CHL used to when buying a gun...

CHL discussions that do not fit into more specific topics

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SQLGeek
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#16

Post by SQLGeek » Sat Jun 21, 2014 9:04 pm

I bought a gun at my local Academy last year and they didn't call it in.
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#17

Post by ldj1002 » Sat Jun 21, 2014 9:39 pm

suthdj wrote:
EEllis wrote:
poppo wrote:
GeekwithaGun wrote:Yes, but some stores will always run a BG Check - :grumble
I would tell them they would not be getting my business.
I've personally never ran into that situation though.
I've bought a lot of guns and I've never run across anyone who wanted to call in after seeing my CHL.
Shoot smart did it to me, the girl said my dl didn't match address on chl never asked about it just ran off closed door and called it in, when i pointed out after the fact her response was "oh". That irritated me off a bit. So I just wont buy a gun there again.
Was it a TX CHL or a non resident chl from another state


rockinar

Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#18

Post by rockinar » Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:36 am

bones281 wrote:I have a question regarding the purchase of a firearms. I recently went to buy a new handgun and I has asked if I had a CHL? at the time I didn't have it so I said no. Now here''s the question, would having a CHL allow me to skip the background check conducted by the store?

They would have to call it in. So the process would take 10 minutes instead of 5.

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jmra
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#19

Post by jmra » Mon Jun 23, 2014 6:17 am

rockinar wrote:
bones281 wrote:I have a question regarding the purchase of a firearms. I recently went to buy a new handgun and I has asked if I had a CHL? at the time I didn't have it so I said no. Now here''s the question, would having a CHL allow me to skip the background check conducted by the store?

They would have to call it in. So the process would take 10 minutes instead of 5.
Or in some cases, days instead of 5 minutes. The NICS system is name based (entering your SS# does absolutely nothing) and is extremely flawed.
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#20

Post by Jnsey » Mon Jun 23, 2014 7:18 am

C-dub wrote:
suthdj wrote:
EEllis wrote:
poppo wrote:
GeekwithaGun wrote:Yes, but some stores will always run a BG Check - :grumble
I would tell them they would not be getting my business.
I've personally never ran into that situation though.
I've bought a lot of guns and I've never run across anyone who wanted to call in after seeing my CHL.
Shoot smart did it to me, the girl said my dl didn't match address on chl never asked about it just ran off closed door and called it in, when i pointed out after the fact her response was "oh". That irritated me off a bit. So I just wont buy a gun there again.
Since they are supposed to match, I wonder if that's why she called it in.
My address on my CHL and CDL don't match, my CHL is my physical address and my CDL is my PO Box. Was told when I got my CDL renewed last that I had to use my PO Box

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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#21

Post by C-dub » Mon Jun 23, 2014 7:22 am

jmra wrote:
rockinar wrote:
bones281 wrote:I have a question regarding the purchase of a firearms. I recently went to buy a new handgun and I has asked if I had a CHL? at the time I didn't have it so I said no. Now here''s the question, would having a CHL allow me to skip the background check conducted by the store?

They would have to call it in. So the process would take 10 minutes instead of 5.
Or in some cases, days instead of 5 minutes. The NICS system is name based (entering your SS# does absolutely nothing) and is extremely flawed.
You guys both lost me here. Bones281 asked if having his CHL would have allowed him to skip the background check. The answer is, Yes. Why would anyone have to call it in? The store may still want to per their own policy, but having the CHL does allow one to skip the background check, right? So, no requirement to make the NICS call, right?
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jmra
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#22

Post by jmra » Mon Jun 23, 2014 8:47 am

C-dub wrote:
jmra wrote:
rockinar wrote:
bones281 wrote:I have a question regarding the purchase of a firearms. I recently went to buy a new handgun and I has asked if I had a CHL? at the time I didn't have it so I said no. Now here''s the question, would having a CHL allow me to skip the background check conducted by the store?

They would have to call it in. So the process would take 10 minutes instead of 5.
Or in some cases, days instead of 5 minutes. The NICS system is name based (entering your SS# does absolutely nothing) and is extremely flawed.
You guys both lost me here. Bones281 asked if having his CHL would have allowed him to skip the background check. The answer is, Yes. Why would anyone have to call it in? The store may still want to per their own policy, but having the CHL does allow one to skip the background check, right? So, no requirement to make the NICS call, right?
I was responding to rockinar's suggestion that a NICS check just meant an additional 5 mins delay. I assume that rockinar was stating that the difference in having a CHL and not having one only adds 5 mins to the purchase process.
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#23

Post by TomsTXCHL » Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:17 am

jmra wrote:The NICS system is name based (entering your SS# does absolutely nothing) and is extremely flawed.
Tell me about the SSN thing. IIRC the "optional" note suggests having it can help--but it's not used at all by the FFL on whatever "Search" screen, or entry screen, that they use to submit for the computer check? Nor on "call-in"?


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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#24

Post by Taltyman » Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:32 am

TomsTXCHL wrote:
jmra wrote:The NICS system is name based (entering your SS# does absolutely nothing) and is extremely flawed.
Tell me about the SSN thing. IIRC the "optional" note suggests having it can help--but it's not used at all by the FFL on whatever "Search" screen, or entry screen, that they use to submit for the computer check? Nor on "call-in"?
It is on the electronic entry form that FFLs and for a manual call in. It is optional but used, what makes you think it isn't? There were some items on the 4473 that were not used on the electronic form submission but several of those were added just this last week to make it more similar to information given for a manual call in.

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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#25

Post by jmra » Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:42 am

TomsTXCHL wrote:
jmra wrote:The NICS system is name based (entering your SS# does absolutely nothing) and is extremely flawed.
Tell me about the SSN thing. IIRC the "optional" note suggests having it can help--but it's not used at all by the FFL on whatever "Search" screen, or entry screen, that they use to submit for the computer check? Nor on "call-in"?
Here's what I know:
I have the same first name, middle initial, last name, and birth date as a convicted felon in NJ. Obviously we have different SS#'s. My first name is in the top 5 of most popular names in the country and my last name is in the top 4. I have never been to NJ.
Because of this I always provided my SS# when purchasing firearms. NICS results were always hit and miss. Half the time no issues other times a day or two delay until my last NICS check (just before my CHL) when I was denied. I immediately called the number the FFL uses for NICS check and spoke to a supervisor.
Of course it was obvious to the supervisor that I was not the same person as the felon (the reason the initial agent used for the denial), but he refused to override the decision because the system is name based and that is the way agents are trained to handle the calls. I informed him that I listed my SS# on the form which should have cleared up any confusion.
His response is what about made me blow my top. SS#s are never used in the NICS process. They are only used in follow up investigations to determine ownership of a firearm.
I haven't undergone a NICS check since getting my CHL, but I don't list my SS# on the form as it does nothing whatsoever to help you. (Ironically the calls from the FBI, or people claiming to be with the FBI, wanting to know if I've ever been to NJ stopped when I got my CHL.)
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jmra
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#26

Post by jmra » Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:50 am

Taltyman wrote:It is optional but used, what makes you think it isn't?
According to multiple supervisors I have spoken to overseeing the NICS program, the SS# is not used in the proceed, delay, or deny NICS procedure. If you have information otherwise I would love to see it.

According to Attorney & Author Cindy Hill, of the more than 100,000 denials issued every year the vast majority are due to issues related to common names. If the system actually utilized SS#s this mistake should never happen, at least not where the applicant listed their SS# on the form which is the case more often than not.
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#27

Post by suthdj » Mon Jun 23, 2014 11:12 am

ldj1002 wrote:
suthdj wrote:
EEllis wrote:
poppo wrote:
GeekwithaGun wrote:Yes, but some stores will always run a BG Check - :grumble
I would tell them they would not be getting my business.
I've personally never ran into that situation though.
I've bought a lot of guns and I've never run across anyone who wanted to call in after seeing my CHL.
Shoot smart did it to me, the girl said my dl didn't match address on chl never asked about it just ran off closed door and called it in, when i pointed out after the fact her response was "oh". That irritated me off a bit. So I just wont buy a gun there again.
Was it a TX CHL or a non resident chl from another state
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#28

Post by jbarn » Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:38 pm

jmra wrote:
Taltyman wrote:It is optional but used, what makes you think it isn't?
According to multiple supervisors I have spoken to overseeing the NICS program, the SS# is not used in the proceed, delay, or deny NICS procedure. If you have information otherwise I would love to see it.

According to Attorney & Author Cindy Hill, of the more than 100,000 denials issued every year the vast majority are due to issues related to common names. If the system actually utilized SS#s this mistake should never happen, at least not where the applicant listed their SS# on the form which is the case more often than not.
Listing your social is only helpful if they have avaliable to them the social of the person with whom you share a name.
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#29

Post by Taltyman » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:21 pm

jmra wrote:
Taltyman wrote:It is optional but used, what makes you think it isn't?
According to multiple supervisors I have spoken to overseeing the NICS program, the SS# is not used in the proceed, delay, or deny NICS procedure. If you have information otherwise I would love to see it.

According to Attorney & Author Cindy Hill, of the more than 100,000 denials issued every year the vast majority are due to issues related to common names. If the system actually utilized SS#s this mistake should never happen, at least not where the applicant listed their SS# on the form which is the case more often than not.
http://www.atf.gov/files/applications/e ... -buyer.pdf says this
The Social Security Number is an optional field, but will help prevent misidentification
However it sounds like it they may not be using it in actuality. Interesting...


TomsTXCHL
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Re: CHL used to when buying a gun...

#30

Post by TomsTXCHL » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:40 pm

jmra wrote:The NICS system is name based (entering your SS# does absolutely nothing) ... my last NICS check (just before my CHL) ...I was denied. I immediately called the number the FFL uses for NICS check and spoke to a supervisor. Of course it was obvious to the supervisor that I was not the same person as the felon (the reason the initial agent used for the denial), but he refused to override the decision because the system is name based and that is the way agents are trained to handle the calls. I informed him that I listed my SS# on the form which should have cleared up any confusion. His response is what about made me blow my top. SS#s are never used in the NICS process. They are only used in follow up investigations to determine ownership of a firearm. I haven't undergone a NICS check since getting my CHL, but I don't list my SS# on the form as it does nothing whatsoever to help you.
I believe all of it--thanks for telling.

I'm sorry now that I put my SSN on a couple of 4473s, though I did this only with a couple of LGS that I trust. Apparently it went no further than that paper and thus their files.

Learn something new every day--Thanks again jmra. :patriot: :txflag:

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