Transferring A Weapon To Someone in California.

[Liberty]

I just got a text from my niece asking about buying a gun online.

She is in her 30's with 2 twin toddlers, very panicky about the Corona crisis, but she a very responsible although she has a lot of California mentality in her. Her husband is familiar with guns, and I have given her some very fundamental training at a Texas range. She is a pretty good shot but could use some self-defense training.

I told her that it is a complex process to buy online most dealers don't want to deal with California sales. A look online reveals that she has some good dealers in her neighboring towns, Probably finding someone who would do an FFL transfer wouldn't be too difficult. They do own one gun, I don't know if it is a handgun or not.

My questions are:

What is the status of Magazines there? The Guns I would send (Through an FFL) them are 15 rounders. Can I send them magazines directly? These are older guns and the mags may be grandfathered. I am pretty sure the Ruger P95 or Beretta 92 are on their approved list.

Will gun broker or other online places ship to California?

Are there any big box chain stores like Acadamy in California that sell guns?


I will seriously recommend that she come here for a while, but I don't think it's gonna happen.

[03Lightningrocks]

Good gosh! Looking at this site it appears buying a hand gun in Kalifornia is a challenge. I can understand why online retailers would not want to ship there. I am not even sure they can anyway. I did find that 10 round is max allowed magazine capacity.

https://oag.ca.gov/firearms

[strogg]

What part of California? Despite its reputation, purchasing a firearm there is not all that difficult. It's very unconstitutional, but not difficult. She'll have to take a basic test at any FFL to get a permit to purchase a firearm (really basic gun safety and mechanics), then she will fill out a 4473 for the firearm and pay. Upon submission of paperwork, the FFL will ask for a second form of proof that she lives at the address listed on her ID. 99% of the time, people just provide the car registration of the vehicle they drove to the FFL with. After verification, the dealer will fill out a DROS (dealer record of sale) that gets submitted to the CA DOJ. Once complete, she can pick up the gun 240 hours later.

To buy ammo, it's pretty similar. That permit will allow her to buy ammo. The dealer will fill out another DROS, but she'll be able to walk out of the store with the ammo right then and there.

As for big box outdoor type stores, Academy is nonexistent in CA. They do, however, have Sportsman's Warehouse and Bass Pro in some areas. For just long guns, BIg 5 comes to mind. Walmart is out of the question, as none in CA sell guns or ammo anymore and haven't for years. She's probably best going to a regular LGS if no big box stores are available.

For online orders, Rifle Gear out of Plano, Grab a gun, and Buds Gun will most definitely ship to CA. I've done both Rifle Gear and Buds Gun before. Just keep in mind that FFLs will usually charge an exorbitant fee for transfers. I've seen some stores charge $200 or more. If she can find a home based FFL or a very small time shop, she can probably get away with $50-75 for a transfer. Once the gun arrives at the FFL, she can go do the whole 4473/DROS transaction and wait the mandatory 240 hours.

If you want to sell her a handgun, it needs to be on the handgun roster (VERY specific model numbers/names. Be very careful!), any single action revolver, or any single shot pistol. Funny enough, the last one is how some people in CA magically have AR pistols using 80% lowers. I think they closed that loophole, though. But anyhow, the firearm must be shipped to an FFL. Be sure to include her name and contact information in the box. FTF private party transfers are not allowed.

For magazines, 10 is the limit. Technically, you can ship whatever you want. Just know that it's very illegal to ship someone anything that holds more than 10 rounds unless it's to an FFL. The FFL can receive the standard and high capacity magazines, but they wont' be able sell them. Odds are, they'll just destroy them. They can, however, permanently make it hold 10 by adding follower blocks and rivets to prevent the blocks from being removed before the resell them to the general public. I did that one time with a bunch of AK mags. An FFL had a sale on them, so I bought a bucket load. When I moved to Texas, I just popped the rivets and turned them back into 30 rounders. The only evidence of the modification is just an 1/8" hole that you can barely see.

Lastly, IANAL. Don't take anything above as legal advice.

[srothstein]

I could be wrong because I do not stay up on California laws but I think they are pretty strict on which guns are legal there. I think you might need to check with California on what guns are allowed. I know the magazines are limited to 10 rounds only and it would make her a felon to own one that is not that capacity. As I understand it, only specific models can be sold or shipped to California. And I do mean very specific models that have been submitted for their approval. When I was involved with a customized Colt 1911 for the MP anniversary, California residents could not order them because they had a different model number than the 1911 that had been submitted for approval there. If you want to ship one of your weapons to her through an FFL, the dealer there should be able to tell if it is approved or not before you do it.

I think she can buy through the Cabela's/Bass pro web site for delivery at one of their stores in California. That would note right on it if it is an approved model for California.

[Liberty]

Thanks, I found it odd that my old Ruger P95, used to be on the list but it isn't on their newer list of approved. I suppose I could send her my Beretta p92fs which is still on the list. Suddenly a known safe gun, is now unsafe?

[strogg]

Thanks, I found it odd that my old Ruger P95, used to be on the list but it isn't on their newer list of approved. I suppose I could send her my Beretta p92fs which is still on the list. Suddenly a known safe gun, is now unsafe?

The manufacturers need to renew the entries on the list annually. If the gun is no longer made, there is no reason for it to be on the list, so the manufacturer may drop it to save money.

I am sooooo glad I got out of that state.

[SewTexas]

on a FB womens gun group there was a discussion about this, and the way I understood this, and I could have understood it completely wrong, but the way I understood it, if you gift a gun to someone in CA, it can be off list. I will admit, I didn't understand the conversation completely since I have very few connections to CA anymore.

[strogg]

on a FB womens gun group there was a discussion about this, and the way I understood this, and I could have understood it completely wrong, but the way I understood it, if you gift a gun to someone in CA, it can be off list. I will admit, I didn't understand the conversation completely since I have very few connections to CA anymore.

That is true, BUT it needs to be through family, and only vertically. You can't gift to your sibling, but you can (grand)parent or (grand)child. That is the most common way off roster firearms end up in the peoples republic. Once entered, they can be sold via private party transfers to anyone in the state so long as they both meet at the FFL for a three-way face to face transfer (buyer, seller, and FFL). No shipping to FFL allowed. As you can imagine, firearms of that sort are rare and command a very high price. Imagine paying $900 for a Gen 5 Glock 17. Or a SIG P365 SAS for $1300. Or $2000 for a SIG P320 Legion. Or $1000 for a Glock 43x. Unfortunately, you will never see the likes of the FNX 45 Tactical or the M9A3 in CA due to the threaded barrel. Those are a big no-no.

[Liberty]

OK, I can gift it to her mother, her mother can gift it to her. Her mother is in Texas, do we need to go through an FFL?

[strogg]

OK, I can gift it to her mother, her mother can gift it to her. Her mother is in Texas, do we need to go through an FFL?

You can gift it / sell it to her mother assuming she's not a prohibited person. Once she takes possession, she'll need to send it to a CA FFL per federal law. Here's a website that describes everything in detail: http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/index ... ly_Members

Suppose you live in California, and your grandparent lives in Texas. Your grandparent wants to give you a pistol as a gift.

Since your grandparent is yet living, this transfer is not an inheritance.
Because it is interstate, Texas to California, the pistol must go to a CA FFL - the receiver may not take possession until the transfer has occurred at the CA FFL - so
CALL the FFL ahead of time to see if he understands interstate intrafamilial transfer; any FFL who suggests you do not need his services for an interstate intrafamilial transfer does NOT understand it.
ASK about the fees; there are no regulations limiting the transfer fees on interstate transfer.
ASK whether the FFL will accept a shipment from a non-licensed person; that is legal, but some have a business practice to accept only from other licensed persons.
Handguns transferred via intrafamilial transfer are NOT subject to the Roster.
Handguns should be accompanied by a letter of gift, specifying giver's name and relationship (e.g. John Smith, Grandfather), the handgun (e.g. Glock 17 9mm pistol, serial 12345), and the receiver's name (e.g. Little Jimmy Smith).
Since the transfer must use a CA FFL, the ordinary rules for an FFL transfer must be followed, including background check and 10-day wait. The receiver should be at least 18 years old for a long gun, 21 for a handgun; if a handgun, the receiver may have an unexpired Handgun Safety Certificate; otherwise, from 2015 forward, a Firearms Safety Certificate is required for any firearm.
The FFL should use the DROS "Curio/Relic/Exempt" process, and add a comment "27870PC intrafamily transfer".

[SewTexas]

on a FB womens gun group there was a discussion about this, and the way I understood this, and I could have understood it completely wrong, but the way I understood it, if you gift a gun to someone in CA, it can be off list. I will admit, I didn't understand the conversation completely since I have very few connections to CA anymore.

That is true, BUT it needs to be through family, and only vertically. You can't gift to your sibling, but you can (grand)parent or (grand)child. That is the most common way off roster firearms end up in the peoples republic. Once entered, they can be sold via private party transfers to anyone in the state so long as they both meet at the FFL for a three-way face to face transfer (buyer, seller, and FFL). No shipping to FFL allowed. As you can imagine, firearms of that sort are rare and command a very high price. Imagine paying $900 for a Gen 5 Glock 17. Or a SIG P365 SAS for $1300. Or $2000 for a SIG P320 Legion. Or $1000 for a Glock 43x. Unfortunately, you will never see the likes of the FNX 45 Tactical or the M9A3 in CA due to the threaded barrel. Those are a big no-no.

yes, they were saying the off-roster guns go for a higher price, but these were ladies who wouldn't think of selling them. And, yeh, not that I remember it, I think they were saying that their parents were the ones sending them the guns.

[Liberty]

Kewl, I once again, Thanks for your help... I have a pretty good understanding now of how I can do it.
My mags, of course, are all larger than 10 round counts, so I would have to block them in. The gun I would send to them is a Ruger P95, a good gun but unlikely to be priced at a high value even in California.

All this being said, I think they are just going to buy something at an LGS. They were thinking that they could just order one online and have it delivered to them.