Car Carry vs CHL Carry

[Alf]

Can they fire you? Yes, they can fire you for anything, but you will be able to beat them in court for wrongful termination.

Good luck with that since Texas is a "at will" State. They can simply say your services were no longer required and not even mention the gun as the reason.

We let three people go this year. There were no lawsuits or other bogeymen.

[Texas_Blaze]

Can they fire you? Yes, they can fire you for anything, but you will be able to beat them in court for wrongful termination.

Good luck with that since Texas is a "at will" State. They can simply say your services were no longer required and not even mention the gun as the reason.

We let three people go this year. There were no lawsuits or other bogeymen.

your company probably has the signatures of each one of those former employees, signing away their right to sue. in return the fired persons got severance pay.

[Keith B]

Can they fire you? Yes, they can fire you for anything, but you will be able to beat them in court for wrongful termination.

Good luck with that since Texas is a "at will" State. They can simply say your services were no longer required and not even mention the gun as the reason.

We let three people go this year. There were no lawsuits or other bogeymen.

And you probably had cause for dismissal and they knew it. Totally different than termination for something that is specifically allowed by law and prohibits employers from not allowing.

[dicion]

Oh hey, it's this again.

See the link in my signature for this issue that was settled multiple years ago XD

TL;DR:
-30.06 applies when you're carrying under CHL only.
-CHL is an Exception to 46.02, you don't need a CHL to carry where it's not illegal. MPA makes it not illegal to carry in your car, therefore you do not need the CHL exception, therefore you are not carrying 'under chl' in your vehicle.
-Since you're not carrying under CHL, 30.06 doesnt apply.

Think of it this way. If someone WITHOUT a CHL drives into a parking lot with a 30.06 sign under MPA, does it apply to them? No.
They don't even have a CHL, and 30.06 only applies to CHL's.

Edit: Regarding the 'but you must present your CHL when asked for ID' part, that is a completely different section of the code, and has absolutely nothing to do with carrying under CHL, but rather, do you have a CHL? If so, present it. Technically, by law, any Police officer that has a CHL is required to present it to any other officer asking them for ID, simply because they have one + are carrying a firearm.

[Unicorn Rancher]

Think of it this way. If someone WITHOUT a CHL drives into a parking lot with a 30.06 sign under MPA, does it apply to them? No.

True. A big ugly sign is not necessary to prohibit long guns and MPA. A simple "NO GUNS" sign is sufficient notice for plain vanilla trespass.

[TexasCajun]

Here's my take on this. Usual disclaimers apply. 30.06 notice (sign or otherwise) can only be given by someone who is in apparent authority over the property in question. So a business can post signs in the parking lot if they want to. But the prohibition of carrying a concealed handgun would not apply to my vehicle since that business owner/manager/head-peon has no authority over my vehicle. Since I wouldn't be able to carry into the building anyway, I would either do my business elsewhere or disarm in my vehicle. In that way, having the parking lot signage would be helpful in that I wouldn't have to do the uh-oh turnaround.

Now being an employee of the business in question adds another dimension. Not only are you subject to state laws, but you also have to consider any formal policy that you've agreed to as a condition of employment. And that can be tricky as the policy can change and your continued employment is seen as agreement with that policy.

[n5wd]

Can they fire you? Yes, they can fire you for anything, but you will be able to beat them in court for wrongful termination.

Good luck with that since Texas is a "at will" State. They can simply say your services were no longer required and not even mention the gun as the reason.

We let three people go this year. There were no lawsuits or other bogeymen.

Maybe not yet, but if I remember correctly, former employees have two years from the date of termination in which to file a court case.

[nightmare]

Here's my take on this. Usual disclaimers apply. 30.06 notice (sign or otherwise) can only be given by someone who is in apparent authority over the property in question. So a business can post signs in the parking lot if they want to. But the prohibition of carrying a concealed handgun would not apply to my vehicle since that business owner/manager/head-peon has no authority over my vehicle. Since I wouldn't be able to carry into the building anyway, I would either do my business elsewhere or disarm in my vehicle. In that way, having the parking lot signage would be helpful in that I wouldn't have to do the uh-oh turnaround.

Now being an employee of the business in question adds another dimension. Not only are you subject to state laws, but you also have to consider any formal policy that you've agreed to as a condition of employment. And that can be tricky as the policy can change and your continued employment is seen as agreement with that policy.

I like the way you think.

30.06 notice (sign or otherwise) can only be given by someone who is in apparent authority over the property in question. So a business can post signs in the parking lot and buildings if they want to. But the prohibition of carrying a concealed handgun would not apply to my pants since that business owner/manager/head-peon has no authority over what's in my pants.

[TexasCajun]

Here's my take on this. Usual disclaimers apply. 30.06 notice (sign or otherwise) can only be given by someone who is in apparent authority over the property in question. So a business can post signs in the parking lot if they want to. But the prohibition of carrying a concealed handgun would not apply to my vehicle since that business owner/manager/head-peon has no authority over my vehicle. Since I wouldn't be able to carry into the building anyway, I would either do my business elsewhere or disarm in my vehicle. In that way, having the parking lot signage would be helpful in that I wouldn't have to do the uh-oh turnaround.

Now being an employee of the business in question adds another dimension. Not only are you subject to state laws, but you also have to consider any formal policy that you've agreed to as a condition of employment. And that can be tricky as the policy can change and your continued employment is seen as agreement with that policy.

I like the way you think.

30.06 notice (sign or otherwise) can only be given by someone who is in apparent authority over the property in question. So a business can post signs in the parking lot and buildings if they want to. But the prohibition of carrying a concealed handgun would not apply to my pants since that business owner/manager/head-peon has no authority over what's in my pants.

You are free to interpret what I said any way you wish. But anyone who has spent any length of time on this site knows that you've jumped way ahead of what I said and meant. But feel free to guinea pig your interpretation for the rest of us.

[timdsmith72]

I sent an email to the legal team at Southwest, just to see what they had to say. This is what I got back.

your concern about the posting of the 30.06 signage at the entrances to our Southwest Airlines Campus. It’s important to understand that from a Company perspective, we have to take a broad approach.



We do this by posting official notification in the form of the 30.06 notice restricting firearms on our property, which in theory, supports our ability to enforce the existing Company policy of no “unauthorized” possession of firearms. The intent of posting the Texas Penal Code “§30.06 Trespass by Holder of License to Carry Concealed Handgun,” is that the sign simply gives the Company recourse to pursue a charge of criminal trespass in the event a person is found to be in possession of a concealed weapon who is otherwise not in compliance with the law. In conflict with 30.06, is SB 321, also known as the parking lot law.

SB 321, which went into effect September 2011, only prohibits employers from prohibiting employees from storing lawfully concealed weapons/ammunition in locked vehicles in worksite parking areas. An employer can continue to prohibit employees from possessing a firearm on the "premises" of the employer's business, which we do by the external door signage, in addition to the stated company policy. The term "premises" is defined by Section 46.035(f)(3) of the Texas Penal Code as a building or portion of a building. "Premises" does not include a driveway, street, sidewalk, walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area.

The stated purpose of SB 321 was to protect Texas gun owners (CHL holders and non-CHL holders ref HB 1815), and prevent employers from prohibiting employees from keeping firearms in their locked vehicle, with a few exceptions. As a company, we make it clear that we recognize this legislation by the first word in our policy (Unauthorized), in addition to a clear statement acknowledging the storage of lawfully possessed weapons in the states who have adopted 321 where we have physical property. “Unauthorized possession of….. In those limited jurisdictions that allow storage of lawfully possessed weapons in locked vehicles in worksite parking areas outside airport secure areas, applicable state law will apply (for example Indiana, Oklahoma and Texas, among others).” Finally, for those carrying under HB 1815, SB 321 covers non-CHL holders

The location of the signs represents the primary initial entry point for each facility. CHL legislation contains contradictory language because of the many nuances of the law. As long as employees/visitors, etc., remain aware of the law and its intent in addition to stated company policy they should not encounter a problem. Hope this helps.

[TomsTXCHL]

I sent an email to the legal team at Southwest, just to see what they had to say. This is what I got back.

I won't pretend to understand everything that's been said here, but in effect it seems they posted 30.06 signage at the parking lot entrances simply as a "heads-up" that carry inside was prohibited.

Most days I think lawyers intentionally make things more complicated than necessary to justify their existence/high costs!?

[birdman253]

Can they fire you? Yes, they can fire you for anything, but you will be able to beat them in court for wrongful termination.

Good luck with that since Texas is a "at will" State. They can simply say your services were no longer required and not even mention the gun as the reason.

We let three people go this year. There were no lawsuits or other bogeymen.

And you probably had cause for dismissal and they knew it. Totally different than termination for something that is specifically allowed by law and prohibits employers from not allowing.

As stated, Texas is an "at will" employment state. I don't have to tell an employee why I am terminating them, only that their services are no longer required. If I do it that way, I cannot win if I fight their unemployment filing, but that is the only reason I have to give.

Also, there is not a person working today that could not be terminated for cause, if their employer truly wanted to fire them. Trust me, I know how to look for the right answer.