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http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2011/10/14/ ... mcdonalds/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So its New York, the rules there are different. Its hard to tell what really happened, but I would say if it was in Houston, the McDonald's employee would have been patted on the back by the police. It appears to be at night. It also seems the "victims" are on the wrong side of the counter.

In my opinion it was a good thing that Chris Wragge left Houston for New York as this sort of one sided journalism doesn't work for me here in Houston. It probably plays a lot better where he is.

So if it was the daytime, would he still be within his rights to subdue the "victims" with a metal bar or must he retreat and only use equal force to protect himself and his other employees?

From the information provided I think he was justified in defending himself, but not retreating and returning to the scene with a club. That is certainly some interesting journalism. The author admits the women attacked first and has no compassion for the cashier.

Considering the guy was doing his job at work, undoubtedly verbally threatened, physically assaulted, and pursued by TWO intoxicated individuals, I don't see why HE is being made out to be the bad guy. Frankly, it makes me sick to my stomach to see the media portray criminals as the "victims" when citizens defend themselves, but I've come to expect that over the years.

This dude does NOT deserve to be prosecuted for this incident, as he is clearly NOT the instigator.

Despite his past criminal record, this man was at work and doing his job when he was assaulted and his personal space was invaded. I do however think he took it a little too far,(but not by much, because they asked for it.) If you asked me he is the victim, not the people laying on the ground when it's over.

I'm going to have to disagree. He was fine when he went back, got the metal bar and took the first swing at them. When they retreated and then fell to the ground, and then he continue hitting them while on the ground, he crossed the line between self defense and assault. Just like the pharmacist that shot some guys trying to rob him. He was fine (self defense) until he went back, got a second gun and shot the guy that was wounded and defenseless on the ground. He crossed the line between self defense and murder.

Right, once the perp stops he should stop. Maybe I should just say I don't feel sorry for the perp.

JJVP wrote:I'm going to have to disagree. He was fine when he went back, got the metal bar and took the first swing at them. When they retreated and then fell to the ground, and then he continue hitting them while on the ground, he crossed the line between self defense and assault. Just like the pharmacist that shot some guys trying to rob him. He was fine (self defense) until he went back, got a second gun and shot the guy that was wounded and defenseless on the ground. He crossed the line between self defense and murder.

fishman wrote:Right, once the perp stops he should stop. Maybe I should just say I don't feel sorry for the perp.

Exactly what I was going to say. If they are on the ground they aren't a threat anymore.
After the first few whacks it went from being SD to him making it personal and not having control of his temper.
He shouldn't have come back with the rod. IMO he should have just gone hand-to-hand with them OR retreat to the pipe and if the continue to follow then give them a few whacks but I think he was wrong for removing himself from the situation and then reappearing just to take a few swings.
Yes the women stated it while he was only trying to do his job but I don't have a problem with him being charged.
The women should be charged as well. Just because they got a butt whooping doesn't mean their offences didn't take place.

Man enters your house after dark, hits you, you retreat, grab a fireplace tool and hit the intruder. You hit the intruder after he has fallen to the ground. Your internal video system captures you doing this.

Are you guilty of a crime in Texas? (remember you could have just opened up with your shotgun and would have been within your rights)

What about if its during the daytime? Does anything change?

Your a bank teller, a man jumps the counter and hits you.....

Strange man comes into your office at work and begins beating your receptionist, she screams for help....

MedicMan218 wrote:

JJVP wrote:I'm going to have to disagree. He was fine when he went back, got the metal bar and took the first swing at them. When they retreated and then fell to the ground, and then he continue hitting them while on the ground, he crossed the line between self defense and assault. Just like the pharmacist that shot some guys trying to rob him. He was fine (self defense) until he went back, got a second gun and shot the guy that was wounded and defenseless on the ground. He crossed the line between self defense and murder.

fishman wrote:Right, once the perp stops he should stop. Maybe I should just say I don't feel sorry for the perp.

Exactly what I was going to say. If they are on the ground they aren't a threat anymore.
After the first few whacks it went from being SD to him making it personal and not having control of his temper.
He shouldn't have come back with the rod. IMO he should have just gone hand-to-hand with them OR retreat to the pipe and if the continue to follow then give them a few whacks but I think he was wrong for removing himself from the situation and then reappearing just to take a few swings.
Yes the women stated it while he was only trying to do his job but I don't have a problem with him being charged.
The women should be charged as well. Just because they got a butt whooping doesn't mean their offences didn't take place.

Should he have done it? Probably not.
Would I vote him guilty if I was was sitting on his jury? No way.

Another example of when two wrongs make ...... two wrongs..

OTOH, I really enjoyed the video.... and not just because the news lady (Christina) is a cutie.

None of them are heroes...but the lesson of this incident is: leave people the heck alone. The women thought this dude was just another McD's register guy that they could jump on over some trivial stuff...turned out he was a bad man who was quite capable of turning it back on them. There are incidents like this all the time; you either don't hear about them, or they get twisted like crazy by the liberal media, as they tried to do in this case. I'd bet if they hadn't provoked that guy, he wouldn't have done a thing to them. I doubt he WANTED to go back to jail, but once they started in, all bets were off.

If the bad guys don't like getting hit when they're defenseless, they shouldn't attack people. Problem solved. That's a good principle whether we're talking about fast food restaurants in New York, drug stores in Oklahoma, or somewhere in Yemen.

If the bad guys start it, they shouldn't complain when the good guys finish them. By any means necessary.

I almost want to start a legal defense fund for the guy. You know McDonald's is not going to defend him. He just came to work one day, and ended up in jail after a customer attacked him. He's going to be thrown to the wolves.

The "victims" are going to sue McDonald's and collect millions. Doubtful they will receive a day in jail.

Jumping over the counter at McDonald's and beating the employee's may become the new sport, rather than the current one of just beating up or shooting the other customers in the store.

I can see the new employee video's at McDonald's, what to do when a customer jumps over the counter and starts beating you. How to respond. Do you fight back?

The guy was a felon, he had killed someone and spent 10 years in prison. I almost wonder if he was reacting the way he would have in prison. He was wrong in the fact that once the threat had stopped he kept attacking. If he would have stopped after he broke the first ladies arm he would have been fine. Beating them after they were on the ground is not self defense. I'm not sure if you can still view the video or not, but it was clear to me he was in the wrong when he kept going after the threat had ceased. Of course, my opinion all comes from watching a couple minutes of bad video.....

Lots of different opinions on this one..........Let me throw in another angle on the situation. Once he had them beat down on the floor and he continued beating them in the head with an iron rod, he started inflicting some serious damage ......even to the point of endangering their lives. Now, suppose you had just walked in at this point, unaware of how it all got started, with your concealed weapon and, seeing someone being attacked on the floor with an iron rod, you react to save her life by shooting the MickeyD's employee. Would that be a justified shooting?