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ScottDLS wrote:Hi-Caps is the proper 'urban dictionary' term, homies....!

word

Skiprr wrote:

C-dub wrote:

Skiprr wrote: And FYI, if you want pick apart the term "battle rifle," I would include only the military, not law enforcement. LE has become more militarized over time--arguably either a good or bad thing, depending on where you stand--but even the DEA or FBI HRT don't actually go into "battle."

I also considered this, but then I thought that just because of who owns it doesn't change what it is. The M4 Sherman tanks and other models that often sit outside various posts or VFW's are still tanks or battle tanks or whatever. They may not be functional as such, but they are still tanks.

But even during the brief one-year period (61-62) when a rifle referred to as the "AR-15" found its way into unofficial use in Viet Nam, it was a full-auto select-fire. In November 1963, with the first military order from Colt, it became the "M16."

The Eugene Stoner military design was never semi-automatic only. Semi-autos never went into battle. So I guess it would be like calling a heavy vehicle designed and built to run on treads but with no armament a "battle tank." It's a tank, but its design has never seen battle.

You can go out and buy a 190 mph motorcycle that has lights and turn signals on it. Some people call that a race-bike, even though it may never see an actual race-track. Ultimately, any rifle you do battle with is a "battle rifle". I don't know where the term originated, but I have used it. When I have, I always used it to mean a .308 caliber civilian owned version of military rifles for tactical use, like the M14, FN FAL, SCAR 17H, M110/SR25, HK 91, etc., etc. For whatever reason, I never thought of the AR15 in that same light......although like you point it, it certainly meets the description. I've always thought of civilian ownership of the AR15 as more of a personal defense / hunting thing. I have also described it as a "militia weapon"......in step with the theory of "well regulated" in the 2nd Amendment meaning for the militia to be similarly equipped in terms of small arms to the standing army, for logistical reasons.

But for me personally, the term Battle Rifle has always had sort of a "here comes the heavy metal" sort of smell to it. The AR15 is a great platform, and I love mine. But it isn't "heavy metal", like my SCAR 17 is.

C-dub wrote:That's true, but IIRC, we've heard of non-full auto M4's being used on the battlefields in recent years.

Most M4s are semi-auto/3-shot burst, not full auto.

3dfxMM,

If what you say is true: Then how is it my M-4's are only semi-auto?

Are we missing the point? The only reason taxpayers can't buy a "real" M4 is because our right to keep and bear arms is infringed.

Abraham wrote:3dfxMM,

If what you say is true: Then how is it my M-4's are only semi-auto?

Sorry. I meant real M4s, not the ones that us mere citizens can buy. :)

I received a email from SGAmmo today and apparently they have gotten word of the battle rifle and are now selling "battle packs" of ammo for the battle rifle.
http://www.sgammo.com/product/223-556mm ... mmo-223abp
http://www.sgammo.com/product/223-556mm ... mmo-pmc-ar

I don't care too much about semantics but to me, assault weapon means something that resembles an AR15 or AK47. A battle rifle is something more substantial something like an M14 or AR10. I have no Idea what a "Battle Pack" of 223 ammo is.

Maybe, it's what we used to call bulk ammo.

Liberty wrote:I don't care too much about semantics but to me, assault weapon means something that resembles an AR15 or AK47. A battle rifle is something more substantial something like an M14 or AR10. I have no Idea what a "Battle Pack" of 223 ammo is.

Maybe, it's what we used to call bulk ammo.

Battle packs are a quantity of boxed ammo, usually 200 rounds, sealed in a heavy waterproof plastic pouch for easy transport and storage under less than ideal conditions. The links in the OP show what they look like.

Skiprr wrote:LE has become more militarized over time--arguably either a good or bad thing, depending on where you stand

It definitely depends if you think "serve and protect" or "occupy and oppress" is their job description.

Depends what the purpose of its use is.
If you are actually going into battle, then any rifle you take is technically a "battle rifle".

If you are sitting in the courtroom due to some gun related predicament, you'll likely not be telling the prosecutor about your "battle rifle", rather, you may just call it a "rifle" and stroll on .

If you are a marketer for gun company tasked to jazz up the brand, you may attach "battle rifle" to the product name.

Meh. I just stick with "AR" or "rifle".

When I hit the trails of western Texas and southern New Mexico in my Jeep I usually pack an 'adventure rifle' (Mini-14, Winchester levergun, and/or Ruger 10-22). I always hope none will become a 'battle rifle' (especially the 10-22), but I carry them just in case.

I just call it a carbine or rifle. When I hear "assualt rifle" I think of the politically charged term to get emotions riled up and used for political purposes. I hear "AR" or "AR-15" I think of the 20" barrel length versions and may or may not be used for hunting or competitions. "Defensive rifle/carbine" is set up for home/self defense, "modern sporting rifle" is set up for hunting or gun games/competition (mostly 3 gun etc). "Patrol rifle" seems more like a LEO set up rifle.

Set ups are what the intended purpose and thus how they are equipped. This would be type of optic if there is one, if there is a flashlight, etc. the names I listed tend to be the more commonly used ones. You often hear "defensive carbine" referring to the carbines and the classes they are being used for which is primarily self/home defense. The semantics imply the use. I usually refer to mine as a carbine sometimes a rifle or sometimes an AR.

Jeff Cooper called them poodle shooters.

Jeff Cooper had a lot of good gun opinions and at times a lot of arrogance...

He justifiably had and still has a lot of admirers, but what's not very often said is he also had a lot of folks who thought him a big blowhard...