“No Firearms on Premises” Sign

CHL discussions that do not fit into more specific topics

Moderators: Charles L. Cotton, carlson1


Topic author
tobymeg1
Junior Member
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:44 am

“No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby tobymeg1 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:32 pm

Walked into a burger joint today and saw the sign mentioned in the title on the hostess bar. Does that sign carry any legal weight? No, 30.06, 30.07, or 51% signs are posted anywhere.

User avatar

carlson1
Moderator
Posts: 9351
Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2005 1:11 am

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby carlson1 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:39 pm

Welcome to the Forum.

The only signs that have any weight for LTC Holders in Texas are 30.06, 30.07, or 51% signs.
Image


Topic author
tobymeg1
Junior Member
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:44 am

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby tobymeg1 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:43 pm

I’ve read something along these lines a while back:
Any private business may post no guns allowed in any format they like. And if you are caught with a gun there are some difficulties you’ll face. When you enter a private business or private property, its not the same as a public space.

And thank you.


apostate
Senior Member
Posts: 2108
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 10:01 am
Location: Houston Texas

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby apostate » Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:43 pm

"Driver carries at least 20 rds of ammo."
I'm too old for this...

User avatar

Grundy1133
Senior Member
Posts: 785
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:18 pm
Location: North Texas

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby Grundy1133 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:18 pm

unless you see a 30.06 and/or 30.07 you're fine. if you see a gun buster sign all they can do is ask you to leave. and if you dont then they can charge you with 30.05 criminal trespass. unless you physically see the 30.06 30.07 signs or they hand you a card that has the 30.06 30.07 penal code written on it, you can carry. (until asked to leave)
NRA Member

User avatar

carlson1
Moderator
Posts: 9351
Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2005 1:11 am

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby carlson1 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 12:23 am

Grundy1133 wrote:unless you see a 30.06 and/or 30.07 you're fine. if you see a gun buster sign all they can do is ask you to leave. and if you dont then they can charge you with 30.05 criminal trespass. unless you physically see the 30.06 30.07 signs or they hand you a card that has the 30.06 30.07 penal code written on it, you can carry. (until asked to leave)


Don’t forget the 51% sign. It is illegal to carry into an establishment that has an income of 51% or greater of their income from alcohol consumption.

An excellent resource.
viewtopic.php?f=53&t=34571
Image


rotor
Senior Member
Posts: 2729
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:26 pm

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby rotor » Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:51 am

I would think that it would not affect carry under 30.06/07 but would keep one from carrying a long gun.

User avatar

Grundy1133
Senior Member
Posts: 785
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:18 pm
Location: North Texas

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby Grundy1133 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 10:56 am

carlson1 wrote:
Grundy1133 wrote:unless you see a 30.06 and/or 30.07 you're fine. if you see a gun buster sign all they can do is ask you to leave. and if you dont then they can charge you with 30.05 criminal trespass. unless you physically see the 30.06 30.07 signs or they hand you a card that has the 30.06 30.07 penal code written on it, you can carry. (until asked to leave)


Don’t forget the 51% sign. It is illegal to carry into an establishment that has an income of 51% or greater of their income from alcohol consumption.

An excellent resource.
http://texaschlforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=34571

Well yeah... I just figured some threw up a "no guns" sign. I'm hoping OP already knew about the 51% signs lol
NRA Member


chasfm11
Senior Member
Posts: 3234
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:01 pm
Location: Northern DFW

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby chasfm11 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 11:41 am

Based on businesses like Buffalo Wild Wings, my expectation is that a business that posts any kind of a "no firearms" sign believes that they are restricting guns for anyone including those with licenses. Some businesses appear to be too lazy to do the State by State research and assume that what works in one State, works in another. I proceed with "concealed is concealed" but make sure that I'm not in a "barely concealed" setup. I've gotten more careless about that since OC passed in Texas. I'm always ready to respond, sign or not, to a verbal instruction to leave. If they don't want me there, I sure don't want to be there. We travel from State to State and I do look carefully in advance at the States where any sign carries the weight of law. Otherwise, I go about my business. I've OC enough to understand that most people aren't paying attention, even when the gun is visible.

I was just in a plumbing store last week. They had a 30.06 sign beside the front door - behind tinted glass that made it almost impossible to see standing right next to it. No way did it meet the tests for visibility in the TPC but there it was and I'm certain that they would have enforced it if I had been detected carrying there. I wasn't and have no plans to return. I'm betting that there is little difference in the mind set of many of the business owners with the "no firearms" signs and those who push the 30.06 sign requirements beyond their limits. It is just two different ways to get to the same point.
6/23-8/13/10 -51 days to plastic
Dun Spiro Spero

User avatar

Grundy1133
Senior Member
Posts: 785
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:18 pm
Location: North Texas

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby Grundy1133 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 12:50 pm

chasfm11 wrote:Based on businesses like Buffalo Wild Wings, my expectation is that a business that posts any kind of a "no firearms" sign believes that they are restricting guns for anyone including those with licenses. Some businesses appear to be too lazy to do the State by State research and assume that what works in one State, works in another. I proceed with "concealed is concealed" but make sure that I'm not in a "barely concealed" setup. I've gotten more careless about that since OC passed in Texas. I'm always ready to respond, sign or not, to a verbal instruction to leave. If they don't want me there, I sure don't want to be there. We travel from State to State and I do look carefully in advance at the States where any sign carries the weight of law. Otherwise, I go about my business. I've OC enough to understand that most people aren't paying attention, even when the gun is visible.

I was just in a plumbing store last week. They had a 30.06 sign beside the front door - behind tinted glass that made it almost impossible to see standing right next to it. No way did it meet the tests for visibility in the TPC but there it was and I'm certain that they would have enforced it if I had been detected carrying there. I wasn't and have no plans to return. I'm betting that there is little difference in the mind set of many of the business owners with the "no firearms" signs and those who push the 30.06 sign requirements beyond their limits. It is just two different ways to get to the same point.

regardless of the business owners mindset, gun buster signs or "no firearms" signs aren't legally binding. only the 30.06 30.07 and 51% signs are.... like i said worst case scenario, they ask you to leave, cause legally that's all they can do. If they do ask you to leave just give a little nod and say thank you and walk out and never come back. :thumbs2:
NRA Member


rotor
Senior Member
Posts: 2729
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:26 pm

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby rotor » Mon Mar 12, 2018 1:11 pm

Grundy1133 wrote:
chasfm11 wrote:Based on businesses like Buffalo Wild Wings, my expectation is that a business that posts any kind of a "no firearms" sign believes that they are restricting guns for anyone including those with licenses. Some businesses appear to be too lazy to do the State by State research and assume that what works in one State, works in another. I proceed with "concealed is concealed" but make sure that I'm not in a "barely concealed" setup. I've gotten more careless about that since OC passed in Texas. I'm always ready to respond, sign or not, to a verbal instruction to leave. If they don't want me there, I sure don't want to be there. We travel from State to State and I do look carefully in advance at the States where any sign carries the weight of law. Otherwise, I go about my business. I've OC enough to understand that most people aren't paying attention, even when the gun is visible.

I was just in a plumbing store last week. They had a 30.06 sign beside the front door - behind tinted glass that made it almost impossible to see standing right next to it. No way did it meet the tests for visibility in the TPC but there it was and I'm certain that they would have enforced it if I had been detected carrying there. I wasn't and have no plans to return. I'm betting that there is little difference in the mind set of many of the business owners with the "no firearms" signs and those who push the 30.06 sign requirements beyond their limits. It is just two different ways to get to the same point.

regardless of the business owners mindset, gun buster signs or "no firearms" signs aren't legally binding. only the 30.06 30.07 and 51% signs are.... like i said worst case scenario, they ask you to leave, cause legally that's all they can do. If they do ask you to leave just give a little nod and say thank you and walk out and never come back. :thumbs2:

Are you sure? What happens if you have a long gun? Are you trespassing carrying past a no firearms sign with a long gun? Your LTC means nothing in this situation. A long gun is a firearm, correct?

User avatar

Grundy1133
Senior Member
Posts: 785
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:18 pm
Location: North Texas

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby Grundy1133 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 1:45 pm

rotor wrote:
Grundy1133 wrote:
chasfm11 wrote:Based on businesses like Buffalo Wild Wings, my expectation is that a business that posts any kind of a "no firearms" sign believes that they are restricting guns for anyone including those with licenses. Some businesses appear to be too lazy to do the State by State research and assume that what works in one State, works in another. I proceed with "concealed is concealed" but make sure that I'm not in a "barely concealed" setup. I've gotten more careless about that since OC passed in Texas. I'm always ready to respond, sign or not, to a verbal instruction to leave. If they don't want me there, I sure don't want to be there. We travel from State to State and I do look carefully in advance at the States where any sign carries the weight of law. Otherwise, I go about my business. I've OC enough to understand that most people aren't paying attention, even when the gun is visible.

I was just in a plumbing store last week. They had a 30.06 sign beside the front door - behind tinted glass that made it almost impossible to see standing right next to it. No way did it meet the tests for visibility in the TPC but there it was and I'm certain that they would have enforced it if I had been detected carrying there. I wasn't and have no plans to return. I'm betting that there is little difference in the mind set of many of the business owners with the "no firearms" signs and those who push the 30.06 sign requirements beyond their limits. It is just two different ways to get to the same point.

regardless of the business owners mindset, gun buster signs or "no firearms" signs aren't legally binding. only the 30.06 30.07 and 51% signs are.... like i said worst case scenario, they ask you to leave, cause legally that's all they can do. If they do ask you to leave just give a little nod and say thank you and walk out and never come back. :thumbs2:

Are you sure? What happens if you have a long gun? Are you trespassing carrying past a no firearms sign with a long gun? Your LTC means nothing in this situation. A long gun is a firearm, correct?

this is a LTC/CHL forum... if you wanna talk about rifles theres a whole sub section designated to shotguns and rifles... viewforum.php?f=87
NRA Member


rotor
Senior Member
Posts: 2729
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:26 pm

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby rotor » Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:02 pm

Grundy1133 wrote:
rotor wrote:
Grundy1133 wrote:
chasfm11 wrote:Based on businesses like Buffalo Wild Wings, my expectation is that a business that posts any kind of a "no firearms" sign believes that they are restricting guns for anyone including those with licenses. Some businesses appear to be too lazy to do the State by State research and assume that what works in one State, works in another. I proceed with "concealed is concealed" but make sure that I'm not in a "barely concealed" setup. I've gotten more careless about that since OC passed in Texas. I'm always ready to respond, sign or not, to a verbal instruction to leave. If they don't want me there, I sure don't want to be there. We travel from State to State and I do look carefully in advance at the States where any sign carries the weight of law. Otherwise, I go about my business. I've OC enough to understand that most people aren't paying attention, even when the gun is visible.

I was just in a plumbing store last week. They had a 30.06 sign beside the front door - behind tinted glass that made it almost impossible to see standing right next to it. No way did it meet the tests for visibility in the TPC but there it was and I'm certain that they would have enforced it if I had been detected carrying there. I wasn't and have no plans to return. I'm betting that there is little difference in the mind set of many of the business owners with the "no firearms" signs and those who push the 30.06 sign requirements beyond their limits. It is just two different ways to get to the same point.

regardless of the business owners mindset, gun buster signs or "no firearms" signs aren't legally binding. only the 30.06 30.07 and 51% signs are.... like i said worst case scenario, they ask you to leave, cause legally that's all they can do. If they do ask you to leave just give a little nod and say thank you and walk out and never come back. :thumbs2:

Are you sure? What happens if you have a long gun? Are you trespassing carrying past a no firearms sign with a long gun? Your LTC means nothing in this situation. A long gun is a firearm, correct?

this is a LTC/CHL forum... if you wanna talk about rifles theres a whole sub section designated to shotguns and rifles... viewforum.php?f=87

The OP asked if the sign carried any legal weight. My contention is that the sign does carry legal weight but not for LTC users carrying a hand gun. Similarly, a 30.06/07 sign does not prevent one from carrying a concealed rifle like a Kel-Tec sub-2000 or even an open long gun. This has been discussed many times on this forum. Your blanket statement about the signs not being legally binding I believe to be incorrect in relation to long gun firearms. Have a good day.

User avatar

Grundy1133
Senior Member
Posts: 785
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:18 pm
Location: North Texas

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby Grundy1133 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:11 pm

rotor wrote:
Grundy1133 wrote:
rotor wrote:
Grundy1133 wrote:
chasfm11 wrote:Based on businesses like Buffalo Wild Wings, my expectation is that a business that posts any kind of a "no firearms" sign believes that they are restricting guns for anyone including those with licenses. Some businesses appear to be too lazy to do the State by State research and assume that what works in one State, works in another. I proceed with "concealed is concealed" but make sure that I'm not in a "barely concealed" setup. I've gotten more careless about that since OC passed in Texas. I'm always ready to respond, sign or not, to a verbal instruction to leave. If they don't want me there, I sure don't want to be there. We travel from State to State and I do look carefully in advance at the States where any sign carries the weight of law. Otherwise, I go about my business. I've OC enough to understand that most people aren't paying attention, even when the gun is visible.

I was just in a plumbing store last week. They had a 30.06 sign beside the front door - behind tinted glass that made it almost impossible to see standing right next to it. No way did it meet the tests for visibility in the TPC but there it was and I'm certain that they would have enforced it if I had been detected carrying there. I wasn't and have no plans to return. I'm betting that there is little difference in the mind set of many of the business owners with the "no firearms" signs and those who push the 30.06 sign requirements beyond their limits. It is just two different ways to get to the same point.

regardless of the business owners mindset, gun buster signs or "no firearms" signs aren't legally binding. only the 30.06 30.07 and 51% signs are.... like i said worst case scenario, they ask you to leave, cause legally that's all they can do. If they do ask you to leave just give a little nod and say thank you and walk out and never come back. :thumbs2:

Are you sure? What happens if you have a long gun? Are you trespassing carrying past a no firearms sign with a long gun? Your LTC means nothing in this situation. A long gun is a firearm, correct?

this is a LTC/CHL forum... if you wanna talk about rifles theres a whole sub section designated to shotguns and rifles... viewforum.php?f=87

The OP asked if the sign carried any legal weight. My contention is that the sign does carry legal weight but not for LTC users carrying a hand gun. Similarly, a 30.06/07 sign does not prevent one from carrying a concealed rifle like a Kel-Tec sub-2000 or even an open long gun. This has been discussed many times on this forum. Your blanket statement about the signs not being legally binding I believe to be incorrect in relation to long gun firearms. Have a good day.

but the topic is posted under the "General Texas CHL Discussion" forum which implies he's referring to CC/OC. Have a great day. ;-)
NRA Member

User avatar

ScottDLS
Senior Member
Posts: 4162
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 1:04 am
Location: DFW Area, TX

Re: “No Firearms on Premises” Sign

Postby ScottDLS » Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:33 pm

I’m not convinced that a no firearms sign would allow you to be convicted of criminal trespass for carrying a concealed rifle. It does not seem to me to make it clear that your entrance and remaining on the property is prohibited as required by 30.05
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"


Return to “General Texas CHL Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests