Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

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RoyGBiv
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#16

Post by RoyGBiv » Wed Aug 28, 2019 9:17 am

AJSully421 wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 5:29 pm
I am also a licensed Body Guard and my wife and kids are under contract, so I am not subject to 30.06/07 or 46.035 anyhow.
A very interesting plan. Must research further. :thumbs2:
I am not a lawyer. This is NOT legal advice.!
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DEB
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#17

Post by DEB » Wed Aug 28, 2019 1:28 pm

What would Orrin Porter Rockwell say? I agree, this statement or prohibition, is from Man not God.
Unless we keep the barbarian virtues, gaining the civilized ones will be of little avail. Oversentimentality, oversoftness, washiness, and mushiness are the great dangers of this age and of this people." Teddy Roosevelt"
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robster
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#18

Post by robster » Tue Sep 03, 2019 4:39 pm

They did it... They graduated it from non-binding handbook policy to legal oral notification by reading an official statement from the church's Southwest Area leaders. I am not happy with this flawed policy.

(1) The statement indicated that Texas had made it legal effective 9/1 to carry weapons in church. Someone has been listening to flawed news reports rather than being familiar with the law. 46.035(i) legalized it many years ago. Whether they knew it or not, they already ran a years-long field trial where concealed carry was legally allowed in the church, and license holders didn't cause any problems. If they were trying to nip this in the bud before people started legally carrying at church, they missed the chance by several years.

(2) The rationale about being a safe haven for worship doesn't fit the decision to be a gun-free zone. My idea of a safe haven for worship is one where I don't wonder if someone is going to come in and start shooting without resistance.

But wait, off-duty police officers can carry! Ok, that's gonna be somewhere between 0 and 2 people in the whole building on any given day, which is inadequate. It's still easier for me to carry a pistol than a policeman.

LDS church members, let your bishop and stake president know this policy is wrong, and ask them to send that feedback up the chain. Policy is not doctrine. Sometimes policy is wrong and can be changed. There's a history of that in other matters.

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narcissist
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#19

Post by narcissist » Tue Sep 03, 2019 6:52 pm

RoyGBiv wrote:
Wed Aug 28, 2019 9:17 am
AJSully421 wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 5:29 pm
I am also a licensed Body Guard and my wife and kids are under contract, so I am not subject to 30.06/07 or 46.035 anyhow.
A very interesting plan. Must research further. :thumbs2:
I read up on this and if I understand it correctly it only takes a 15 hour course, going to be signing up for this very soon.
One of my biggest mistakes in life...Is Believing people will show me the same love I've shown them. :reddevil

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Oldgringo
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#20

Post by Oldgringo » Tue Sep 03, 2019 8:21 pm

BTW, the FUMC's official position is very anti-gun. Our last FUMC preacher didn't want guns in church. :roll: He was hooted down in short order. On any given Sunday, our small congregation may be packing as many as a half dozen concealed handguns.

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ScottDLS
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#21

Post by ScottDLS » Tue Sep 03, 2019 8:39 pm

AJSully421 wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 5:29 pm
I will not comply. My rear end and my gun will be in the pews for Sacrament Meeting this Sunday... just like always. This is man’s policy, not God’s. Put in armed guards and metal detectors if you want to stop me.

I am also a licensed Body Guard and my wife and kids are under contract, so I am not subject to 30.06/07 or 46.035 anyhow.
As of Sunday 46.035 is no longer relevant to church carry anyway, or so I hear.
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"

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Oldgringo
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#22

Post by Oldgringo » Tue Sep 03, 2019 10:23 pm

ScottDLS wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 8:39 pm
AJSully421 wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 5:29 pm
I will not comply. My rear end and my gun will be in the pews for Sacrament Meeting this Sunday... just like always. This is man’s policy, not God’s. Put in armed guards and metal detectors if you want to stop me.

I am also a licensed Body Guard and my wife and kids are under contract, so I am not subject to 30.06/07 or 46.035 anyhow.
As of Sunday 46.035 is no longer relevant to church carry anyway, or so I hear.
Hmmm? :headscratch I think that particular Gov's announcement was intended for those who choose the anonymous Drive-Up windows at the Texas liquor stores. I think the boss of the congregation, like the boss of a business, can still tell you to vamanos with your gun? The choice, of each, remains up to you. :cool:

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John Galt
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#23

Post by John Galt » Tue Sep 03, 2019 10:25 pm

LucasMcCain wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:22 am
Do you want your churches to be targeted for shootings? Because that's how you get your churches to be targeted for shootings.
:iagree:

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ScottDLS
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#24

Post by ScottDLS » Tue Sep 03, 2019 11:18 pm

Oldgringo wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 10:23 pm
ScottDLS wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 8:39 pm
AJSully421 wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 5:29 pm
I will not comply. My rear end and my gun will be in the pews for Sacrament Meeting this Sunday... just like always. This is man’s policy, not God’s. Put in armed guards and metal detectors if you want to stop me.

I am also a licensed Body Guard and my wife and kids are under contract, so I am not subject to 30.06/07 or 46.035 anyhow.
As of Sunday 46.035 is no longer relevant to church carry anyway, or so I hear.
Hmmm? :headscratch I think that particular Gov's announcement was intended for those who choose the anonymous Drive-Up windows at the Texas liquor stores. I think the boss of the congregation, like the boss of a business, can still tell you to vamanos with your gun? The choice, of each, remains up to you. :cool:
The Church carry has been removed as an offense under 46.035, leaving only 30:06/7. It used to be a separate offense under 46.035 IF a Church was 30.067 posted and was a class A misdemeanor. Now it’s only a 30.06/7 offense if posted - class C misdemeanor (I.e. no jail, ticket). I’ll be really interested to see if the LDS post their Churches in Texas. I suspect they won’t. Interestingly the Catholic Churches in Ft. Worth and Dallas Dioceses were posted for a time until after the Southerland Springs shooting, then viola ugly signs gone. Supposedly the “party line” is that it is still prohibited, but I personally have not received notice... in fact, a couple months ago I was attending Mass with Mrs. ScottDLS and parish priest made announcement of training for volunteer church security to be held by a private security firm. He specifically asked for ex-military and LTC holders with firearms training. And I always thought the Swiss guards handled all that... Anyway, being Methodist myself I wasn’t sure if I was included in the call given my status as one of John Wesley’s flock, rather than a practicing member of St. Peter’s “original” church. ;-)
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"

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AJSully421
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#25

Post by AJSully421 » Wed Sep 04, 2019 8:08 am

narcissist wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 6:52 pm
RoyGBiv wrote:
Wed Aug 28, 2019 9:17 am
AJSully421 wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 5:29 pm
I am also a licensed Body Guard and my wife and kids are under contract, so I am not subject to 30.06/07 or 46.035 anyhow.
A very interesting plan. Must research further. :thumbs2:
I read up on this and if I understand it correctly it only takes a 15 hour course, going to be signing up for this very soon.
Very wrong info... the body guard training class is 16 hours, but you have to also do Armed Security training first. (40 hours)... and you cannot just go out and be a body guard or security, you have to be employed by a state licensed company, and there is not one company in Texas that will employ you as a body guard without extensive Security / Mil / LEO experience, and even then, most want at least 6 months of full-time service with their company before they will sponsor you for body guard.

In short, it ain’t something that you go bang out in a two-day class...
"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so." - Ronald Reagan, 1964

30.06 signs only make criminals and terrorists safer.

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narcissist
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#26

Post by narcissist » Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:49 pm

AJSully421 wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 8:08 am
narcissist wrote:
Tue Sep 03, 2019 6:52 pm
RoyGBiv wrote:
Wed Aug 28, 2019 9:17 am
AJSully421 wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 5:29 pm
I am also a licensed Body Guard and my wife and kids are under contract, so I am not subject to 30.06/07 or 46.035 anyhow.
A very interesting plan. Must research further. :thumbs2:
I read up on this and if I understand it correctly it only takes a 15 hour course, going to be signing up for this very soon.
Very wrong info... the body guard training class is 16 hours, but you have to also do Armed Security training first. (40 hours)... and you cannot just go out and be a body guard or security, you have to be employed by a state licensed company, and there is not one company in Texas that will employ you as a body guard without extensive Security / Mil / LEO experience, and even then, most want at least 6 months of full-time service with their company before they will sponsor you for body guard.

In short, it ain’t something that you go bang out in a two-day class...
Good to know, thanks
One of my biggest mistakes in life...Is Believing people will show me the same love I've shown them. :reddevil

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