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Police list it as aggravated assault with a handgun. Video is very informative. A gang of young kids come up to me in a not very good area of town and pull a gun on me I am not going to check their birth certificates before acting to save my life. Having grown up in the slums of a city like this back east I have been accosted by gangs of young thugs. Too old to put up a physical fight now. These "kids" are on the way to big time jail sentences in the future. None will be a Dr. Ben Carson. They are following the path to jail ( if they are lucky).

Studies have shown that a persons worldview is set by their 9th birthday. Unless these kids encounter a life changing event (I think most of you know what I am alluding to) their future is pretty much set in stone.
The last thing I would want to do is take a life regardless of how long that life has lived. However, the end result of a trigger pulled by a 10 year old is just as deadly as a trigger pulled by a 40 year old.

Faced by someone with a gun that I perceive to be a threat to my family or myself I will do what is necessary to ensure the safety and security of my family. Period.

The title question brings up another question. Do you want to be a victim or do you want to be a survivor? The answer to that question will dictate what a persons course of action will be.

I'd get shot if the threat was real. I would not be able to shoot a child.

duns wrote:I'd get shot if the threat was real. I would not be able to shoot a child.

Do you have children? I owe it to my children to be there for them.

TexasGal wrote:Reading some of the comments here, I would hate to see them re-posted elsewhere to make gun owners look like they feel zero remorse for being put in the position of having to shoot a minor who engaged in pointing a gun at someone. The kids were 100% stupid and playing a dangerous game at best. At worst, it was a lucky day no one was killed and they should be arrested. The article points out the "gun" was likely a toy or a bb gun. Confronted in real life by a kid doing this, I hope the members of this board could judge accurately from the situation whether deadly force really was called for. Either way, I for one, would be saddened beyond words if I had to fire to protect myself and it meant the life of someone young enough to be in middle school.

Why should I, or anyone for that matter, feel any remorse? We did nothing wrong. We didn't asked to be threatened. As you said, they were "playing a dangerous game t best". At worst they were armed with a real gun and threatening you. And you'd have had a split second to make that determination. If you hesitate and decide wrong, you're dead. For the safety of myself and my family, I'd draw and fire.

When I was a teen and we were stationed in Germany, an SP shot and killed a kid who was playing laser tag with some friends outside the highschool. That SP saw a gun, made a split second decision, and fired. And I don't blame him one bit.

I worked in a reform school for 5 years in another state. We had kids who had committed murder
and a lot of other violent acts. Attacks by residents on staff were common. The liberals don't know what they are doing with all the do good. Violent criminals can be young. Since it was a juvenile facility I can't give out any spacific information

AEA wrote: with your sympathy. But I cannot agree with the assumption that the youngster had a toy gun in 1 second.

And I assume you do not like my post above. Yes it sounded crude and I meant it that way for a reason. My life.

Are you suggesting that you are going to wait till you are shot before you take action on a person (minor or not) with a gun (real or not) pointed at you?

If you are, then I suggest you re-evaluate your purpose for carrying in the first place. And I hope you are not teaching this thought process to your CHL students. The decision MUST be made long before you face the encounter. I have made mine and prepared to carry it out if/when necessary.

50 years ago it was different than today. You have to consider today's climate which includes a 17yr old killing a Police Officer and setting off a Bomb in Boston. Just because they are young, does not mean they are non lethal.

I did not intend to offend you. Evaluating the threat is all I was talking about. I would not teach someone to ignore a gun in the hands of a child. It is just as lethal as one held by a gang banger. I would not teach someone to ignore a threat nor teach them to be so reactive that every first glance situation calls for immediate deadly force. Otherwise, lets do away with shoot/no shoot exercises conducted in police training. I understand your points and do not disagree that protecting one's own life is the point of carrying and you have to be mentally prepared to do so. But to quote Ayoob, it should be done in the "gravest extreme". As for re-evaluating my reasons to carry, I evaluated my reasons for a year before doing so. I think I have thought them out more than many have. I have also experienced violent crime so I do not take a threat lightly nor the responsibility that goes with carrying a gun. We all do what we have to do. With the growing violence we see in the young, I can see some one will indeed find themselves making this split second decision.

RottenApple wrote:Why should I, or anyone for that matter, feel any remorse? We did nothing wrong. We didn't asked to be threatened. As you said, they were "playing a dangerous game t best". At worst they were armed with a real gun and threatening you. And you'd have had a split second to make that determination. If you hesitate and decide wrong, you're dead. For the safety of myself and my family, I'd draw and fire.

Well you can say what you would do all you want. Until you are in an armed encounter, regardless of the age of the actor, you do not know how you will respond.

dac1842 wrote:Well you can say what you would do all you want. Until you are in an armed encounter, regardless of the age of the actor, you do not know how you will respond.

Perhaps not. But you can train and prepare yourself mentally for it. If you think you might hesitate, then you will.

In all my training, age has never been a factor in how to stop a threat. I would hope that in any situation, that my training kicks in and not my emotions.

For those of you that would not stop the threat of a 10 y/o what age would you and how do you train to make that determination?

jmra wrote:

duns wrote:I'd get shot if the threat was real. I would not be able to shoot a child.

Do you have children? I owe it to my children to be there for them.

You'd want a really good therapist. Military folks who come back, who have been put in those situations.....it doesn't sound like it's something they will ever forget, nor want to repeat. I remember meeting a Marine friend of my ex's who had just gotten back from Iraq. Later in the night after they had a few too many drinks, he got weepy about a child on a bike who had a gun aimed at them. He didn't go into details at all, just kept mentioning how it was the worst situation he had ever been in and I believe it. It's a moral dilemma.

I've seen hurt people, I see hurt people daily coming to the clinic, but the look in that young mans eyes, thats a completely different and deeper level of pain that will probably always be with him in some shape or form. I don't wish that on anyone and I hope none of you ever have to be in that position.

MamaK wrote:

jmra wrote:

duns wrote:I'd get shot if the threat was real. I would not be able to shoot a child.

Do you have children? I owe it to my children to be there for them.

You'd want a really good therapist. Military folks who come back, who have been put in those situations.....it doesn't sound like it's something they will ever forget, nor want to repeat. I remember meeting a Marine friend of my ex's who had just gotten back from Iraq. Later in the night after they had a few too many drinks, he got weepy about a child on a bike who had a gun aimed at them. He didn't go into details at all, just kept mentioning how it was the worst situation he had ever been in and I believe it. It's a moral dilemma.

I've seen hurt people, I see hurt people daily coming to the clinic, but the look in that young mans eyes, thats a completely different and deeper level of pain that will probably always be with him in some shape or form. I don't wish that on anyone and I hope none of you ever have to be in that position.

I don't disagree that it will be a pain that he will have to live with the rest of his life.

I emphasized the important parts of your story. At least he is living and can get help, take medication, talk to people about what he went through. I know Vietnam vets that had to make the exact same decisions and are glad that they did an came home.

Our local neighborhood officer came from the Fort Worth gang unit. To hear his stories of kids as, young as 8, committing some of the crimes to gruesome to talk about hear but included sexual assaults, rape, murder, beatings and every day gang activities.

I like the adage: If you act like a child you will be treated like a child. I think it works both ways too. If you act like an adult you will be treated like an adult.

I know that if I am ever put in the situation, I can not know how I will feel. I just hope that I can rationalize it by saying it was him or me or I was protecting my family.

RX8er wrote: At least he is living and can get help, take medication, talk to people about what he went through.

you also want to be sure that the gun they are pulling is real, and has the safety turned off before you fire. Otherwise you might be the face of a new antigun law, or heavier restrictions on CHL applicants and renewals.