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Pawpaw wrote:During one outing to break in a new 1911, I had a couple of instances where the slide locked back and when I looked in, there was an unfired round sitting on top of the magazine. It had apparently popped out of the mag instead of politely waiting for the slide to strip it out.

If I had tilted the barrel down at (or close to) straight down, I suppose the round could have slid into the chamber.

That's still a stretch, though.

This is the only explanation that I've seen here that is consistent with the OP's report and the way a 1911 operates.

As unlikely as it is, it is so far the most likely in this case, assuming that the OP's observations are accurate and complete.

I've never seen a haunted 1911 and don't expect we're seeing one here.

Can the OP remember if he tilted the pistol down at all after slide lockback to look into the ejection port?

Hi, Excalibur,

I do not remember if I pointed the pistol down after the slide racked back and before I looked into the chamber where I found the unfired, non-indented primer round.

If so, I wonder why would it do that with an aluminum round but not a brass round?

All constructive ideas of course are appreciated.

dlh

Premature slide lock is not unheard of in 1911s. There are a few things to look for. Are you using a shock buffer? If so, try it without the buffer. Second, look for a brass mark on the slide stop lug. It is possible that the nose of the round can bump the slide stop and cause premature lock. Third, the magazine itself can be a problem. In particular, the follower configuration can allow a round to "squirt" out. This also can cause the last round in the mag to sit on top of the mag. If you have a mag with a dimpled follower, then try that to see if it helps.

BTW, my bet is on the mag. The recoil on the next to last round helps the last round squirt out of the mag. When it does, it hits the slide stop and causes lock back. I've seen this before with Blazer and plastic follower mags.

Edit. It took some digging.. "niemi24s" on the m1911.org forum developed this Wilson 47D follower mod to prevent those last round problems:

dlh wrote:Hi, Excalibur,

I do not remember if I pointed the pistol down after the slide racked back and before I looked into the chamber where I found the unfired, non-indented primer round.

If so, I wonder why would 't do that with an aluminum round but not a brass round?

All constructive ideas of course are appreciated.

dlh

In the hypothesis I think most likely, the slide never closed on the round and the trigger wasn't pulled, so I wouldn't expect to see a firing pin strike on the primer.

My first guess would be that there just happened to be a Blazer round in the magazine when it happened. If you fire a lot of brass, you may see it again, although possibly not exactly the same way unless you tilt the gun down right afterward.

If the round jumps the magazine, the slide locks open, and you don't tilt the gun down, you'll likely see a failure to feed as the slide jams the round forward without the guidance of the magazine lips. If the slide does lock open when it happens (indicating a probable two problems with both the magazine and the slide stop, or an accidental upward pressure with a thumb on the slide lock) and you tilt the gun sideways, the round will drop out of the ejection port.

The other possibility is that the slightly lighter weight of the Blazer round has something do to with it, although right now I can't think of why that would have an effect.

I'd suggest trying to replicate the situation with everything as much the same as you can make it while paying attention to thumb position and gun angle after the slide locks back. If you can't recreate it, you can probably chalk it up to one of those things that we can't explain but doesn't much matter. If you can recreate it, carefully looking at the circumstances may answer the question.

If you can get it to recur, one thing to try might be to use Blazer ammo in a magazine that creates more friction with the rounds than the very slick Wilsons.

I have shot a lot of blazer brass and blazer aluminum and all has worked flawlessly when fired in my guns. Never one issue with either.

Mystery solved, at least part of it! Thanks for all the constructive suggestions.

Went back to my range this morning. Loaded six rounds of Blazer aluminum ammo and proceeded to shoot, keeping track of the shot count. At the end of five shots the receiver locked back. I very carefully looked at the interior without tilting the gun up or down---the sixth round was sitting "free" on the feed ramp above and not attached to the magazine lips but not in the chamber!

I then oiled the Wilson Combat Magazine and ejector thoroughly with some Zero Friction Lube that I keep in my range bag. I then fired two more magazines of the aluminum ammo. Flawless! I also fired some Winchester brass and it worked flawlessly.

Possibly as suggested above the lighter weight aluminum rounds may have had something to do with this problem--not sure. If it was solely a problem with lubrication then why on the first outing yesterday did the Winchester brass cycle flawlessly but the Blazer aluminum did not? This is not a "demand" for information but simply humble request for further thoughts on what might have happened.

Again, thanks for all of your help.

dlh

I got a note from the Kel-Tec warranty shop saying not to use aluminum, steel, or poly coated ammo in their guns. My understanding is that the alum and steel is harder on extractors and ejectors. I am told that the poly/lacquer coating can build up in chamber area of guns with tight tolerances and cause problems.
I have no problem using aluminum in heavy duty/ full size guns but I don't want it in my light weight carry guns where reliability is the most important factor. I wouldn't use steel or poly in anything other than an AK (my opinion). Poly/lacquer coated is designed for long term storage and would be the last ammo I would use in anything. YMMV

Indeed 2farnorth.

In my conceal carry guns I use only premium brass ammo---none of the cheap stuff. Here while back when we had the ammo shortage it was hard to find quality brass ammo (in some places ammo of any kind) so I bought some of the Blazer aluminum--it was all they had at the time.

dlh

ALso: I heard that Federal was selling some alum cased 9mm ammo. Believe the guy said he picked it up at Wal-Mart.
Anyone else seen any like that?

Yep, I have bought lots of Federal alum case 9mm at Walmart in the past year or so. Generally $10 a box and runs fine, at least in the bigger guns.

2farnorth wrote:I got a note from the Kel-Tec warranty shop saying not to use aluminum, steel, or poly coated ammo in their guns. My understanding is that the alum and steel is harder on extractors and ejectors. I am told that the poly/lacquer coating can build up in chamber area of guns with tight tolerances and cause problems.
I have no problem using aluminum in heavy duty/ full size guns but I don't want it in my light weight carry guns where reliability is the most important factor. I wouldn't use steel or poly in anything other than an AK (my opinion). Poly/lacquer coated is designed for long term storage and would be the last ammo I would use in anything. YMMV

I had a similar note from Colt, but I ran thousands of rounds of Wolf (steel) and Blazer (aluminum) ammo through both my Colt 1991A1 and cheapo 1911 clone night fighter without a problem. I never had a problem with lacquer build up, but I was pretty religious about cleaning after shooting, even with an IDPA match the next day.

jimlongley wrote:

2farnorth wrote:I got a note from the Kel-Tec warranty shop saying not to use aluminum, steel, or poly coated ammo in their guns. My understanding is that the alum and steel is harder on extractors and ejectors. I am told that the poly/lacquer coating can build up in chamber area of guns with tight tolerances and cause problems.
I have no problem using aluminum in heavy duty/ full size guns but I don't want it in my light weight carry guns where reliability is the most important factor. I wouldn't use steel or poly in anything other than an AK (my opinion). Poly/lacquer coated is designed for long term storage and would be the last ammo I would use in anything. YMMV

I had a similar note from Colt, but I ran thousands of rounds of Wolf (steel) and Blazer (aluminum) ammo through both my Colt 1991A1 and cheapo 1911 clone night fighter without a problem. I never had a problem with lacquer build up, but I was pretty religious about cleaning after shooting, even with an IDPA match the next day.

I have also run many thousands of rounds of Wolf through my guns with no problem.

I did see lacquer buildup sufficient to cause cases to start sticking in the chamber in a neighbor's gun. It was due to his habit of not cleaning the gun until he brings it to me about every 18 months. It took a lot of scrubbing to clean up, but then it was good as new again.

Older Wolf ammo was lacquer coated. Now they use a poly coating which may not cause the same issue. I don't know because I also religiously clean my guns after every range day.

Hi, Excalibur

What solvent do you use to clean your guns?

dlh

dlh wrote:Hi, Excalibur

What solvent do you use to clean your guns?

dlh

Right now I'm using Slip2000 Carbon Killer or Hoppe's Elite for handguns.

There are so many good ones out there now what you use doesn't matter nearly as much as it used to.

Excaliber wrote:

dlh wrote:Hi, Excalibur

What solvent do you use to clean your guns?

dlh

Right now I'm using Slip2000 Carbon Killer or Hoppe's Elite for handguns.

There are so many good ones out there now what you use doesn't matter nearly as much as it used to.

Thanks for the recommendation Excaliber.

I just tried some Hoppe's Elite Cleaner and it took the carbon/fouling,/gunk right off. Plus it does not have the strong smell the Hoppe's No. 9 has.

dlh