Page 2 of 2

Re: Open-carry in the "Old West?"

Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 10:03 am
by Keith B
barres wrote:
boomerang wrote:
Charles L. Cotton wrote:I posted this here in the general section because this thread isn't yet another pro/con on open-carry.

I watch the Westerns Channel a good bit. Between movies they often have a fellow, Bob Boze Bell, give some western historical information that is usually pretty interesting. I did a Google search on him and he is part owner and editor of True West Magazine and apparently he's quite a historian on the "old west."

A couple of nights ago, Bell talked about open-carry in the "old west." He noted that both TV and movies show people walking around town with "six guns" on their hips, but that this was not how things really worked. According to Bell, it was common to carry openly on outside of town, but in town people concealed their guns. He even commented on the gunfight at the OK Corral noting that the court record showed Wyatt Earp stated he put his pistol in his waistband and slid it around to his back under his coat, while Virgil Earp said he put his pistol in his coat pocket. (I may have the players reversed.) At the end of this short segment, he closed by saying that open-carry is popular in TV and movies, but that's not the way it worked. When people came to town, "they concealed their guns . . . just like they do today."

How interesting to see this when the open-carry debate is in full swing.

Chas.
Yes. Very interesting. Bell says most people in the "old west" concealed in town because of personal preference or local custom, but legally they could carry openly or concealed. That sounds a lot like what the open carry supporters want the law changed to allow.
I saw a History Channel segment on the gunfight at the OK Corral that stated there was a town ordinance against the open carry of guns. That the Earps were going to the Corral to enforce that ordinance, but had been stopped on the way and told that the Clancy Gang (do I remember the name correctly?) had concealed their guns, so they concealed theirs. They continued to the OK, where the found the Clancy Gang OC'ing in violation of the town ordinance, which started the gunfight, when the gang refused to obey it. I cannot vouch for the History Channel's accuracy in their research; I'm simply reporting what they reported.
Apparently there is a little truth to that. Here is a Tombstone ordinance from that time:

November 1881
Ordinance No. 9:
"To Provide against Carrying of Deadly Weapons" (effective April 19, 1881).

Section 1. "It is hereby declared to be unlawful for any person to carry deadly weapons, concealed or otherwise [except the same be carried openly in sight, and in the hand] within the limits of the City of Tombstone.

Section 2: This prohibition does not extend to persons immediately leaving or entering the city, who, with good faith, and within reasonable time are proceeding to deposit, or take from the place of deposit such deadly weapon.

Section 3: All fire-arms of every description, and bowie knives and dirks, are included within the prohibition of this ordinance

Open carry was only allowed in the hand, or if you were entering or leaving the city and in-route or leaving from the deposit location.

Wikipedia (I know, it may not be totally accurate, but still a good source) has a lot of information on the politics and personal inititives going on that lead up to the confrontation. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ok_Corral" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Re: Open-carry in the "Old West?"

Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 2:47 pm
by roberts
Keith B wrote:Section 1. "It is hereby declared to be unlawful for any person to carry deadly weapons, concealed or otherwise [except the same be carried openly in sight, and in the hand] within the limits of the City of Tombstone.
They banned carring guns "concealed or otherwise" but allowed brandishing?

Re: Open-carry in the "Old West?"

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 8:52 am
by stash
You all want to read two real good novels that give some insight into carrying of handguns in the old west, read Appaloosa and Resolution by Robert B. Parker. Heck, some towns apparently had rules that you had to turn in your handgun when you came to town. If I remember correctly they used the term "heeled" or something like that to denote that you were carrying. I don't normally read westerns but these two are excellent. If you read them you should read Appaloosa first.

Stan

Re: Open-carry in the "Old West?"

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 9:30 am
by jimlongley
stash wrote:You all want to read two real good novels that give some insight into carrying of handguns in the old west, read Appaloosa and Resolution by Robert B. Parker. Heck, some towns apparently had rules that you had to turn in your handgun when you came to town. If I remember correctly they used the term "heeled" or something like that to denote that you were carrying. I don't normally read westerns but these two are excellent. If you read them you should read Appaloosa first.

Stan
I'm not sure how a novel, which is, by definition, fiction, would give one insight into much of anything. Is the author some sort of acknowledged expert on "old west handgun carrying"?

Re: Open-carry in the "Old West?"

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 10:28 am
by stash
Jim - you are right - maybe I should have said might give some insight.

Stan

Re: Open-carry in the "Old West?"

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 7:52 pm
by scootergeek
This was a very intresting topic. I had no clue of the OK coral incident. Learn something new each day. Hopefully the History Channel will repeat that show soon.

Re: Open-carry in the "Old West?"

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:09 pm
by iamomeed
wow ive always wondered about this and how the transition to open to conceled happened...thanks

Re: Open-carry in the "Old West?"

Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:36 pm
by Oldgringo
HEY! What're you guys talking about, neither Matt Dillon nor Paladin concealed their hoglegs!

Re: Open-carry in the "Old West?"

Posted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 10:23 am
by barres
scootergeek wrote:This was a very intresting topic. I had no clue of the OK coral incident. Learn something new each day. Hopefully the History Channel will repeat that show soon.
I did some digging on the History Channel website to figure out exactly what show I might have been watching, and it was "Wild West Tech." Unfortunately, I am not sure exactly which episode, but I've narrowed it down to two. It was either "Law and Order Tech" or "Shootout Tech." Whichever one it was, I have seen it more than once on the History Channel, so I'm sure they'll play it again, Sam.

Re: Open-carry in the "Old West?"

Posted: Mon Mar 02, 2009 10:54 am
by jimlongley
The problem with "Wild West Tech" is that they do not necessarily present the whole, or even accurate, story.