Medical Office Building

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carrydave
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Re: Medical Office Building

#16

Post by carrydave » Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:27 pm

Just wanted to post an update. I check both the front and read as well as the entrance to the attached cancer treatment center. There are NO 30.06 signs posted.

There is a 30.06 sign posted where the employees enter on the second floor footbridge to employee parking.

Does this mean Its legal to carry as long as i avoid that floor and entrance?


RottenApple
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Re: Medical Office Building

#17

Post by RottenApple » Wed Apr 10, 2013 5:42 pm

carrydave wrote:Just wanted to post an update. I check both the front and read as well as the entrance to the attached cancer treatment center. There are NO 30.06 signs posted.

There is a 30.06 sign posted where the employees enter on the second floor footbridge to employee parking.

Does this mean Its legal to carry as long as i avoid that floor and entrance?
No. Again, 30.06 doesn't need to be posted at all entrances. It does, however, need to be "displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public". Now, if this sign is only posted at the employee entrance, it may not qualify as "displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public"; But YOU have now received notice and so cannot/should not carry.


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carrydave
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Re: Medical Office Building

#18

Post by carrydave » Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:03 am

sorry if i seem to be repeating myself.

I am very greatful, so far since joining I have learned many things that were taught flat out wrong in my chl class.

TYVM


hirundo82
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Re: Medical Office Building

#19

Post by hirundo82 » Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:12 am

RottenApple wrote: As for being a teaching office, not an issue unless its OWNED by an accredited teaching hospital. The teaching hospital issue is kinda weird. EVERY hospital has interns, residents, etc. So every hospital can be said to be a "teaching" hospital. IMO, what makes a hospital a true teaching hospital is that it is attached to a medical school. University Hospital in San Antonio or Baylor Dental College for examples.
No, the vast majority of hospitals are not teaching hospitals (no residents, medical students, etc).

And teaching hospitals aren't even explicitly off limit by statute--to be convicted, the prosecutor would have to show they fall under the "school" prohibition of PC46.03 (and I'm not sure you could convince a jury of that--it wouldn't seem to me to fall under what the man on the street would think of as a school).
"The President does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation." Barack Obama, 12/20/2007


RottenApple
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Re: Medical Office Building

#20

Post by RottenApple » Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:15 am

carrydave wrote:sorry if i seem to be repeating myself.

I am very greatful, so far since joining I have learned many things that were taught flat out wrong in my chl class.

TYVM
No worries, Dave. It's kind of an odd situation. If *I* (a non-employee) go into that building, I have no way of receiving notice (assuming you are correct about there being no other 30.06 signs, and I have no reason to not believe you). So I would be legally carrying. But if discovered, I could take a ride because the building is posted, just not in a very conspicuous place. If that happened, my lawyer gets to ave some fun (at my expense, of course :grumble ). You, OTOH, have received notice (by going through the employee entrance which is posted) and so cannot/should not carry.

Frankly, I think it should be mandated that 30.06 signs should be posted at ALL entrances in order to prevent this kind of.... Stuff....


RottenApple
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Re: Medical Office Building

#21

Post by RottenApple » Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:19 am

hirundo82 wrote:
RottenApple wrote: As for being a teaching office, not an issue unless its OWNED by an accredited teaching hospital. The teaching hospital issue is kinda weird. EVERY hospital has interns, residents, etc. So every hospital can be said to be a "teaching" hospital. IMO, what makes a hospital a true teaching hospital is that it is attached to a medical school. University Hospital in San Antonio or Baylor Dental College for examples.
No, the vast majority of hospitals are not teaching hospitals (no residents, medical students, etc).

And teaching hospitals aren't even explicitly off limit by statute--to be convicted, the prosecutor would have to show they fall under the "school" prohibition of PC46.03 (and I'm not sure you could convince a jury of that--it wouldn't seem to me to fall under what the man on the street would think of as a school).
Please reread what I wrote without reading into it. I didn't say that all hospitals were teaching hospitals. I said that hospitals could be said to be "teaching" hospitals because they have interns, residents, etc.; but what makes a hospital a true teaching hospital is that it is attached to a medical school.

Btw, most hospitals do have interns and residents. At least in urban areas.


hirundo82
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Re: Medical Office Building

#22

Post by hirundo82 » Fri Apr 12, 2013 12:39 am

RottenApple wrote:
hirundo82 wrote:
RottenApple wrote: As for being a teaching office, not an issue unless its OWNED by an accredited teaching hospital. The teaching hospital issue is kinda weird. EVERY hospital has interns, residents, etc. So every hospital can be said to be a "teaching" hospital. IMO, what makes a hospital a true teaching hospital is that it is attached to a medical school. University Hospital in San Antonio or Baylor Dental College for examples.
No, the vast majority of hospitals are not teaching hospitals (no residents, medical students, etc).

And teaching hospitals aren't even explicitly off limit by statute--to be convicted, the prosecutor would have to show they fall under the "school" prohibition of PC46.03 (and I'm not sure you could convince a jury of that--it wouldn't seem to me to fall under what the man on the street would think of as a school).
Please reread what I wrote without reading into it. I didn't say that all hospitals were teaching hospitals. I said that hospitals could be said to be "teaching" hospitals because they have interns, residents, etc.; but what makes a hospital a true teaching hospital is that it is attached to a medical school.

Btw, most hospitals do have interns and residents. At least in urban areas.
Not sure what you mean by a "true teaching hospital"-- by definition, a teaching hospital is one that has residents (trust me--I'm going to be a resident in a couple months).

Few hospitals are owned by medical schools, more are affiliated with medical schools for the purposes of having med students and residents rotate there, and it's still ambiguous what level of involvement is enough to constitute an off-limits area for CHLs.
"The President does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation." Barack Obama, 12/20/2007


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carrydave
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Re: Medical Office Building

#23

Post by carrydave » Fri Apr 12, 2013 6:50 am

i would contens that the school event thing is for school children.

i mean can you not carry at an auto shop because there is a state sponsored welding apprentice program?


we decided were going to contact administration and ask if they intentionaly did not put 30.06 sigm in the private office building so that patients and pricate physicians could carry.


considering they went to lots of trouble to mark EVERY single entrance EXCEPT the main entrances of the provate physician leased office building.

the main hosipital is clearly marked


RottenApple
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Re: Medical Office Building

#24

Post by RottenApple » Fri Apr 12, 2013 9:43 am

hirundo82 wrote:Not sure what you mean by a "true teaching hospital"-- by definition, a teaching hospital is one that has residents (trust me--I'm going to be a resident in a couple months).
I was referring to the legal definition of a teaching hospital. A regular hospital (that also has residents) doesn't meet the qualifications. Take Medical City of Dallas as an example. Interns & residents? Yes. But is it a teaching hospital in the legal definition? No. It's not attached to a medical school and so doesn't qualify as off limits for chl.
hirundo82 wrote:Few hospitals are owned by medical schools, more are affiliated with medical schools for the purposes of having med students and residents rotate there, and it's still ambiguous what level of involvement is enough to constitute an off-limits area for CHLs.
Exactly my point. IMHO, in order to qualify for off limits for CHLs (statutorily, of course, not 30.06), it must be attached to a medical school. University Hospital in San Antonio would be an example of this type. No 30.06 sign needed for that one.


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carrydave
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Re: Medical Office Building

#25

Post by carrydave » Mon Apr 15, 2013 7:00 am

Well we decided to contact administrationand ask if they purposefully neglected to post signage at the MOB entrances because they want to allow patients and private doctors to CCW.

this hospital group is very diligent with posting signs at all major entrances.
So i cant help bit feel they did not post at the office building die to private doctors and their patients occupying the building (paying an arm and leg in rent too)

The bridge that is posted leads to a floor where there are no private physicians i realized just the other day.


my coworker is also very concerned about how vulnerable we are.

The space we rent has only one way in and out, and no window escapes.
in almost 20 years weve only had one patient make us nervous but these days are different.



When we get an official response ill go ahead and post all the info. Im sure some here will visit if they need to see a good doctor in west texas.j


RottenApple
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Re: Medical Office Building

#26

Post by RottenApple » Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:32 am

carrydave wrote:Well we decided to contact administrationand ask if they purposefully neglected to post signage at the MOB entrances because they want to allow patients and private doctors to CCW.

this hospital group is very diligent with posting signs at all major entrances.
So i cant help bit feel they did not post at the office building die to private doctors and their patients occupying the building (paying an arm and leg in rent too)

The bridge that is posted leads to a floor where there are no private physicians i realized just the other day.

my coworker is also very concerned about how vulnerable we are.

The space we rent has only one way in and out, and no window escapes.
in almost 20 years weve only had one patient make us nervous but these days are different.

When we get an official response ill go ahead and post all the info. Im sure some here will visit if they need to see a good doctor in west texas.j
:grumble So if it was an oversight on their part, they'll now post 30.06 signs and prevent anyone else from legally carrying. Great. Why oh why do some people feel the need to poke the bear??? :banghead:


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carrydave
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Re: Medical Office Building

#27

Post by carrydave » Fri Apr 19, 2013 7:17 am

i still think we should have renters rights...


EEllis
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Re: Medical Office Building

#28

Post by EEllis » Fri Apr 19, 2013 9:43 pm

carrydave wrote:i still think we should have renters rights...
You probably o have such rights if it isn't illegal but at the very least it might have to be argued in court after an arrest, I mean how would the average cop know, and I'm sure that it would violate the lease if the employees were ignoring landlords policies.


tommyg
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Re: Medical Office Building

#29

Post by tommyg » Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:08 am

When in Doubt don't carry. Most medical facilities are posted. Doctors like being in danger for some strange reason.
A gun free facility is an open invitation for anyone with an issue to go in shooting . The signs only keep out honest gun owners who might try to stop a disgruntled patient of the Psychiatrist down the hall. Everybody knows that.
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RottenApple
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Re: Medical Office Building

#30

Post by RottenApple » Sun Apr 28, 2013 12:05 pm

tommyg wrote:Most medical facilities are posted.
I don't know about that. Most major hospitals may be posted. But the vast majority of medical facilities, at least in the DFW area, are not posted at all. I've yet to see a posted dialysis center, rehab facility (other than Baylor downtown), eye clinic, etc. And darn few Dr's offices (outside of a hospital) are posted. Heck, it wasn't until 3-6 months ago that Baylor started posting all of their family/community health clinics.

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