Strange People

[clbryant1981]

So yesterday I went to my local range and had a little fun. On my way home two young guys started following me in a truck, yelling, and cussing. As always when I leave the range I stop by my local gun shop to shoot the bull and get more ammo. So I pull in to the gun shop, and the guys pull in behind me. At first I think maybe they are going to another store in the same shopping center. I get out (took my bag with my guns in with me) they follow me into the store. They stand at a counter and stare at the wall for a few seconds then leave. Walk down about 3 doors to the convienient store and stand in front if it drinking sodas and staring at the store. The guy that owns the gun store said they had already been there once that morning, and was puzzled as to their behavior when they were there the first time. Needless to say there were about 5 of us in there all with guns, not smart on their part. They hung out in the parking lot for about a half hour, then left. We all thought they were just acting strange. Strange people I guess.

[Teamless]

sometimes people are very strange.

I have to ask, for the bag with the guns that you took into the store, did you have loaded magazines (in or out of the weapons?) By your status, you do not have your CHL yet, so if you had loaded mag's or weapons, by what I see is the technical review of the law, you were carrying concealed, so just want to make you aware, had you not thought of that?

I can speculate only, that if an officer pulled up found you with your range bag, loaded weapons or not, but with ammo also in the bag, I wonder if they could technically say you were carrying concealed as well?

[clbryant1981]

Guns unloaded, ammo in another part of the bag, I have been in that situation in the same gun store and asked the cop that came in and just told him I was there to get something looked at, he said there was nothing wrong with the way I did that, as they were unloaded and not on my body. However there was a loaded magazines with hollow points in the bag, just in case.

[Teamless]

OK, thanks, just curious. I am still not sure, if I do not have a CHL that I would tempt fate and carry anything with a magazine and weapon both easily accessible.

[seamusTX]

There are some strange people in this world, and they can act like jerks. It's one of the prices we pay for living in a free country.

I wish I had a dollar for every time some idiot yelled or shook his fist at me or gave me a one-finger salute in traffic.

I can speculate only, that if an officer pulled up found you with your range bag, loaded weapons or not, but with ammo also in the bag, I wonder if they could technically say you were carrying concealed as well?

Number 1, the Motorist Protection Act (HB 1815, now embodied in PC 46.02) allows anyone to carry a concealed handgun in a motor vehicle.

Number 2, PC 46.15 allows you to carry a handgun to and from a range, with no restriction on being concealed or not, loaded or not.

Number 3, case law allows you to carry a handgun to and from a gun store or gunsmith.

- Jim

[The Annoyed Man]

Number 1, the Motorist Protection Act (HB 1815, now embodied in PC 46.02) allows anyone to carry a concealed handgun in a motor vehicle.

Number 2, PC 46.15 allows you to carry a handgun to and from a range, with no restriction on being concealed or not, loaded or not.

Number 3, case law allows you to carry a handgun to and from a gun store or gunsmith.

- Jim

Shave and a haircut, two bits!

[Teamless]

Number 3, case law allows you to carry a handgun to and from a gun store or gunsmith.

seamusTX, as I knew, however my concern is only that some novice LEO following the "LETTER" rather than "SPIRIT" of the law, finding loaded mag's in the bag as well, may cite for unlawful carrying of a concealed weapon.
That's all I was trying to warn about

[seamusTX]

... some novice LEO following the "LETTER" rather than "SPIRIT" of the law, finding loaded mag's in the bag as well, may cite for unlawful carrying of a concealed weapon.

A law enforcement officer who can't find a reason to arrest a person needs to turn in his badge. There are so many laws, so vaguely written, that no one can avoid violating all of them all the time.

(I think the late Ms. Rand had something to say about that.)

As for PC 46.01 and 46.02, the definitions of handgun and unlawfully carrying weapons say nothing about the handgun being loaded or having ammunition available. Someone could be arrested for carrying a pistol that had no firing pin and was rusted and damaged beyond repair.

<soapbox>We have to exercise our rights fearlessly, or just stay in bed.

There's probably a law somewhere against staying in bed, too.</soapbox>

- Jim

[tacticool]

I have to ask, for the bag with the guns that you took into the store, did you have loaded magazines (in or out of the weapons?)

Loaded or unloaded doesn't make a difference in Texas. A good instructor should cover that in class.

[gigag04]

... some novice LEO following the "LETTER" rather than "SPIRIT" of the law, finding loaded mag's in the bag as well, may cite for unlawful carrying of a concealed weapon.

A law enforcement officer who can't find a reason to arrest a person needs to turn in his badge. There are so many laws, so vaguely written, that no one can avoid violating all of them all the time.

(I think the late Ms. Rand had something to say about that.)

As for PC 46.01 and 46.02, the definitions of handgun and unlawfully carrying weapons say nothing about the handgun being loaded or having ammunition available. Someone could be arrested for carrying a pistol that had no firing pin and was rusted and damaged beyond repair.

<soapbox>We have to exercise our rights fearlessly, or just stay in bed.

There's probably a law somewhere against staying in bed, too.</soapbox>

- Jim

Beat me to it.


I hate those "novice" LEOs.

[cougartex]

Strange.

[surprise_i'm_armed]

seamustx: Here's what you were thinking of, above.

The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals.
Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them.
One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.
Ayn Rand, 1905-1982

Oh, and while I retrieved the above, here's another from her:

Potentially, a government is the most dangerous threat to man's rights:
it holds a legal monopoly on the use of physical force against legally disarmed victims.

SIA sourced the above, plus many other quotes, at http://www.brainyquote.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[seamusTX]

seamustx: Here's what you were thinking of, above.

The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals.
Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them.
One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.

Yes, of course.

Rand left out some things, like taxation and regulation; but that is the principle of making everyone a criminal.

She wrote half a century ago. Few laws have been abolished since then, and many have been added.

- Jim

[VoiceofReason]

... some novice LEO following the "LETTER" rather than "SPIRIT" of the law, finding loaded mag's in the bag as well, may cite for unlawful carrying of a concealed weapon.

A law enforcement officer who can't find a reason to arrest a person needs to turn in his badge. There are so many laws, so vaguely written, that no one can avoid violating all of them all the time.

(I think the late Ms. Rand had something to say about that.)

As for PC 46.01 and 46.02, the definitions of handgun and unlawfully carrying weapons say nothing about the handgun being loaded or having ammunition available. Someone could be arrested for carrying a pistol that had no firing pin and was rusted and damaged beyond repair.

<soapbox>We have to exercise our rights fearlessly, or just stay in bed.

There's probably a law somewhere against staying in bed, too.</soapbox>

- Jim

True any experienced officer can find a reason to arrest someone but making an arrest and making a case can be two very different things.

Too many arrests by an officer that will not/cannot be prosecuted will start making the officer look bad in the department.

Making a lot of extra, useless work for the department, wasting your time on these types of arrests instead of making the good busts will not get you an atta boy from the Police Chief or Sherriff.

I have seen people arrested for minor things that can’t be prosecuted. They were released on a P.R. bond and the charges dropped.

Do they still have Personal Recognizance bonds?