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Man, that's weird...I was just talking to my daughter this afternoon about how different people looking at the same thing will see something totally different, or see nothing at all. Thanks, Morgan,for the sharing that with us.

-geo

bryang wrote:Man, that's weird...I was just talking to my daughter this afternoon about how different people looking at the same thing will see something totally different, or see nothing at all.

Well I think there's that factor, plus there's also the factor of "seeing" what you expect to see. Happens in movies all the time. If you take a lot of movies, especially those that are 10+ years old, and look at the special effects sequences, if you pause a frame and really look at it you will find that it's woefully incomplete. It's probably missing all kinds of stuff. Your brain fills in the gaps, replaces things with stuff you would expect to see, figures if you see something unexpected, maybe it is an error or unimportant information so your brain kind of tunes it out. This is the reality of human perception.

I've heard of this as the "red car effect". Once you own a red car, all of the sudden you start seeing them everywhere. Fact is you weren't looking for them before. Once you start carrying, then you will notice the signals of other people carrying. But those same people were carrying long before you started to notice, and you probably interacted with them every day without ever being clued in that they might have a gun. People are usually oblivious to see things they do not expect to see, or that which they are not looking for.

Like Mr.72, there are probably a total of 15-20 people who know I carry, between my immediate family and friends. None of them are bothered by it. There are probably a couple of dozen more of my friends who know I'm a gun guy, and probably would not be surprised to find out I have a CHL and carry regularly, but I don't walk around advertising it. But as I posted here:

The Annoyed Man wrote:Last night, one of my friends from church and I were leaving a Bible study we had been to together, and we started talking about rifles. After a few minutes, he straight up asked me, "do you ever pack heat, or do you have a CHL?" Well, he's a pretty good friend, and he is gun friendly, so I confessed that yes, I carry and have a CHL. He said "me too," and showed me his Glock 17 which was hidden under his sweater. He then asked to see what I carry - a Kimber Ultra Carry II - so I showed him. We talked for a few minutes more, and then each went on our way.

Now, the point of all this is that he is right handed, I'm left handed, and we have been sitting in the same spots on the same couch for the past 6 weeks on Thursday nights - with him on the left end of the couch, and me on the right end. Thus, my gun side was facing toward him, and his was toward me, and neither one of us ever realized that the other had been carrying all this time until last night when it came up in conversation.

The odds are practically nil that an uninitiated person is going to realize that you've got a pistol concealed about yourself.

I guess my general rule of thumb would be, if the other guy is either a complete stranger or not very well known to me, then I would never reveal whether or not I have a CHL or what my carry status was at the moment. But if it is someone that I know and trust, then I don't care if they know, although I don't go out of my way inform them about it. Those close to me who know, also know that I carry at all times. As for the people I know who are rabidly anti - my mother for instance - I just don't talk about guns in her presence, and I don't tell them that I have a CHL, even if they were to ask. At my age, I value family harmony and peace more than I do the need to argue with people I already know cannot be ever swayed or reasoned with.

mr.72 wrote:Well I think there's that factor, plus there's also the factor of "seeing" what you expect to see. Happens in movies all the time. If you take a lot of movies, especially those that are 10+ years old, and look at the special effects sequences, if you pause a frame and really look at it you will find that it's woefully incomplete. It's probably missing all kinds of stuff. Your brain fills in the gaps, replaces things with stuff you would expect to see, figures if you see something unexpected, maybe it is an error or unimportant information so your brain kind of tunes it out. This is the reality of human perception.

That is exactly right, Mr. 72, I was reading a book on situational awareness a while back that was talking about this and historian James Burkes points out that...

"We deny because we're built to see what we want to see. It is the brain which sees not the eye. Reality is in the brain before it is experienced, or else the signals we get from the eye would make no sense.

Some very interesting reading. This is why in situational awareness training we must be made aware of the different kinds of criminal behavior so we can see it before it gets to us and it is too late.

-geo

bryang wrote:

mr.72 wrote:Well I think there's that factor, plus there's also the factor of "seeing" what you expect to see. Happens in movies all the time. If you take a lot of movies, especially those that are 10+ years old, and look at the special effects sequences, if you pause a frame and really look at it you will find that it's woefully incomplete. It's probably missing all kinds of stuff. Your brain fills in the gaps, replaces things with stuff you would expect to see, figures if you see something unexpected, maybe it is an error or unimportant information so your brain kind of tunes it out. This is the reality of human perception.

That is exactly right, Mr. 72, I was reading a book on situational awareness a while back that was talking about this and historian James Burkes points out that...

"We deny because we're built to see what we want to see. It is the brain which sees not the eye. Reality is in the brain before it is experienced, or else the signals we get from the eye would make no sense.

Some very interesting reading. This is why in situational awareness training we must be made aware of the different kinds of criminal behavior so we can see it before it gets to us and it is too late.

-geo

Excellent point.

If you don't know what to look for, you're even less likely to notice it.

danpate wrote: I guess I am fortunate to have a legitimate need to carry a gun in the eyes of the general public.

WHAA!?

We ALL have a legitimate need to carry...it's for SELF DEFENSE!! More legitimate need PFFT SO you have a better reason to CC than I?

...just chaps my behind....I shouldn't even have had to go through, what I had to go through, to carry a gun dang it!!

John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, George Washington etc. fought hard, lost sleep, spent irreversible time away from family to give us certain rights and liberties only for it to erode basically back to what they fought to get independence from.

Not aimed at you danpate but the "general public"

You don't have an argument... re-read what he said that you quoted. He said he felt fortunate to have a legit reason to carry IN THE EYES OF THE GENERAL PUBLIC.

The implication is simply that Joe Average wouldn't think he's a weirdo for carrying a gun, unlike what Joe Average thinks of the rest of us. Sure, WE don't think we're weird for carrying, but Joe Average in the mall or the gas station or convenience store is, you must admit, a little weirded out if for some reason they find out that "we" are armed.

Yeah I know...thats why I claimed it wasn't aimed @ him but the general public.

I got flack from a friend...saying I'm paranoid. But I don't care U know? I don't talk to him much any more.

Sorry... I missed that last line.

I have a rebuttal for the suggestion that one is paranoid.

If I arm myself because I THINK (incorrectly) that someone is out to get ME, I'm paranoid, right?
However, if I arm myself because someone IS out to get me, I'm not paranoid, right?

We now have them agreeing that it is therefore possible to arm one's self without being paranoid.

Now, the next question is, "Are there Bad Guys in this world who are out to get SOMEONE, ANYONE and they don't care who it is they get, as long as the BG gets what they want?"

So... I don't arm myself because I think someone's out to get ME. I arm myself because there are BGs who are out to get SOMEONE, and I'd prefer to be prepared in case I accidentally end up in the same place as them when they try it.

You can claim I'm over-cautious, but you can't claim I'm paranoid.

Morgan wrote:You can claim I'm over-cautious, but you can't claim I'm paranoid.

Well, there IS a difference between being paranoid, and being prudent.

I prefer to think of myself as prudent. Obviously, you are of the same ilk.

Exactly right. You're only paranoid if you think they're out to get YOU specifically and you have nothing upon which to base that thought.

And just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they AREN'T out to get you. LOL

Do we wear our seatbelt because of the law, or to be safe? Do we have smoke alarms in our homes to be safe, or because they were there when we moved in? Do we exercise caution when using knives, scissors, fire, gas, ect.... to be safe, or just dumb luck?

The act of giving yourself, and your loved ones the opportunity to be safe comes from whithin, not someone else. The choice to ensure protection via CHL is no different.

sig229fan wrote:Do we wear our seatbelt because of the law, or to be safe? Do we have smoke alarms in our homes to be safe, or because they were there when we moved in?

Errrmmm ahhhh .. Do I have to answer that?
Most people didn't wear seatbelts until it became law. Most people didn't have smoke alarms until it became "code" Most people don't carry handguns.

Liberty wrote:

sig229fan wrote:Do we wear our seatbelt because of the law, or to be safe? Do we have smoke alarms in our homes to be safe, or because they were there when we moved in?

Errrmmm ahhhh .. Do I have to answer that?
Most people didn't wear seatbelts until it became law. Most people didn't have smoke alarms until it became "code" Most people don't carry handguns.

They don't do those things because they're so certain that accidents, fires, and criminal attacks only happen to other people - until it happens to them. Then they join the refrain of "I never thought something like this could happen here (or "to me")".

Can "WE" be paranoid?