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Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:24 pm
by EEllis
VMI77 wrote:
I agree that people who do this and video it have an agenda. I'm not a supporter of "these guys" and I haven't open carried a rifle since I was a teenager. Back then people didn't freak out. I sure wouldn't do it now because people would freak out. I'm not really interested in provoking a police response and trying to make some kind of political argument with the responding officers, as even if it wasn't potentially dangerous, it would be pointless, since the police don't write the law. I'd like to have the option though, so, for instance, if I needed to stop off on my way to go shooting, I wouldn't have to leave my rifle in the car. I really have mixed feelings about open carry. I'm not going to open carry a handgun if open carry passes here because I think it sacrifices tactical advantage. OTOH, the fact that people freak out is a product of the fact that they're not used to seeing people carrying guns in public, and if it was normal, people wouldn't be freaking out. My mixed feelings come from the fact that I think normalizing the open possession of guns would be good for gun owners, but I don't know how we get from where we are now back to the atmosphere of the 50's and 60's where you frequently saw people --even kids-- carrying around rifles and shotguns.
You know what I don't remember people caring guns around in town when I was a kid. I lived just outside of a town of 15 thou and people didn't walk into stores with guns unless they had a reason to. You would see gun racks with a gun or two here and there but nobody was shopping with a sporting rifle across their back in my little town. I doubt they did it in Houston either. Sure you could be walking, or biking and no one would say anything about a gun over your shoulder because it would be reasonable. But when there is no place to go and no reason to take the gun why should I be worried that people start wondering why someone is carrying? I doubt I phrased that very well but if someone can't think of a good reason to have a gun then why act upset when others also don't see a reason for you having it. And I'm sorry I'm a 2nd amendment supporter but I don't think it means you can carry any gun anywhere. At no time in the history of our country has that been true so I don't believe I must adhere to some made up standard to be considered a supporter of the 2nd.
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:51 pm
by bayouhazard
Maxwell wrote:In my opinion self aggrandizing idiots like this make us all look bad.
carlson1 wrote:Everyone who does not agree with your opinion or open carry are not "idiots."
Amen! The young men who sat at the Woolworth's lunch counter 50 years ago were not idiots.
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 1:10 pm
by Keith B
bayouhazard wrote:Maxwell wrote:In my opinion self aggrandizing idiots like this make us all look bad.
carlson1 wrote:Everyone who does not agree with your opinion or open carry are not "idiots."
Amen! The young men who sat at the Woolworth's lunch counter 50 years ago were not idiots.
Nice way to take quotes out of context and sequence to make them totally opposite of their original responses. Do you work for the media?
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:55 pm
by texanjoker
VMI77 wrote:texanjoker wrote:VMI77 wrote:texanjoker wrote:I noted in those what appeared to be IDF Israel photos that for the most part the rifles didn't have magazines in them.
Yep, Israel, and what difference does it make if they're IDF? They're not in uniform and they're carrying rifles in public places....and yes, the mags aren't in the gun, but they have loaded mags with them...in some cases as described above, in special mag carriers that keep them at the ready. Furthermore, since they're in civies, there is nothing to stop a criminal or nut case from carrying the same way, as I doubt the police are stopping every person with a rifle and asking for ID everywhere they go. Israel has stricter gun than we do, and people aren't freaking out, because they're used to seeing people carrying weapons.
I only knew they were IDF because of the fact they were chicks with AR's...
It is also common knowledge in Israel that off duty soldiers carry their rifles.
I have to ask since you are a definite supporter of these open carry guys. Do you open carry a rifle?
I agree that people who do this and video it have an agenda. I'm not a supporter of "these guys" and I haven't open carried a rifle since I was a teenager. Back then people didn't freak out. I sure wouldn't do it now because people would freak out. I'm not really interested in provoking a police response and trying to make some kind of political argument with the responding officers, as even if it wasn't potentially dangerous, it would be pointless, since the police don't write the law. I'd like to have the option though, so, for instance, if I needed to stop off on my way to go shooting, I wouldn't have to leave my rifle in the car. I really have mixed feelings about open carry. I'm not going to open carry a handgun if open carry passes here because I think it sacrifices tactical advantage. OTOH, the fact that people freak out is a product of the fact that they're not used to seeing people carrying guns in public, and if it was normal, people wouldn't be freaking out. My mixed feelings come from the fact that I think normalizing the open possession of guns would be good for gun owners, but I don't know how we get from where we are now back to the atmosphere of the 50's and 60's where you frequently saw people --even kids-- carrying around rifles and shotguns.
See the difference is that you are not going to do it to provoke a response. You would just do it out of necessity or because you legally can. IMO that is different then these guys making the videos so they can plaster them all over the net. I would bet if more just carried w/o the side drama it would be readily accepted. I grew up in a desert town in CA. I would sling a 22 or shotgun and ride my MC to the hills to go hunting. Nobody cared.
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 3:04 pm
by Cedar Park Dad
Did you go into a Walmart with it? Thats the difference. When I grew up everyone that had a pickup had a shotgun or rifle in a rack (usually along with an umbrella). But no one ever ever walked into a store with one. You would have been run out on a rail for doing so.
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 3:29 pm
by VoiceofReason
JJVP wrote:VoiceofReason wrote:Keith B wrote:JJVP wrote:There was something on the video that made me think. I believe that he actually committed a felony. Let me explain. The first guy that came in told him it was illegal to carry because they sell alcohol. The TABC "blue" sign says, " The Unlicensed Possession of a WEAPON" . It does not say, the "Unlicensed possession of a HANDGUN". There is no license for long guns in TX and therefore he was in possession of a WEAPON on a TABC "blue" business. It also occurred to me that even those of us carry with a CHL, are committing a felony when we go into any "Blue" business with a knife in the pocket. The knife is "unlicensed" and it is a "weapon".
Thoughts?
AR-15 on that premise is an unlicensed weapon and IS a felony. A knife in your pocekt is not against the law unless it is an illegal knife as defined under weapons in TPC 46.01.
How is this guy going to feel If Walmart puts up 30-06 signs in all their stores? I am not going to be very happy with the
jerk if I can no longer carry concealed in Walmart because this
fool wanted to make a statement or exercise his “right”.
So I guess if TX ever passed open carry, you would not want anyone to open carry? Why be afraid of doing legal things just because some idiots don't like it.
All it would take is for enough “idiots” to complain to Walmart management for them to adopt a company “no guns” policy and put up the signs. Then it would be illegal for
anyone except LE to carry in any of their stores. If this
fool wanted to "make a statement", he should have taken it to a park or other public place.
If you make enough business owners angry, you could end up with laws allowing open carry, but can’t carry into any businesses. Then what would you have gained? Those of us with a CHL are still a very small percent of the population. If everyone with a CHL boycotted Walmart they probably wouldn’t even notice it.
“Why be afraid of doing legal things just because some idiots don't like it.”
Those "idiots" have the final say if it is legal for you to carry a firearm in
their store.
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 6:52 pm
by philip964
Oldgringo wrote:CoffeeNut wrote:Oldgringo wrote:...Uh, doesn't Walmart sell AR-15's?
They do indeed. Mine even sells Colt's with Magpul furniture.
They ain't got no bullets, but dey do has da' guns.
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 8:54 am
by CenTex
bdickens wrote:The only weapon you can even get a license for in the state of Texas is a handgun. No license at all is needed - or even available - for anything else and if it isn't illegal to own it in the first place then you can carry it anywhere.
I was not aware of any handgun license availability or requirements in Texas... Please educate me...
It is the person that is licensed for concealed carry and open carry of long guns does not require anything other than the legal right to own one...
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 9:46 am
by bdickens
CenTex wrote:bdickens wrote:The only weapon you can even get a license for in the state of Texas is a handgun. No license at all is needed - or even available - for anything else and if it isn't illegal to own it in the first place then you can carry it anywhere.
I was not aware of any handgun license availability or requirements in Texas... Please educate me...
It is the person that is licensed for concealed carry and open carry of long guns does not require anything other than the legal right to own one...
You've probably got one in your wallet right now.
http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/rsd/chl/index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:51 pm
by VMI77
Cedar Park Dad wrote:Did you go into a Walmart with it? Thats the difference. When I grew up everyone that had a pickup had a shotgun or rifle in a rack (usually along with an umbrella). But no one ever ever walked into a store with one. You would have been run out on a rail for doing so.
Actually, I did go into a store with it, but then, my father owned the store. I don't even think there was a Walmart back then....there weren't any where I lived anyway. But actually, people did walk into stores carrying a long gun, for instance, to buy a scope and have it mounted and bore sighted. And I'm not talking about gun stores either, but department stores like the old Gibsons. In fact, I saw someone carrying a rifle in the Academy parking lot not too long ago, and that's what he was doing, heading into Academy to get a scope and have it bore sighted. Back then I had absolutely no fear of getting in trouble or someone freaking out because I had a long gun in my possession.
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:53 pm
by RogueUSMC
Cedar Park Dad wrote:Did you go into a Walmart with it? Thats the difference. When I grew up everyone that had a pickup had a shotgun or rifle in a rack (usually along with an umbrella). But no one ever ever walked into a store with one. You would have been run out on a rail for doing so.
We did it all the time...if you weren't old enough to have a car, you carried everything with you. You stopped at the store on the way out of town to go hunting...no sense walking to the store for cartridges, then walking all the way back home to get your gun just to pass that same store going out of town.
Nobody ever thought anything of it...if they did, it was to ask ya what you were hunting for. We would be gone for days and lived on what we caught or killed. We would bow fish if we didn't bag any rabbits. I have never had a hunting license in my life but the last time I hunted I was 15...lol.
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:46 pm
by cb1000rider
I have mixed feelings about people "demonstrating" with AR-15s. I understand that it's legal (let's ignore this particular bozo for a second).
Certainly it's going to cause some alarm in most residential settings.
I was at a BBQ with one of APD's finest this weekend. There was an open carry long-gun discussion brought up. I stayed out of it. That particular officer said that if you open carry a long gun on his watch, he's going to arrest you and let the courts sort it out, simply because he felt like those people are expecting and going to get some sort of public reaction. And I understand that he's going to get calls and those calls are going to take away from real police work... It's sort of just another fact.
I remember being in a bar in rural Montana. This was a long time ago, so maybe rules have changed, but people were open carrying handguns and no one thought anything about it.
We either give up some of our freedoms for "safety" (perhaps the illusion of safety - such as the TSA) or we actually read and follow what's written on that constitutional piece of paper. Right now we seem to be stuck somewhere in the middle and maybe that's appropriate... I haven't decided.
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:07 pm
by fickman
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:19 pm
by Keith B
And most western's were historically incorrect. Almost all towns in the old west required you to check your guns with the sheriff or designated location when you came into town and you couldn't carry. Long guns may have been a different story, but they didn't just walk around carrying them.
Re: Man brings AR-15 into Walmart; People freak out
Posted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 5:27 pm
by fickman
Keith B wrote:
And most western's were historically incorrect. Almost all towns in the old west required you to check your guns with the sheriff or designated location when you came into town and you couldn't carry. Long guns may have been a different story, but they didn't just walk around carrying them.
It was a silly show. . . but I let my kids watch it because at least the kids are respectful to each other and to adults. . . and evil is portrayed as evil.
They did show a new Marshall who made everybody turn in their guns in one episode. It didn't end well.
I was trying to think of the absurdity of shopping with a rifle outside of Mogadishu. This came to mind. . . Lucas carried his rifle in every store. Maybe the guy in the video grew up on Chuck Connors?
