Employers banning guns in parking lots

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Pig Renter
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Employers banning guns in parking lots

#1

Post by Pig Renter » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:10 am

I was just wanting to get y'all's take on laws prohibiting employers from banning guns in locked vehicles in their parking lots.

I'm very appreciative of these laws and they make carrying much more convenient. However at the same time (and I hope hope I don't get ripped too much for saying this) I have a problem with it.

As an American I have a deep appreciation for my rights and the constitution. However, I also feel that the employer's or parking lot owner's property rights be being violated. I feel that if someone owns property they should be able to set their own rules, whether we agree with them or not. Anyone else feel this way or am I dead wrong.


loscar141
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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#2

Post by loscar141 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:17 am

I agree, but at the same time my car is my Property. And what ever I decide to keep in it, is my decision. As long as I don't take it out of my car, what's the problem?
Last edited by loscar141 on Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:23 am, edited 1 time in total.


vjallen75
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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#3

Post by vjallen75 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:20 am

Pig Renter wrote:I was just wanting to get y'all's take on laws prohibiting employers from banning guns in locked vehicles in their parking lots.

I'm very appreciative of these laws and they make carrying much more convenient. However at the same time (and I hope hope I don't get ripped too much for saying this) I have a problem with it.

As an American I have a deep appreciation for my rights and the constitution. However, I also feel that the employer's or parking lot owner's property rights be being violated. I feel that if someone owns property they should be able to set their own rules, whether we agree with them or not. Anyone else feel this way or am I dead wrong.
Pig Renter,

Our vehicles are our property, just like being at home. Would you like it if someone told you you can't carry at home or take your firearm anywhere in your car just because you drive on private/public property? I am in no way trying to bash or make you feel silly, but basically what you are saying is you want to give them their rights but take away your own.
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JALLEN
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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#4

Post by JALLEN » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:28 am

As with a great many principles, when two or more conflict, we try to come to a balance. I can't think of any that are absolute, always, anytime.

In this case, RKBA is balanced against property rights, long a hallowed value in Texas. Not everyone is happy.

Just like you don't have to shop where there are 30.06 signs, you don't have to work for a particular employer. If you don't want firearms on your property, you can ban them, and accept whatever consequences ensue.
Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.

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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#5

Post by oohrah » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:44 am

Pig Renter. The lege disagrees with you as well. Statute prohibits an employer from making rules to not allow an LTC to keep their firearm locked in their vehicle in the employee parking lot, even on campuses.
USMC, Retired
Treating one variety of person as better or worse than others by accident of birth is morally indefensible.


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Pig Renter
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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#6

Post by Pig Renter » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:48 am

vjallen75 wrote:
Pig Renter wrote:I was just wanting to get y'all's take on laws prohibiting employers from banning guns in locked vehicles in their parking lots.

I'm very appreciative of these laws and they make carrying much more convenient. However at the same time (and I hope hope I don't get ripped too much for saying this) I have a problem with it.

As an American I have a deep appreciation for my rights and the constitution. However, I also feel that the employer's or parking lot owner's property rights be being violated. I feel that if someone owns property they should be able to set their own rules, whether we agree with them or not. Anyone else feel this way or am I dead wrong.
Pig Renter,

Our vehicles are our property, just like being at home. Would you like it if someone told you you can't carry at home or take your firearm anywhere in your car just because you drive on private/public property? I am in no way trying to bash or make you feel silly, but basically what you are saying is you want to give them their rights but take away your own.
True. You're car is your property. And no, I wouldn't like it if someone told me I couldn't carry on private property. I truly enjoy the current law. But at the same time just because we "wouldn't like being told we can't carry" somewhere shouldn't trump other people's private property rights.

To me, I basically always equate and look at it as if it were my home and my property. I feel that if you are parked on my property, you are doing so because I allow you that privelage and I should be able to dictate any conditions I want to allow it. Just because your car is your property, it is still on my property. If I don't want tobacco, alcohol, or even Hillary sticker in my driveway, I can dictate those rules also. I just have always been under the mindset and try to remember that the rights listed in the constitution ensure that they can not be infringed by the government, it doesn't ensure our rights cannot be infringed on private property.


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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#7

Post by Pig Renter » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:53 am

oohrah wrote:Pig Renter. The lege disagrees with you as well. Statute prohibits an employer from making rules to not allow an LTC to keep their firearm locked in their vehicle in the employee parking lot, even on campuses.
I understand that that's the current law. And I'm very appreciate of that. Don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to understand the legality of it. Just curious as to if anyone finds any conflict with our right to carry and the rights of private property owners.

I just want to be clear, I'm not advocating for a change in the law. I've just always wondered about how it may be viewed constitutionally.


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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#8

Post by TXBO » Mon Jul 18, 2016 8:57 am

Pig Renter wrote:
vjallen75 wrote:
Pig Renter wrote:I was just wanting to get y'all's take on laws prohibiting employers from banning guns in locked vehicles in their parking lots.

I'm very appreciative of these laws and they make carrying much more convenient. However at the same time (and I hope hope I don't get ripped too much for saying this) I have a problem with it.

As an American I have a deep appreciation for my rights and the constitution. However, I also feel that the employer's or parking lot owner's property rights be being violated. I feel that if someone owns property they should be able to set their own rules, whether we agree with them or not. Anyone else feel this way or am I dead wrong.
Pig Renter,

Our vehicles are our property, just like being at home. Would you like it if someone told you you can't carry at home or take your firearm anywhere in your car just because you drive on private/public property? I am in no way trying to bash or make you feel silly, but basically what you are saying is you want to give them their rights but take away your own.
True. You're car is your property. And no, I wouldn't like it if someone told me I couldn't carry on private property. I truly enjoy the current law. But at the same time just because we "wouldn't like being told we can't carry" somewhere shouldn't trump other people's private property rights.

To me, I basically always equate and look at it as if it were my home and my property. I feel that if you are parked on my property, you are doing so because I allow you that privelage and I should be able to dictate any conditions I want to allow it. Just because your car is your property, it is still on my property. If I don't want tobacco, alcohol, or even Hillary sticker in my driveway, I can dictate those rules also. I just have always been under the mindset and try to remember that the rights listed in the constitution ensure that they can not be infringed by the government, it doesn't ensure our rights cannot be infringed on private property.
Once you open up your property to others for commercial use the rules change. Try posting a sign that states, "No African-Americans allowed".

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mojo84
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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#9

Post by mojo84 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:03 am

The parking lot laws are an effort to balance the two rights. Sometimes living in a civilized society, there are compromises one must suffer. I think the parking lot laws strike a fair balance of the two rights.

I also do not believe this is comparable to race and believe it is a shame that race has to be brought up almost every time we have such a discussion. :roll:
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Pig Renter
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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#10

Post by Pig Renter » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:10 am

TXBO wrote:
Pig Renter wrote:
vjallen75 wrote:
Pig Renter wrote:I was just wanting to get y'all's take on laws prohibiting employers from banning guns in locked vehicles in their parking lots.

I'm very appreciative of these laws and they make carrying much more convenient. However at the same time (and I hope hope I don't get ripped too much for saying this) I have a problem with it.

As an American I have a deep appreciation for my rights and the constitution. However, I also feel that the employer's or parking lot owner's property rights be being violated. I feel that if someone owns property they should be able to set their own rules, whether we agree with them or not. Anyone else feel this way or am I dead wrong.
Pig Renter,

Our vehicles are our property, just like being at home. Would you like it if someone told you you can't carry at home or take your firearm anywhere in your car just because you drive on private/public property? I am in no way trying to bash or make you feel silly, but basically what you are saying is you want to give them their rights but take away your own.
True. You're car is your property. And no, I wouldn't like it if someone told me I couldn't carry on private property. I truly enjoy the current law. But at the same time just because we "wouldn't like being told we can't carry" somewhere shouldn't trump other people's private property rights.

To me, I basically always equate and look at it as if it were my home and my property. I feel that if you are parked on my property, you are doing so because I allow you that privelage and I should be able to dictate any conditions I want to allow it. Just because your car is your property, it is still on my property. If I don't want tobacco, alcohol, or even Hillary sticker in my driveway, I can dictate those rules also. I just have always been under the mindset and try to remember that the rights listed in the constitution ensure that they can not be infringed by the government, it doesn't ensure our rights cannot be infringed on private property.
Once you open up your property to others for commercial use the rules change. Try posting a sign that states, "No African-Americans allowed".
That's true. I admitt that I've always been a little unclear on what's considered public(as in belongs to the people) vs public (as in private but open to all) and the whole public/private/public space divisions are kinda foggy to me as far as legality goes.

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JALLEN
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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#11

Post by JALLEN » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:14 am

There are a number of civil rights categories based on which one cannot discriminate in public accommodations. RKBA is not among those.
Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.


o b juan
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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#12

Post by o b juan » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:18 am

well the nice thing about it is the Company has received Immunity if something did happen in their P L
CHL Instructor since 95'/ School safety Since Jan 17' :patriot:

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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#13

Post by Keith B » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:19 am

Pig Renter wrote:
TXBO wrote:
Once you open up your property to others for commercial use the rules change. Try posting a sign that states, "No African-Americans allowed".
That's true. I admitt that I've always been a little unclear on what's considered public(as in belongs to the people) vs public (as in private but open to all) and the whole public/private/public space divisions are kinda foggy to me as far as legality goes.
Well, that's kind of apples and oranges. Race is a protected class, so you can't prohibit it. Concealed/Open carriers are not.

However, as already mentioned, the legislature passed the law defining that an employer can't prohibit you from keeping a firearm in your locked vehicle (your property), but can prohibit you from removing it and carrying it outside of your vehicle (their property). The main difference is that it was not illegal before to keep it in your car and pass a 30.06 sign, but your employer could legally fire you for it. The new law protects you from wrongful termination for having it in your vehicle in the employer's parking lot.
Keith
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Psalm 82:3-4


TXBO
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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#14

Post by TXBO » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:19 am

Pig Renter wrote:
That's true. I admitt that I've always been a little unclear on what's considered public(as in belongs to the people) vs public (as in private but open to all) and the whole public/private/public space divisions are kinda foggy to me as far as legality goes.
I've been a retailer in many states for almost 30 years. Of all the regulations, allowing guns in cars is probably the least obtrusive of all mandates on what I have to do or can't do with my private property.


loscar141
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Re: Employers banning guns in parking lots

#15

Post by loscar141 » Mon Jul 18, 2016 9:21 am

I'm more of a "don't tell" kind of guy. So I won't tell anyone what I have in my car. If an employer wants to search my car to make sure I'm not breaking any rules I would tell them the same thing I would tell a cop, "get a warrant".
If I get fired for that, I'll be in the unemployment line the next day.

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