TexasCHLforum.com

Thank you Mr. Cotton for all your great work. Please keep it up , you do so much.....

Thanks Charles (and Dan). I'm due for re-up school there next Tuesday. Anxious to see what they have put together by then.

A 25% reject rate sounds pretty absurd. I know that in the past the FBI wasn't rejecting them at anywhere near at that rate. Somein is getting pretty picky at opur expense. Sounds like these rejects are being done to help out the FAST people. Moving towards FAST means more hassle for applicants and mokes it almost imposible to get it all done in one day. Forcing FAST on us by rejecting more prints isn't streamlining, but sharing the wealth to another psuedo government agency. It means that our aplication fees get a little more expencive.
There have been huge advances in Digital image processing. Before private digital prints were available I will bet that rejects rates were never 25% Yet the DPS is for some reason today is having a more difficult time reading the prints.

Liberty wrote:A 25% reject rate sounds pretty absurd. I know that in the past the FBI wasn't rejecting them at anywhere near at that rate. Somein is getting pretty picky at opur expense. Sounds like these rejects are being done to help out the FAST people. Moving towards FAST means more hassle for applicants and mokes it almost imposible to get it all done in one day. Forcing FAST on us by rejecting more prints isn't streamlining, but sharing the wealth to another psuedo government agency. It means that our aplication fees get a little more expencive.
There have been huge advances in Digital image processing. Before private digital prints were available I will bet that rejects rates were never 25% Yet the DPS is for some reason today is having a more difficult time reading the prints.

As I understand it, the 25% reject rate is with the FBI, not DPS. DPS doesn't require new prints for renewals, only the FBI fingerprint card. When I was working with an attorney at FBI HQ on a new processing procedure for CHL's, she made the comment that when the Real ID Act that went fully into effect in May, they were expecting to get buried in non-criminal background check requests. If that happened, and I believe it did, then the FBI may be looking for reasons to reject prints and they too may be pushing for digital submissions.

I do think that a fully automated system, including digital prints and photos, will be much better than our current system. It virtually eliminates delays caused by incomplete application packets and it also dramatically reduces the workload required to process every CHL application. However, I agree that having to make an appointment with FAST and go to another location will be less convenient on the front end. I don't know what other instructors are going to do, but I will reduce the cost of my classes by the fee I pay to a LEO to roll the prints. (I don't charge for photos since I do them myself.) Hopefully, some FAST franchise holders will be willing to travel to classrooms to do the prints, but even if they do, I suspect they will have a minimum class size requirement.

Chas.

Thank you Mr. Cotton!

Charles L. Cotton wrote:

ELB wrote:Excellent, thank you Mr. Cotton.

Is there a date at which they will be making announcements about the changes?

thx

elb

I'm sure there will be no announcements about changes in processing procedures, personnel assignments, etc., ...

Chas.

Then they are missing a trick here... if I were CHL section king and making these changes, and they improve processing time, I would be tooting my horn like crazy after all the bad press DPS/CHL has been getting the past couple years. I'd push to send a letter to every legislator about it -- especially the ones that have been pinging DPS about their constituents' delays.

As for the FAST/digital fingerprint taking -- this is ultimately a good tradeoff for the CHL holder as long as the FAST stations are reasonably distributed. Heck, if only 10% instead of 25% get rejected, that is still a lot, especially for the FBI. If I only have to do this every five years or so, no biggie, but put up against the labor of handling of thousands of paper print cards by DPS and millions by the FBI -- which end up digitized anyway -- it's no contest. Digitize them at the front end. Plus, instead of fooling around with prints during class time/lunch/before/after, instructors can concentrate on material.

Charles L. Cotton wrote: However, I agree that having to make an appointment with FAST and go to another location will be less convenient on the front end. I don't know what other instructors are going to do, but I will reduce the cost of my classes by the fee I pay to a LEO to roll the prints. (I don't charge for photos since I do them myself.) Hopefully, some FAST franchise holders will be willing to travel to classrooms to do the prints, but even if they do, I suspect they will have a minimum class size requirement.

Chas.

It could make it very difficult. For instance If I had to go to Houston during a work day, during work hours, I would have to consider nor renewing. For those living the in big City, and don't have to go to work every day, the inconvenience isn't so great. The One Stop aspect makes it a whole lot easier for working people.

Liberty wrote:

Charles L. Cotton wrote: However, I agree that having to make an appointment with FAST and go to another location will be less convenient on the front end. I don't know what other instructors are going to do, but I will reduce the cost of my classes by the fee I pay to a LEO to roll the prints. (I don't charge for photos since I do them myself.) Hopefully, some FAST franchise holders will be willing to travel to classrooms to do the prints, but even if they do, I suspect they will have a minimum class size requirement.

Chas.

It could make it very difficult. For instance If I had to go to Houston during a work day, during work hours, I would have to consider nor renewing. For those living the in big City, and don't have to go to work every day, the inconvenience isn't so great. The One Stop aspect makes it a whole lot easier for working people.

These are good points Liberty. I'll pass them along to Mr. Jones and suggest that they require FAST to have weekend hours and/or some "mobile" franchise holders. CHL applicants shouldn't have to take a day off of work to apply. Of course, no fingerprints at all in 2011 would be even better.

Chas.

If we do electronic prints, can we get a copy and resend the same digital file with each renewal, instead of the current redundant nonsense?

I think the move toward FAST and an electronic application is a great way to use technology to speed up the process. Feds are doing this more and more for DoD security clearances and agency background investigations. There's still "shoe leather" in the higher level clearances and three letter agencies, but even there the trend is toward automation of the case handling and work flow.

On the other hand, they've broken through my tinfoil hat with their super spy tech. In some ways I pine for a good old paper driver's license w/ no picture (NY c.1982) and gun permit with sheriff's ink signature a la Centre County, PA. Now we're all in a zillion digital databases and electronic document repositories.

Liberty wrote:Of course, no fingerprints at all in 2011 would be even better.

Mr. Cotton - I hope I am not reading to much into this little statement. Sure would be nice.

Stan

stash wrote:

Liberty wrote:Of course, no fingerprints at all in 2011 would be even better.

Mr. Cotton - I hope I am not reading to much into this little statement. Sure would be nice.

Stan

AMEN to THAT!!!

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
It could make it very difficult. For instance If I had to go to Houston during a work day, during work hours, I would have to consider nor renewing. For those living the in big City, and don't have to go to work every day, the inconvenience isn't so great. The One Stop aspect makes it a whole lot easier for working people.

These are good points Liberty. I'll pass them along to Mr. Jones and suggest that they require FAST to have weekend hours and/or some "mobile" franchise holders. CHL applicants shouldn't have to take a day off of work to apply. Of course, no fingerprints at all in 2011 would be even better.

Chas.[/quote]
If it were easily available, it would be a lot more acceptable. The ideal would be if the technology were made directly to the instructors at a reasonable cost. and let the instructors send it directly to DPS themselves or Thumb drive or floppy etc. The technology involved here is still pretty basic, and could be easily duplicated cheaply and easy. Shux my laptop has a lot of this technlogy already designed into it.
The FAST people will be lobbying against us as if their livelihood depends on it. You don't get exclusive contracts in Texas unless you have lots of political pull and friends.

Once you let the bull in up the stairs its pretty rough getting them to leave.

All in all though it looks like there has been huge progress in moving the process along. My renewal process is still a couple years away. I almost look forward to it.

My experience with FAST electronic prints is that the state agencies do not/will not share. I have been printed for my profession(s) and asked if they could use the ones from xxxx and they told me no. DPS says the same thing. Every body has to have their own copy of the same thing. Why not share the digital files!??? Besides they are in the national database now....just pull them up online and save a copy. Having said that, do you think they will let us use the prints we used for the last application? I don't. Same process over and over again.

Get used to it!

JMOCO (just my own cynical opinion!)

Good news Charles! Thank you for your hard work toward making the Texas CHL what it should be.