Sep 28, 2016 7:22 pm

I think the concern was to prevent people from walking around with an unholstered weapon in their hand. Maybe change the requirement to just say "holster" so pocket holsters would also be OK. Personally, I am fine with a requirement for a holster that at least covers the trigger, but I don't see the harm in allowing a pocket holster, or even an ankle holster (if you are wearing shorts and sandals, for example.
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nightmare69
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby nightmare69 » Wed Sep 28, 2016 7:26 pm

I thought the holster requirement was for gun safety and keep someone from carrying gangster style.
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AJSully421
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby AJSully421 » Wed Sep 28, 2016 7:47 pm

nightmare69 wrote:I thought the holster requirement was for gun safety and keep someone from carrying gangster style.


While that is a benefit... our OC law was copied from Oklahoma. Sen. Estes even said as much on the floor during debate.

Oklahoma has the "shoulder or belt" holster requirement, and the reason that was given from their legislators who authored the bill was that they did not want someone carrying a pistol in their hand at their side and calling it "open carry" and scaring the sheep... because, haven't you heard?... that is becoming a huge problem in the other states where OC is legal and there is no requirement to have it in a holster.

I agree that the best thing to do would be to strike the words "shoulder or belt" every time and just make it so that it says "Must be carried in a holster".
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Ruark
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby Ruark » Thu Sep 29, 2016 8:53 am

I thought the holster requirement was for gun safety and keep someone from carrying gangster style.


No, as I understand it, the purpose was to ensure that it's not carried openly in the hand, which is certainly understandable.

I agree that the best thing to do would be to strike the words "shoulder or belt" every time and just make it so that it says "Must be carried in a holster".


As far as modifying the language, I would suggest going a little further and changing it to "Must be carried in a holster or pocket." Now that does NOT necessarily mean a "pocket holster." That would include just sticking the gun into your pocket. Remember, this is referring to open carry, not concealed carry. You can already carry concealed in your pocket, as long as it's concealed. The "holster" language only applies to open carry. When I stick my gun in my pocket, the grip is slightly exposed, so it's considered to be carried openly. I'm becoming motivated to contact somebody and try to get that amendment on the list.
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:07 am

Ruark wrote:As far as modifying the language, I would suggest going a little further and changing it to "Must be carried in a holster or pocket." Now that does NOT necessarily mean a "pocket holster." That would include just sticking the gun into your pocket. Remember, this is referring to open carry, not concealed carry. You can already carry concealed in your pocket, as long as it's concealed. The "holster" language only applies to open carry. When I stick my gun in my pocket, the grip is slightly exposed, so it's considered to be carried openly. I'm becoming motivated to contact somebody and try to get that amendment on the list.


My first thought was "how hard is it to buy a simple nylon pocket holster for $10? I still think that a blanket requirement for a holster of some type that covers the trigger completely would be a good idea for both CC and OC.

That said, I do see the point that it is weird to have a different requirement for OC than we have for CC. Right now, I can legally carry my J frame in the pocket of my jeans as long as my T-shirt covers the exposed portion of the grip. No holster needed since it is concealed carry. But if I take off my shirt, or tuck it in, and the end of the grip is exposed, then I am suddenly illegal, because I am OC'ing and the gun is not in a holster (much less a "belt or shoulder" holster). So I would be OK with standardizing this holster requirement for both types of carry, but I would still be inclined to standardize toward a requirement for a holster that covers the trigger, because I personally think that would be safer.
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby twomillenium » Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:09 am

If the open carry shoulder or belt holster was written for safety reasons, it would have required a level of retention instead of just requiring instructor to teach the advantages of retention. I understand not wanting people going around open carrying with the handgun in their hands. I really don't understand the concealed carry in the vehicle.
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby george72 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:11 am

If I see a pistol grip sticking out of your pocket gangster style I'm going to assume that you're a bad guy. I personally don't think that helps our (LTC holders) collective image, and yes image is an issue with the current state of politicians trying to strip our rights. $0.02.
Last edited by george72 on Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby ELB » Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:26 am

Recall that at the time this bill was going through, our friends from OCT and similar organizations were making a lot of noise in various ways about open carry. I have no doubt that one of the reasons the bill's authors thought Oklahoma's restriction was a good idea was the belief that there would demonstrations featuring "open-carry-in-the-hand" if the restriction was not included.

I think that in general the restriction was a bad idea and introduced unneeded complexity into the law (e.g. what constitutes a holster), but changing that restriction would not be one of my top goals for the coming legislative session.

p.s. and as a practice I would not recommend just carrying a pistol of any make in a pocket all by itself. A holster or some device to secure the trigger guard area would be wise. Definitely do not put anything else in that pocket. I know someone with a .40 Gold Dot fully expanded hollow point scar through about 10 or 12 inches of thigh from pocket carrying without taking these precautions.
Last edited by ELB on Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby The Wall » Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:31 am

So going on what some of you have suggested changing to must be in a holster, an individual could carry a gun in his hand as long as it is in a holster. A wrist band holster might be a good idea. How about those holsters that attach to your arm and are spring loaded and push the gun out to the hand when you flex your wrist. :lol:


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WildBill
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby WildBill » Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:02 am

I am for leaving the laws the way they are.
I often pocket carry, but when I do, the handgun is always in a holster that covers the trigger.
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby locke_n_load » Thu Sep 29, 2016 11:51 am

I'm a big fan of just "holster".
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby parabelum » Thu Sep 29, 2016 12:10 pm

There's bigger fish to fry. I'd leave this one alone. Just my opinion.
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Re: Amend the "holster" requirement for OC????

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Thu Sep 29, 2016 12:13 pm

parabelum wrote:There's bigger fish to fry. I'd leave this one alone. Just my opinion.


:iagree:

Removing restricted government owned locations, and closing loopholes on governments (or their agents) restricting carry are two much more urgent issues
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