Scenario: Lunatic trying to knock down your door

[seamusTX]

I am relating this story in response to the thread about the Dallas homeowner who shot a man trying to break down his door. All the facts are true and accurate insofar as I know.

My cousin is married to a Methodist minister who is in his 60s. In the year 2003, he was the pastor of a parish in a small town in northern Illinois where ... wait for it ... people don't feel the need to lock their doors.

A neighbor who was a severe, chronic alcoholic went on a rampage. He ended up on the minister's back porch throwing a fit. The minister thought he could talk sense to the intruder. The intruder beat him within an inch of his life. My cousin, the minister's wife, called 911, and the police got there in time to prevent a murder. The minister was left with a lengthy hospital stay and a permanent disability.

The perpetrator claimed temporary insanity and was eventually sentenced to 17 years in prison. My cousin and her husband moved far away to put the matter behind them.

You can see a portion of the story here.

I used to have doubts about actions like shooting through doors. I no longer do. If someone is banging on your door and shouting about killing you, you are in grave danger. Few doors can withstand a determined attack by a healthy or deranged man.

Y'all can slice and dice this scenario. I'll see you in the morning.

- Jim

[nitrogen]

I'll never say, "I'd NEVER shoot through my door" but in most cases I can say I would not shoot through a door.

If I knew the target on the other side of the door wanted to kill me, and I knew where he was, and knew nobody else was around, I might take the shot, but until I develop x-ray vision, I don't see myself knowing all these things through the door.

I'd probably take a defensive position at a right angle to the door, and then wait to act.

I'm sure SOMEONE can come up with a situation where i'd end up doing it, though.

[KD5NRH]

Well, is it nighttime and are you fairly certain that they're going to damage the door?

Remember that there are multiple legal justifications present in some situations. Criminal mischief during the night may not be the best course, but if there's some reason to believe you might have trouble with the "unlawful attempt to enter by force" argument, it's still a possibility.

[HooG19]

I think I do as Nitrogen and take position at a right angle to the door and wait for them to actually gain entry. At which point you have a brief moment to identify the person and decide if you are going to shoot or not.

[stroo]

The only time I have come close to actually using a gun on some one was about 25 years ago when I was in law school. It was a Friday night about 1 am and my wife and I were watching some movie. A guy pounded into our Apt hallway went to the apt above us and starting hollering and shouting and pounding on the door. Sounded like the guy was about 6'6" and 250. Thankfully our neighbor was gone for the weekend. I got out my 16 gauge and loaded it with slugs just in case. Then the guy went to our back hallway and kicked down the neighbors door at which point we called 911. Turned out the guy was 5'6" about 150 and was drunk. He was in the wrong building. In the right building he would have been in the his apt. Would I shoot through the door? NO. But you can bet I would be prepared to shoot as soon as that door opened. I was then and I would be now.

[KBCraig]

I'll never say, "I'd NEVER shoot through my door" but in most cases I can say I would not shoot through a door.

+1 ... never say "never".

But even if I knew exactly who it was, knew they wanted to kill me, and knew they were capable of doing so, I'd have to know the door was in immediate danger of giving way.

True story, relayed to me by my father. When he was 4 or 5, they were living in a bad part of a bad town. My grandather was working 3rd trick as a railroad operator, which left Dad and my grandmother home alone. One night after midnight someone started banging on the front door. Grandma yelled at them to go away. The pounding increased, along with cursing and threats. Grandma told him she had a gun and would shoot. The cursing and threats escalated, with a promise to do all sorts of vile things as soon as he kicked the door down. Dad was awake by this time, and saw his mother level a .38 at the door and fire one shot.

Grandmother being a tall woman, and our miscreant being short, was all that saved him. They never found out who he was, but he left his hat behind. Bullet hole and all.

[phddan]

I'll never say never.
But....
Back in the mid 80's, in Austin, at a new girlfriends apt., seems her ex was a little mad at her for taking up with a new bo.
We were getting ready for supper when we lost power. You could still hear the tv or stereo next door, so she looks out the bedroom window and sees her ex walking away from the electrical meters location and starts freaking.
Great.
So we hear someone coming up the stairs in a hurry. Made sure the door was as secure as it could be.
I get my 357 out of my bag, and stand back at an angle from the door in the low ready, and I remember feeling mad at being put in this kinda situation.
BAM, BAM, BAM, KICK.........KICK, BAM, BAM, KICK....etc, cursing and threatening to kill us.
To this day I don't know what kept that cheap door from busting in, but I sure am thankful it didn't.
I told her to call the cops, and took aim at the door dreading the moment it caved in.
Then silence.
She went over to the window and was talking to the cops when she sees him drive off, and gave a description of him and his truck.
That relationship didn't last long, and I never heard if he got picked up or not.
I never once thought about shooting thru the door, and am sooooo glad I didn't.
But.....
Never say never.

Dan

[jason]

Not sure banging on the door alone would get me to fire my weapon. Without positive identification of the target, there is too much risk involved in shooting through a door.

First, I'd call 911. I'd let them know I am armed and in fear of my life.

Second, I, would make sure my family was in a safe place away from possible stray bullets (don't know if the guy at the door is armed).

Third, I would take up a position behind cover at an angle to the door.

I would shout to the potential intruder that I am armed and that he needs to cease his actions immediately.

If the intruder broke through the door, at this point, I would feel completely justified in firing my weapon.

[Longtooths]

My wife and I have code words and a plan of action in place for as many situations as we can in the home.

In the event of someone pounding on the door violently, yelling, cursing etc:

1) Tell wife, “Chips�, (Wife knows to arms herself with phone and pistol, gets behind my position, and call 911 8 wife knows what to say, or better stated; how to say it*

2) I take up defensive position. (in this situation) angled to the door and covered if possible) **I am always armed in my house so no need to “get armed�**

3) Inform intruder with loud verbal commands, that actions are unacceptable. (STOP PLEASE, I AM ARMED, THE POLICE ARE COMING, ETC.)

If the situation continues and the intruder breaches my home, I would feel justified in escalating my force to deadly.

4) Call the lawyer!

[ricor]

Not to pick on Jason, but how long would that take? R

[WarHawk-AVG]

How long and straight is the hallway/room you would be standing in when the badguy got thru the door

If its 20+ yards square you are in good shape..but last time I checked my hallway directly in line with my bedroom door/front door is only about 14' long...which means if I was standing in my doorway of my bedroom and the badguy kicked in my front door he would be less than .5 to 1.5 seconds away from me...

Most rooms in a home aren't much larger than 14 feet, and once the badguy has gained entry and has gotten sight on a target it will take more than a pistol to stop him, (even if you shot him deader than a hammer without complete central nervous system shutdown, the badguy has anywhere from 10-15 seconds before he exhausts his oxygen supply and goes down) 10-15 seconds is a LONG LONG time, especially if he has a firearm or a very large/sharp blade!

[fadlan12]

Good question: I would give plenty of verbal warning, but once the intent is clear I probably will not wait for perp to gain entry to protect myself. I agree with the above post don't let them get near you if you can help it.

[TacShot]

And the unseen door banger and screamer is standing there with his 5 year old kid in the middle of the night? Yes, they are dumb enough to have their kid with them when they do stupid things, ask any LEO. Any one shooting through a door at an unknown banging at the door is probably not going to be happy with the Grand Jury's Indictment.

[seamusTX]

There is no reason to be unable to see who is outside your door without opening it. If you don't have a window overlooking the door, TV cameras cost less than $100.

Seeing who is at the door will help you avoid a lot more problems than the rare lunatic or gangsters. Ruses like pretending to be the meter reader or a woman in distress with her boyfriend lurking are common.

- Jim

[nitrogen]

There is no reason to be unable to see who is outside your door without opening it. If you don't have a window overlooking the door, TV cameras cost less than $100.

- Jim

This is a great idea that I completely forgot about mentioning.

I have a wireless webcam that is motion activated. I originally hvave it placed there due to theft of packages left on my front door, but it'd be great evidence if it was ever needed.

You can also connect to this on my home network, so it's pretty easy if you've got a computer around to connect to the camera; it takes about 10 seconds.