TABC website and lookup of 51% businesses

[RHenriksen]

April 18 EDIT: TABC has told me that they now intend to update their website to make the 51% status of businesses available online to the public. I'll follow up with them in a few weeks to see how the work is going.

I got through to the TABC webmaster this morning to inquire about being able to look up the 51% status of a business via the TABC website. He didn't know, and asked me to send him an email about it. He's supposed to either get back to me with how to accomplish such a lookup, or circulate a proposal internally to add this functionality. Will keep my fingers crossed.

Here's what I sent to webmaster@state.tx.us:
==============================================
Hi Joe, per our phone conversation, I’d like to find out how I can look up on the TABC website whether a business is 51% or not. If it’s not currently possible, I’d like to make a request for such a lookup to be created. There are presently 460,000 concealed handgun license holders in Texas, and this topic comes up frequently on the CHL web forums. As a community, we are very interested in obeying the law; and how to determine the 51% status of a business (prior to visiting) is a frequent topic of discussion.

If the website presently supports such a lookup, I’d like to request that a link to the appropriate page be made more visible on the homepage, or close to the homepage so that it will be more accessible to visitors.

Thank you very much,

[RiverCity.45]

Wow. That would be great. Thanks for taking the time to pursue this!

[Keith B]

There ya go trying to make something from the government logical and easy to use. When will folks learn?

Seriously, thanks for the contact and suggestion to them. Let us know the response and if additional support is needed to help convince them we need it.

[RHenriksen]

There ya go trying to make something from the government logical and easy to use. When will folks learn?

Seriously, thanks for the contact and suggestion to them. Let us know the response and if additional support is needed to help convince them we need it.

You bet. Joe sounded like a good guy - I don't want to sic the hounds on him just yet

[steveincowtown]

I believe this is already possible at this link:

http://www.tabc.state.tx.us/PublicInquiry/Status.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I looked up Hard Rock Cafe in Dallas (topic of other threads):
License #: MB722759

Trade Name: HARD ROCK CAFE
Owner: HARD ROCK CAFE INTERNATIONAL (STP) INC.
Location Address:
2211 N HOUSTON STREET
DALLAS , TX 75219
Mailing Address:
6100 OLD PARK LN
ORLANDO , FL 32835
County: DALLAS Orig. Issue Date: 5/29/2009
Status: Current Exp. Date: 5/28/2011
Wine Percent:
Location Phone No.: 7132271392

Subordinates: FB,LB

And here is what FB license means:

FOOD AND BEVERAGE CERTIFICATE (FB)
A Food and Beverage Certificate may be issued to the holder of a Beer Retailer's On-Premise Permit or Wine and Beer Retailer's Permit if food service is the primary business being operated on the licensed premise or to the holder of a Mixed Beverage Permit or Private Club Permit if food service is available on the premises and the gross receipts of alcoholic beverages do not exceed 50% of total gross receipts.

Just look to see if the establish meant has an "FB" license which by definition eliminates the location from displaying a 51% sign.

[RHenriksen]

Thanks... Now I just have to find where on the site 'LB' is explained :-( Very user unfriendly!

[RHenriksen]

http://www.tabc.state.tx.us/licensing/l ... iption.asp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

MIXED BEVERAGE LATE HOURS PERMIT (LB)
Permit authorizes a Mixed Beverage permittee to sell mixed beverages until 2 A.M.

'LB' is the only info on my business of interest (license # MB667122). So I still can't tell whether they'd be a 51% business or not... They sell coffee and pastries in the morning, and food at least for lunch.

[Keith B]

There ya go trying to make something from the government logical and easy to use. When will folks learn?

Seriously, thanks for the contact and suggestion to them. Let us know the response and if additional support is needed to help convince them we need it.

You bet. Joe sounded like a good guy - I don't want to sic the hounds on him just yet

Oh no, wasn't implying that we needed to hit them right now. What I have seen in the past though is they can come back and state unless there is a lot of requests for that, then the time for development is not justified. At THAT point we may need to start the email campaign, but need to wait until Joe comes back with his response. Hopefully it is "It was an easy change in code and we added that feature and it is now functioning to show if they are 51%!'

[Keith B]

I believe this is already possible at this link:

http://www.tabc.state.tx.us/PublicInquiry/Status.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I looked up Hard Rock Cafe in Dallas (topic of other threads):
License #: MB722759

Trade Name: HARD ROCK CAFE
Owner: HARD ROCK CAFE INTERNATIONAL (STP) INC.
Location Address:
2211 N HOUSTON STREET
DALLAS , TX 75219
Mailing Address:
6100 OLD PARK LN
ORLANDO , FL 32835
County: DALLAS Orig. Issue Date: 5/29/2009
Status: Current Exp. Date: 5/28/2011
Wine Percent:
Location Phone No.: 7132271392

Subordinates: FB,LB

And here is what FB license means:

FOOD AND BEVERAGE CERTIFICATE (FB)
A Food and Beverage Certificate may be issued to the holder of a Beer Retailer's On-Premise Permit or Wine and Beer Retailer's Permit if food service is the primary business being operated on the licensed premise or to the holder of a Mixed Beverage Permit or Private Club Permit if food service is available on the premises and the gross receipts of alcoholic beverages do not exceed 50% of total gross receipts.

Just look to see if the establish meant has an "FB" license which by definition eliminates the location from displaying a 51% sign.

Having an FB (Food and Beverage) license is a sure sign they are not a 51% location. However, the absence of the FB license does not indicate they ARE a 51%. So, without some type of positive check, anything without and FB is still in question until you look at their physical license on premise or call and query the TABC. Having the feature in the online database would be a REAL asset!

[cbr600]

deleted

[RHenriksen]

Making reasonable progress. The webmaster routed me to the Director of Communications and Government Relations, who explained:

"You can’t look it up in public inquiry. The theory was that their sales information is confidential and so the agency decided not to put that info out there. That decision has been made twice I believe since public inquiry was first developed."

I pointed out that *requiring* businesses to post a 51% sign is a pretty public thing, so I couldn't understand why posting that same information online was somehow objectionable. I stressed that I'm not looking for actual revenue figures, *just* the go/no-go on the 51% status. I got back:

"I understand your concerns, and I will share them with TABC Administrator Alan Steen and see if he wishes to reconsider the decision that was previously made."

and

"If you don’t hear back from us in a week, please feel free to remind me. I have e-mailed the issue to my boss already, but we are in the midst of the legislative session and things move very quickly around here. I’m not sure how soon he will be able to respond."

So all in all, so far a responsive and pleasant experience.

[steveincowtown]

Although they will not give out sales info, it is my understanding that they will Audit any location if requested in writing. I asked for an audit of a local Liquor Store and basically just played dumb and said that the store had too many signs with too much information. Their 51% sign was down within a week. Before the onslaught of "why would you question something that doesn't apply", or "leave well enough alone" etc. occurs, let me point out that I never mentioned the word gun, 2A rights, etc. etc. I simply just said the signs took up half the front door and I didn't understand why they had so many.

[steveincowtown]

Having an FB (Food and Beverage) license is a sure sign they are not a 51% location. However, the absence of the FB license does not indicate they ARE a 51%. So, without some type of positive check, anything without and FB is still in question until you look at their physical license on premise or call and query the TABC. Having the feature in the online database would be a REAL asset!

I just posted this elsewhere, but if a place does not have the "FB" license they either are truly 51%, or they have really poor ownership. Having the "FB" license (and therefore reporting revenues of less than 50% from Alcohol) exempts the owner from having to carry a Surety Bond, which can be very expensive.

"Conduct Surety Bond - Required by all retailers who do not hold a Food and Beverage Certificate. The amount of the bond is determined by the distance to a public school. If the location is over 1,000 feet from a public school, the bond amount will be $5,000. If the location is less than 1,000 feet from a public school, the bond amount will be $10,000"


http://www.tabc.state.tx.us/licensing/bonds.asp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Keith B]

Having an FB (Food and Beverage) license is a sure sign they are not a 51% location. However, the absence of the FB license does not indicate they ARE a 51%. So, without some type of positive check, anything without and FB is still in question until you look at their physical license on premise or call and query the TABC. Having the feature in the online database would be a REAL asset!

I just posted this elsewhere, but if a place does not have the "FB" license they either are truly 51%, or they have really poor ownership. Having the "FB" license (and therefore reporting revenues of less than 50% from Alcohol) exempts the owner from having to carry a Surety Bond, which can be very expensive.

"Conduct Surety Bond - Required by all retailers who do not hold a Food and Beverage Certificate. The amount of the bond is determined by the distance to a public school. If the location is over 1,000 feet from a public school, the bond amount will be $5,000. If the location is less than 1,000 feet from a public school, the bond amount will be $10,000"


http://www.tabc.state.tx.us/licensing/bonds.asp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Conduct Surety Bonds are still required if a location is within 1000 feet of a school.

Additionally, the cost of a CSB is about $500 - $600 for a 2-3 year bond. This may be cheaper than a FB if they just want the liquor license. Also, many may not qualify for a FB if they are not really in the food business, but have revenue from other types of income (i.e. amusement or adult entertainment) that is more than 51% of revenue.

Bottom line, the absence of a FB is not necessarily 'Poor ownership' or management.

[RHenriksen]

UPDATE:
===================
Impressive - a week after our last email exchange, I get an email (after 10p last night, no less):

"Just touching base -- I have set up a meeting with several subject area experts to revisit the issue. I'll let you know what we figure out."

I'm really impressed w. the level of responsiveness & work ethic.