CHL @ Preschool via Property and Business Owner
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CHL @ Preschool via Property and Business Owner
Hi! I am new to this forum and to having a CHL. I am a business owner of a Preschool / Child Care center here in Texas and are in need of clarification on what exactly I can do as a CHL holder and the Business/Property owner of MY school.
My CHL instructer said I could but wasn't sure....I mentioned to him that I must follow DFPS child care licensing regulations that say that fire-arms are prohibited unless my center is a home daycare and the fire arm is locked away
This is silly in the since that this is practically my home even though its not...and i have a gun safe that I would have here for the gun to be put in.
Scenario: I leave my house with my gun in my car....I go to work which is my school that I own...I get out of my vehicle..conceal my firearm and come into the building where I go directly to my office where my safe would be and place my firearm in there....
I also plan on modifying our employee handbook and emergency procedures to outline that I designate the use of CHL by the business owner only that way it is written
So what I need is some guidance here on to exact what I can do....What law is THE LAW...the law that governs me as a CHL holder or as a CHL holder once on my school property I now have to follow DFPS child care licesning regulations...which isn't the LAW to me... I think the problem is with getting a clear answer or even finding it in writting is that this is not the "norm" I dont know of any child care facility that has armed security or police or a CHL carrying owner...yet i am determined to protect these children and my staff better than I already am.
Thoughts...
Thank you in advance
My CHL instructer said I could but wasn't sure....I mentioned to him that I must follow DFPS child care licensing regulations that say that fire-arms are prohibited unless my center is a home daycare and the fire arm is locked away
This is silly in the since that this is practically my home even though its not...and i have a gun safe that I would have here for the gun to be put in.
Scenario: I leave my house with my gun in my car....I go to work which is my school that I own...I get out of my vehicle..conceal my firearm and come into the building where I go directly to my office where my safe would be and place my firearm in there....
I also plan on modifying our employee handbook and emergency procedures to outline that I designate the use of CHL by the business owner only that way it is written
So what I need is some guidance here on to exact what I can do....What law is THE LAW...the law that governs me as a CHL holder or as a CHL holder once on my school property I now have to follow DFPS child care licesning regulations...which isn't the LAW to me... I think the problem is with getting a clear answer or even finding it in writting is that this is not the "norm" I dont know of any child care facility that has armed security or police or a CHL carrying owner...yet i am determined to protect these children and my staff better than I already am.
Thoughts...
Thank you in advance
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Re: CHL @ Preschool via Property and Business Owner
You have several different laws to account for. As I understand the law, you would not be committing a Penal Code violation by having the weapon in your car, in your safe, or on your person in a child care center that you own. The Penal Code says that it is legal to carry your weapon on your own premises or premises you control. Assuming you are a sole proprietorship, it is your premises. Assuming you incorporated or filed it as a partnership, it is still premises under your control. This means that a police officer will not arrest you for carrying the weapon there.
There is a big caveat here. There are some strict laws on keeping the gun safe from children. Your plan looks like it would meet the law.
Then there is the DFPS rules. They say you cannot have the weapon on the premises. This is a law, part of the Texas Administrative Code. The bad news is that there is no definition I can find for premises in that law. The definition accepted by the courts, that I am aware of, would make the whole property - including the parking lot - the premises. This is NOT the premises used in chapter 46 where there is a very specific and narrow definition. I base this on the way the courts have looked at licensed premises for drinking. Your plan would clearly violate this law, even if you left the gun in the car. The good news is that violating the Administrative Code is usually a civil violation. This means that the worst DFPS could do is file for a fine against you or revoke your license to operate a child care center.
I do not recommend breaking the law and placing your business or wallet at risk. But that is a choice for you to make.In addition to the law, consider who would know about the gun and how you would get caught. If you don't ever need it, a gun left in your car should never cause a problem while you are at work (no one would know and no one would complain. There is always a chance of getting caught by someone you did not expect to see when you are carrying the weapon inside.
There is a big caveat here. There are some strict laws on keeping the gun safe from children. Your plan looks like it would meet the law.
Then there is the DFPS rules. They say you cannot have the weapon on the premises. This is a law, part of the Texas Administrative Code. The bad news is that there is no definition I can find for premises in that law. The definition accepted by the courts, that I am aware of, would make the whole property - including the parking lot - the premises. This is NOT the premises used in chapter 46 where there is a very specific and narrow definition. I base this on the way the courts have looked at licensed premises for drinking. Your plan would clearly violate this law, even if you left the gun in the car. The good news is that violating the Administrative Code is usually a civil violation. This means that the worst DFPS could do is file for a fine against you or revoke your license to operate a child care center.
I do not recommend breaking the law and placing your business or wallet at risk. But that is a choice for you to make.In addition to the law, consider who would know about the gun and how you would get caught. If you don't ever need it, a gun left in your car should never cause a problem while you are at work (no one would know and no one would complain. There is always a chance of getting caught by someone you did not expect to see when you are carrying the weapon inside.
Steve Rothstein
Re: CHL @ Preschool via Property and Business Owner
The sad irony here being that CHL-holding parents can legally carry into child-care facilities to drop off / pick up their children ( unless properly 30.06 posted or given verbal notice, or a traditional school is attached, of course ).
Re: CHL @ Preschool via Property and Business Owner
Contact your state representative or senator. See about changing a law or whatever to cause a rule change within DFPS.
Re: CHL @ Preschool via Property and Business Owner
Point out the inconsistency to bring the problem to light so they can fix the DFPS regs/rules to be more consistent with other State Laws.MeMelYup wrote:Contact your state representative or senator. See about changing a law or whatever to cause a rule change within DFPS.
I'm no lawyer
"Never show your hole card" "Always have something in reserve"
"Never show your hole card" "Always have something in reserve"
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Re: CHL @ Preschool via Property and Business Owner
Thanks everyone! I plan on contacting my state rep.
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Re: CHL @ Preschool via Property and Business Owner
katmandu wrote:The sad irony here being that CHL-holding parents can legally carry into child-care facilities to drop off / pick up their children ( unless properly 30.06 posted or given verbal notice, or a traditional school is attached, of course ).
To the OP it's pretty commendable with how the world is your taking the actions you are attemppting. I wish you te best of luck. I hope our public school system follows in the same path.
(insert clever signature here)
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Re: CHL @ Preschool via Property and Business Owner
Once you get clarification on the regulations, why don't you reconsider the policy manual revision that you mentioned. If the teachers that you employ are so inclined and have or would get their CHLs, wouldn't it be better to have them armed as well? That way if you were away on other business or home sick, the teachers and children wouldn't be left to fend for themselves if something should happen.
Opinions expressed are subject to change without notice.
NRA TSRA TFC CHL: 9/22/12, PSC Member: 10/2012
NRA TSRA TFC CHL: 9/22/12, PSC Member: 10/2012
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Re: CHL @ Preschool via Property and Business Owner
as a former child-care worker....I love it! push for it!
~Tracy
Gun control is what you talk about when you don't want to talk about the truth ~ Colion Noir
Gun control is what you talk about when you don't want to talk about the truth ~ Colion Noir