military surplus 7.62

[gmckinl]

Found a copy on the Al Gore web. I had to OCR it, so please excuse any typos. What follows is the page from the latest revision that describes the pressure specs for the 7.62x51...

MIL-C-46931F(AR)

3.7.1 Chamber pressure. The chamber pressure measurement shall be performed by either the copper-crush cylinder or EPVAT test method. However, the test method employed shall be recorded on the test results.

3.7.1.1 Chamber pressure measurement at 70 F by copper- crush cylinder test method. The average chamber pressure of the sample cartridges conditioned at 70 F shall not exceed 50,000 pounds per square inch (psi). The average chamber pressure plus three standard deviations of chamber pressure shall not exceed 55,000 psi. The chamber pressure of an individual sample cartridge shall not exceed 55,000 psi.

3.7.1.2 Chamber pressure measurement at 70 F by EPVAT test method. The average chamber pressure of the sample cartridges conditioned at 70 F shall not exceed 365 MegaPascals (MPa) (52,940 psi). The average chamber pressure plus three standard deviations of the chamber pressure shall not exceed 400 MPa (58,016 psi). The chamber pressure of an individual sample cartridge shall not exceed 400 MPa (58,016 psi).

3.7.1.3 Chamber pressure measurement at 125 F and -65 F by copper-crush cylinder test. The average chamber pressure of the sample cartridges subjected to 125 F and -65 F storage conditions shall not exceed 55,000 psi nor vary by more than plus (+) 7,500 psi or minus (-) 15,000 psi from the average chamber pressure of the sample cartridges of the same lot tested for the requirements of 3.7.1.1.

3.7.1.4 Chamber pressure measurement at 125 F and -65 F by EPVAT test method. The average chamber pressure of the sample cartridges subjected to 125 F and -65 F storage conditions shall not exceed 400 MPa (58,016 psi) nor vary by more than plus (+)50 MPa (7,252 psi) or minus (-)100 MPa (14,504 psi) from the average chamber pressure of the sample cartridges of the same lot tested for the requirements of 3.7.1.2.

3.7.1.5 Velocity. The average velocity of the sample cartridge conditioned at 70 F, shall be 2,750 feet per second (ft/sec) plus or minus 30 ft/sec at 78 feet from the muzzle of the weapon. The standard deviation of the velocities shall not exceed 32 ft/sec.

[Mike1951]

Federal (A76251M1A) and Winchester (Q3130) both periodically offer 7.62x51 ammo loaded to NATO specs. There may be others.

There used to be an ammo site in one of the surplus rifle forums, updated weekly, listing the surplus ammo available with prices. I have been unable to find it.

There are still a few hoards out there of the South African, but it is seldom released and at a premium price.

Ammoman has some German at $489/1000.

[UpTheIrons]

Does anyone know anything about this POF Pakistani mil-surp from J&G? $100/250 in an ammo can. I was thinking about stocking up.

http://www.jgsales.com/product_info.php ... ts_id/3488" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Ziran]

There is a continuously updated post on rifle company that lists the cheapest mil surp 7.62 NATO on internet:

http://www.rifle-company.com/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?t=431" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It is by far the most comprehensive and up to date list that I know of.

[Mike1951]

There is a continuously updated post on rifle company that lists the cheapest mil surp 7.62 NATO on internet:

http://www.rifle-company.com/phpbb3/viewtopic.php?t=431" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It is by far the most comprehensive and up to date list that I know of.

That's the one!! I had it bookmarked on another computer that crashed.

It was really useful when supplies were better.

It's bookmarked again.

[Mike1951]

Does anyone know anything about this POF Pakistani mil-surp from J&G? $100/250 in an ammo can. I was thinking about stocking up.

http://www.jgsales.com/product_info.php ... ts_id/3488" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

When South African was plentiful, the Pakistani and Indian stuff was widely panned. As I mentioned in another post, I was aware of some companies who had hoarded the SA, but until I was reminded of the above referenced link, I had no idea that anyone was releasing any.

Pay the little extra for the South African and buy all you can afford. Then buy some more!

[lrb111]

I look to http://www.ammoman.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; first. At first glance they may not seem as cheap as others. But you don't pay shipping or taxes. Add that stuff up and they are a good deal.

[Spanky]

How about 7.62x39? I need to buy some of this but am confused about corrosiveness. Are all berdan primed rounds corrosive? I see some that say berdan primed corrosive and some say berdan primed non-corrosive. What's the deal here?

[GWE Chally]

Yes - that page mostly lists milsurp 7.62x51 NATO along with some commercial .308

Now, seeing as you asked the question, if I were you I would google ".308 vs 7.62" and do some reading, but the generic, rule-of-thumb answer is 7.62 NATO is slightly hotter than commercial .308

I don't like how they list 5.56 with the .223 though.

.308 and 7.62x51 are pretty much the same, enough to be listed together, IMO, however, 5.56 and .223 are different enough that it can cause safety problems, and should be listed separately, also IMO.

For those who don't know, (As I'm pretty sure AndyC does, so this is not directed at him):
.223 can be fired in 5.56 chambered rifles, but do _not_ fire 5.56 in .223 chambered rifles. 5.56 operates at much higher pressures than a strict .223 chamber is rated for.
The cartridge also has a very slightly different size, externally, but has a Large difference in case wall thickness.
Most rifle bolts _will_ close on a 5.56 in a .223 chamber. This gives the illusion of "Oh, it closes, so it's safe to fire" Which is incorrect.
"Wylde" Chambered rifles are designed to shoot both.

Popping primers is a common occurrence when you're shooting 5.56 in a .223 rifle, this explains why ;)

This concludes today's session of .223 vs 5.56

I hate to rain on your parade but, the difference is not the cases or how "hot" the NATO ammunition is the difference is the LEADE or FREEBORE of the chamber. The NATO ammunition is loaded with longer heavier bullets requiring more leade in the chamber. .223 is usually loaded with short lighter bullets so the chamber is cut with less leade. The longer NATO ammunition will produce more pressure because the bullet is jammed against the rifling making starting it require more pressure. The Wylde chamber is a long leade chamber.

So, a related question: Can a dirty gun cause the primers to pop out of the round and foul the action? (Assuming that the gun is chambered for 5.56 and you are shooting 5.56.)

You will be helping to settle an argument... Thanks!

[AdioSS]

5.56x45 > .223 Rem
.308 Win > 7.62x51

[GWE Chally]

So, a related question: Can a dirty gun cause the primers to pop out of the round and foul the action? (Assuming that the gun is chambered for 5.56 and you are shooting 5.56.)

You will be helping to settle an argument... Thanks!

I can't see how - the symptom of primers backing out is typically caused by over-pressure or crap ammo.

That was exactly my answer. Thanks!

According to a "Gunsmith", (Who has a vested interest in saying it's a dirty gun's fault) and supposedly Federal Ammunition, it's the gun's fault.

Thanks again!