WildRose wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 11:20 am
Jusme wrote: ↑Tue Sep 11, 2018 5:22 am
WildRose wrote: ↑Mon Sep 10, 2018 10:04 pm
chasfm11 wrote: ↑Mon Sep 10, 2018 6:47 am
Jusme wrote: ↑Mon Sep 10, 2018 5:59 am
There will always be backlash, from the left, any time, restrictions, on LTC holders, are reduced, but, we have had open carry passed, without incident, campus carry passed, without incident etc. So my question is, why do you think, that LTC holders would suddenly go on shooting rampages, in courtrooms, schools, etc?
This has been a central point of many of my discussions with people about teachers carrying guns in schools. I've nicknamed it "situational schizophrenia" When I've chipped away at it, I've found that they really don't believe that the school environment poses any greater risk to LTC holder shooting the place up. It is that the schizophrenia could really kick in anywhere and they just don't want it to be in the schools. I've talked about the fact that many teachers have LTCs and carry in places where the teachers might meet their students like Wal-Mart without lethal results. As usual, there is complete denial of that as a current reality and the opponents switch back to "well it could happen and it would be terrible."
All of us are walking time bombs and all they are trying to do is limit the places that we might go off. Some places are just more sensitive to the denotation than others. I've gotten no traction at all with the notion that someone with lethal intentions could just wait for an opportunity outside of the courtroom to murder a judge or a prosecutor, as has actually happened in a few cases. The crazy thing is the idea that someone with those ideas would obey the laws on carrying a gun while disobeying the laws on murder is another concept that gets brushed aside. The possibility of a "heat of the moment" response trumps all of that. If you listen to the anti-guns within the medical establishment, they pretty much use the same line as a reason for posting medical facilities.
Anyone who's spent much time in a courtroom or watched such things as court TV realizes that it's an incredibly high stress environment where it's not particularly uncommon for people to flat out loose it and occasionally launch attacks against the LEO's, perp's on trial or even judges.
I just can't see it ever being allowed and I think if it were it would end badly for us.
My point is that LEO, are no different, than anyone else, yet, they are allowed to carry into any courtroom,, or schools, even off duty. They are subject to just as much stress, as anyone else, and they don't have the track record of being as law abiding, as LTC holders. LTC holders, have proven themselves, to be the "coolest heads in the room" in nearly all circumstances. The pushback for campus carry was tremendous, remember?
There was going to be massive numbers of professors killed, for their teaching methods, giving bad grades, etc. There was going to be shootouts between students, at drunken parties. None of that has happened.
Open carry was going to result, in blood running ankle deep in the streets, shootouts at high noon, people running for their lives, when they (gasp) saw someone carrying a gun. Again, nothing. People, who are going to shoot someone over a court case, are going to do it outside of a courtroom, where they have armed security. And no restrictions, will prevent it. LTC holders, have stepped up to the plate, to defend others when there are no LEO, around, LTC holders, with children, will be even better security in schools, than LEO as we have seen in recent events in Florida.
There are no guarantees, that an LTC holder, won't misuse, his/her gun. But history, is on our side. JMHO
Leo's are not the defendants, their families etc involved in the cases before the court. When they are, they too are disarmed.
History teaches us that given enough opportunity bad things will happen and should something like this pass, when the bad thing does happen the backlash will go far beyond the courtroom.
LEO can carry in courtrooms, even off duty, in cases involving their own divorces, and child custody hearings. I know, because I did so, and I know of others who have done so. If an LTC holder, is a defendant, in a felony trial, his LTC is usually suspended, pending the outcome, so it's a moot point. Most LTC holders, will be going into courtrooms, as either witnesses, or jurors, not defendants, and if history has taught us anything, it's that LTC holders, are more law abiding, and less likely, to resort to violence, in almost any given circumstance.
There are no guarantees, in life, just like there is no guarantee, that a defendant didn't figure out a way, to get a gun past security, and suddenly aim it at the LTC holder testifying against him. Or the jurors, who just handed down a guilty verdict. Or that he is waiting outside, to ambush an LTC holder, who had to leave their gun in their vehicle, to enter a courtroom. All of these things have proven to be more likely, than an LTC holder erupting in violence.Why are judges allowed to carry in courtrooms? are their lives, more valuable that anyone else's?
The left has presented, no solid argument, against, LTC holders carrying where LEO are allowed. other than the ones you have put forward, relating to it only being a matter of time. Yet, time has moved along, for the last 20+ years, and none of the things the left claimed would happen, have happened. Preemptive prohibition, against the possibility,of something, is how we got laws prohibiting carry, in the first place. JMHO