Lethal Force against an unarmed assailant(s)

[ldj1002]

Travon?

[MechAg94]

They only thing I can add is that if confronted with a group, distance is your friend. Most of us are not highly trained to deal with this stuff so we need time to see and react. I don't want to get in a wrestling match with anyone.

[JSThane]

I wish I could take credit for the term, but sadly, it's not original to me. I forget exactly where I picked it up, but I've been using it for quite a while.

Did you ever read much that Jeff Cooper wrote. Seems I remember him using goblins for the BGs.

No, not directly. I probably swiped it from someone who borrowed it from someone else who copied it from Cooper.

[JSThane]

They only thing I can add is that if confronted with a group, distance is your friend. Most of us are not highly trained to deal with this stuff so we need time to see and react. I don't want to get in a wrestling match with anyone.

It's not just a group. If you've ever watched any MMA and seen the ground-fighting, the tricks and techniques borrowed from judo, apkido, jiu jistu, and others, it's fairly apparent just how quickly a completely unarmed opponent can subdue, even kill, another healthy, fit human being. Having a knife or a gun in one hand doesn't necessarily improve your odds, not if you're the one being attacked and ground-pounded. A wrestler who knows what he's doing can relieve you of that weapon rather quickly, if he's within grappling distance, and once you've lost the weapon (even if he throws it away!), unless you are a fighter of equal or greater skill and strength, your chances of winning, or even surviving, approach zero.

Thugs do practice wrestling, ground fighting, and the like. Do you? Can you fight back successfully against an 18-30 year old punk in the best physical shape of his life?

Hands can kill, even empty ones.

[Jason K]

They only thing I can add is that if confronted with a group, distance is your friend. Most of us are not highly trained to deal with this stuff so we need time to see and react. I don't want to get in a wrestling match with anyone.

It's not just a group. If you've ever watched any MMA and seen the ground-fighting, the tricks and techniques borrowed from judo, apkido, jiu jistu, and others, it's fairly apparent just how quickly a completely unarmed opponent can subdue, even kill, another healthy, fit human being. Having a knife or a gun in one hand doesn't necessarily improve your odds, not if you're the one being attacked and ground-pounded. A wrestler who knows what he's doing can relieve you of that weapon rather quickly, if he's within grappling distance, and once you've lost the weapon (even if he throws it away!), unless you are a fighter of equal or greater skill and strength, your chances of winning, or even surviving, approach zero.

Thugs do practice wrestling, ground fighting, and the like. Do you? Can you fight back successfully against an 18-30 year old punk in the best physical shape of his life?

Hands can kill, even empty ones.

Wiser words never spoken.....

[Grit]

I didnt read what the attorney said before posting this.

This is a disparity of force, ambush attack. Ambush attacks require an overwhelming force response to get ahead of the assault in progress due to how far behind the curve you are.

I can articulate the use of lethal force fearing my life is under threat of grave bodily harm and multiple assailants are trying to kill me. I do not need to know their real motives.

I would use lethal force to stop the threat. I note that after the initial hit, the victim has time to draw from concealment before being dragged back into the fray. Welcome contact shooting your assailant(s) at bad breath distance. Gun in gut or under chin and keep pulling the trigger on all threats that remain engaged. Stop when they start running away.

I have lots of FoF training from the top 1% trainers including US and South African trainers. I am a graduate of Mas Ayoobs MAG-20 course for what its worth. I am a member of the armed citizens defense network and have an affirmative defense attorney's card in my wallet. I know what to say to 911 and responding officers before shutting up.

[Deltaboy]

Mas wrote that a situation like this is disparity of Force and deadly force is allowed in most places.

[sominus]

Any blow to the face, head, neck or spine is considered deadly force AFAIK.

Return of deadly force is justified. Certainly I would do it...

-M