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Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:28 pm
by ElGato
Thank's I will put this information to use.
Re: Survey results
Posted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 8:29 pm
by lrb111
badgerw wrote:I posted the original questions on nine firearms-related forums on the net.
I got 198 responses in 36 hours, of which about 120 are of use.
Bill
I would like to see your distillation when through. Heck, if i knew where to look i would read the rest of the responses. If you feel like sending a pm with the links i would gladly read up.
edited: fat fingers
Re: Survey results
Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 10:34 am
by Paladin
badgerw wrote:here are a few observations:
1. Handling a broad range of students is important. Classes contain former military / law enforcement folks who are quite familiar with guns (and especially their own). They also contain folks who have never shot a gun.
2. Handling the "class clowns" is important.
3. Addressing the legal issues is important. Finding the right balance between giving a textbook answer and giving legal advice is tough.
4. People prefer clean, quiet classrooms with comfortable chairs. They like access to coffee, cold drinks, and snacks.
5. Visual aids, video presentations that are interesting and in small doses, and handouts are well liked.
6. For some people, class times other than the weekend are important.
7. Not surprisingly, many people would prefer more time on the range.
8. In states like Texas where photos, fingerprints, and notaries are required, people like "one stop shopping."
9. Above all, people want safe professional instructors who aren't dragging their egos along in Radio Flyer wagons.
Bill
This stuff sounds right. +1 to it.
Giving out references for further personal or written instruction are always good. Lets people know there is more they can learn and where they can learn it.
In my class I would have liked to see a bit more marksmanship/gun handling instruction. Some people are good walking into class, some people aren't and need more instruction before walking out of class.
Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 2:28 pm
by KD5NRH
KBCraig wrote:There are darn few scenarios where a CHL would be justified in taking a shot at 25 yards. It's unusual enough in police work to take a pistol shot from that far.
I don't know about you, but I carry
specifically for very unusual situations. If I had to use a weapon in normal everyday situations, I probably wouldn't bother with a handgun at all.
Luby's, Wedgwood Baptist Church, and others may be unusual, but they are good examples of situations where a 25+ yard shot would have been absolutely justified, and would have saved lives.
That said, I do still do most of my SD practice from 10 yards or less. Anything beyond that would have to revert to target shooting skills anyway.
Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:13 pm
by Originalist
I absolutely loved my CHL Class, ANyone in or around San Antonio TX please check out Concealed handgun of San Antonio, it is runned by Sammy Miller, he only holds one class amonth but it is all inclusive and he even has special guest speakers (1 is the first chair felony prosecutor for Bexar County and the other a Judge) Reasonable price great class good service and lunch is acrosst he parking lot at Grady's. Any questions let me know.
Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 11:04 pm
by JRG
KBCraig wrote:300shooter wrote:I think you should have to fire at 3,7,10,15,25 like we did when I was a LEO.
I think shooting proficiency isn't something to worry about; safe handling is more important. If a student can safely load their handgun, fire five shots into a silhouette from 7 yards, reload, fire five more shots, then safely clear the gun, then that's adequate marksmanship. The most important part is safe gun handling. Instructors should be able to check a "gives me the willies" box on the certificate if they don't feel the student has demonstrated adequate safety.
Kevin
Is that fire 5 shots, reload, fire five more shots then safely clear the gun, part of the test?
What if we have a magazine that holds 16 bullets? Do they want us to just load it with 5?
Obviously I haven't taken the class yet. I do take it Sept 9th.
JRG
Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 11:10 pm
by JRG
Can someone explain to me the process for the shooting portion of the CHL class? I know you shoot 50 bullets. How many at what distances?
JRG
Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 12:08 am
by barres
I don't remember the exact sequences, but you shoot 20 rounds at 3 yards, 20 rounds at 7 yards, and 10 rounds at 15 yards. It is entirely possible to have passed the range qualification well before firing a single shot from 15 yards.
Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 6:03 am
by JLaw
JRG,
The way my instructor did his range work was to tell everyone to load 7 rounds in the mag, we fired 7 rounds. Then load 7 rounds again, and fire 7 rounds. Then load 6 rounds, and fire 6 rounds. Then we moved back to the 7 yard line and shot the same sequence. I don't recall the exact loading for the 15 yard line, but we did reload once.
It doesn't matter how many rounds your pistol will hold, the instructor is telling you how many rounds he wants it to hold. As mentioned above it's one way to check a students proficiency, and the instructor may not want a dozen or more students on the range fully loaded since he does not know the skill level of all the students.
JLaw
Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 7:51 am
by lrb111
JRG wrote:Can someone explain to me the process for the shooting portion of the CHL class? I know you shoot 50 bullets. How many at what distances?
JRG
Here it is from the State of Texas.
http://tinyurl.com/qwnag
Every loading of the gun is 5 rounds with two exceptions. At three yards it says:
(B) ten rounds will be fired "Two Shot Exercise"; three seconds allowed for each two shots;
That is broken into two loadings one of four, and one of 6.
hope this helps..
Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 10:21 am
by stevie_d_64
None of the instructors I have used are in business anymore...
That is not a testimony as to what I have done to them either...
The last guy I used, smelled pretty bad, and didn't brush his teeth...Otherwise his class was adequate, semi-comfortable, a one-stop shop for packages, notary, pictures and range-time...The cost was excellent too, about $80 if I recall correctly...
So when I renew next summer..."El Gato" gets the check...
I do like how this thread has developed...We note the bad experiences, yet we all have seen how the good experiences have found their way into the mix...
class
Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 3:07 pm
by Witness P
I recently took the class this past saturday on the 28th my complaints are the folding medal chairs, the peanut gallery mentality of some of the students, lack of teacher discipline when needed, not being able to shoot and fingerprint the same day, (your supposed to schedule that for later in the week) No shooting or fingerprint because they say the 10 hour period is classroom only. To make a long story short there is alot of money to be made doing CHL training if you put some real thought and money into it. The class I took only had one spot left open and that was after I had contacted 2 other places that had no open spots. All the class needs is some people that want to do it right and treat the students like customers.
Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 4:21 pm
by Crossfire
stevie_d_64 wrote:
The last guy I used, smelled pretty bad, and didn't brush his teeth...
You know, I may not always look real good, but at least I try to smell purty! That guy must not charge enough for classes if he can't even afford toothpaste and soap.
Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 10:11 pm
by JRG
lrb111 wrote:JRG wrote:Can someone explain to me the process for the shooting portion of the CHL class? I know you shoot 50 bullets. How many at what distances?
JRG
Here it is from the State of Texas.
http://tinyurl.com/qwnag
Every loading of the gun is 5 rounds with two exceptions. At three yards it says:
(B) ten rounds will be fired "Two Shot Exercise"; three seconds allowed for each two shots;
That is broken into two loadings one of four, and one of 6.
hope this helps..
Yes, that helps a lot. I also went to the site you posted and got the actual instructions. That helped a bunch!!
Is there a section that tells about scoring? Are you shooting at sillouettes or bullseyes?
Sorry for so many questions. I take the class next Saturday and am getting some butterflies!
JRG
Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 10:21 pm
by dws1117
Over all I liked my CHL class. The instructors did a good job of covering material. They were very receptive to questions.
My only dislikes are really nitpicky. The chairs sucked. Floding metal chairs hurt your but after that long. We were given lots of breaks so that helped some.
I personally thought the class size was too large. There were approxemately 40-45 people. That may be a normal class size, but I don't know.