Gun Storage programs in Texas?

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DEB
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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#16

Post by DEB » Wed May 29, 2019 8:19 am

The Annoyed Man wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 5:32 pm
My understanding is that Gov. Abbott has line item veto power? If so, he may well veto that line item so that he can sign the budget bill. In any case:
bblhd672 wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 5:18 pm
Received email below from TSRA:

Dear TSRA Members, Family and Friends:

Gun Storage and Fake News

The media has reported a bill passed in the Texas Legislature dealing with firearms storage restrictions.

This is not only misleading, it is untrue, hog-wash, and wrong!

The lines below were added to a budget bill authorizing a relatively small amount of funding for the Texas Department of Public Safety to develop a gun storage safety information campaign.

Currently there is gun storage information on the DPS website and safe gun storage has always been part of other programs such as the LTC class materials.

The exact language of what was included in this portion of the budget bill is below. The underlined language was added to confirm legislative intent and as a safe-guard. It was added by a State Representative, a staunch supporter of Texas gun-rights.

It reads as follows:
Statewide Safe Gun Storage Campaign. Included in the amounts appropriated above in Strategy G.1.1, Headquarters Administration, is $500,000 in fiscal year 2020 and $500,000 in fiscal year 2021 in General Revenue to establish and promote a statewide safe gun storage campaign.
The public awareness campaign shall begin no later than September 1, 2020. The public awareness campaign may include online materials, printed materials, public service announcements, or other advertising media. The public awareness campaign may not convey a message that it is unlawful under state law to keep or store a firearm that is loaded or that is readily accessible for self- defense.


Sincerely,

Alice Tripp
Legislative Director
Texas State Rifle Association
the NRA state affiliate
The highlighted part seems to indicate that this "sends a message", but mandates nothing.
But neither does it convey that it is LAWFUL under state law to keep or store a firearm that is loaded or that is readily accessible for self-defense.
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The Annoyed Man
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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#17

Post by The Annoyed Man » Thu May 30, 2019 10:00 am

DEB wrote:
Wed May 29, 2019 8:19 am
The Annoyed Man wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 5:32 pm
My understanding is that Gov. Abbott has line item veto power? If so, he may well veto that line item so that he can sign the budget bill. In any case:
bblhd672 wrote:
Tue May 28, 2019 5:18 pm
Received email below from TSRA:

Dear TSRA Members, Family and Friends:

Gun Storage and Fake News

The media has reported a bill passed in the Texas Legislature dealing with firearms storage restrictions.

This is not only misleading, it is untrue, hog-wash, and wrong!

The lines below were added to a budget bill authorizing a relatively small amount of funding for the Texas Department of Public Safety to develop a gun storage safety information campaign.

Currently there is gun storage information on the DPS website and safe gun storage has always been part of other programs such as the LTC class materials.

The exact language of what was included in this portion of the budget bill is below. The underlined language was added to confirm legislative intent and as a safe-guard. It was added by a State Representative, a staunch supporter of Texas gun-rights.

It reads as follows:
Statewide Safe Gun Storage Campaign. Included in the amounts appropriated above in Strategy G.1.1, Headquarters Administration, is $500,000 in fiscal year 2020 and $500,000 in fiscal year 2021 in General Revenue to establish and promote a statewide safe gun storage campaign.
The public awareness campaign shall begin no later than September 1, 2020. The public awareness campaign may include online materials, printed materials, public service announcements, or other advertising media. The public awareness campaign may not convey a message that it is unlawful under state law to keep or store a firearm that is loaded or that is readily accessible for self- defense.


Sincerely,

Alice Tripp
Legislative Director
Texas State Rifle Association
the NRA state affiliate
The highlighted part seems to indicate that this "sends a message", but mandates nothing.
But neither does it convey that it is LAWFUL under state law to keep or store a firearm that is loaded or that is readily accessible for self-defense.
The law does not make a thing lawful, which is already lawful. That is a basic principle. ALL things are, by default, lawful, unless a law has been passed making it UNlawful. Subsequent modifications to existing law may restore the lawfulness of a thing either fully or in part, but if no law has previously existed making that thing unlawful, then its lawfulness requires NO positive affirmation under the law. CHL/LTC is a perfect example of this principle. Until a law was passed making it unlawful to carry a handgun in public, it was perfectly legal to do so. After the law making handgun carry illegal was passed, modifications to the law were made which partially restored the legality of it, with conditions.....namely the requirement for a license, then open carry, etc., etc. Constitutional carry - it it is ever passed - would restore the lawfulness of handgun carry to its original status, as described in the state's constitution.

That is why no positive affirmation is necessary. The right to NOT store a firearm in a safe already exists, because its default status is that it is lawful to not do so, and that status has not been modified by law. Furthermore, the language of the storage bill which I highlighted positively affirms that the storage campaign is forbidden to use language even implying that failure to take part in the campaign's goals would be unlawful.
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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#18

Post by Rubicon » Thu May 30, 2019 11:23 am

The Annoyed Man wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 10:00 am
The law does not make a thing lawful, which is already lawful. That is a basic principle. ALL things are, by default, lawful, unless a law has been passed making it UNlawful.
A lot of police don't seem to agree with you.
the die is cast

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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#19

Post by The Annoyed Man » Thu May 30, 2019 1:42 pm

Rubicon wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 11:23 am
The Annoyed Man wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 10:00 am
The law does not make a thing lawful, which is already lawful. That is a basic principle. ALL things are, by default, lawful, unless a law has been passed making it UNlawful.
A lot of police don't seem to agree with you.
I agree, but that is a police training/education issue, not a matter of law. So even if there were legislation positively affirming affirming that storage in a locked container is NOT mandated, there is always going to be a cop somewhere who either thinks he/she knows better than the law....or is simply ignorant of the law. Fortunately, a lot of defense lawyers and judges do agree with me. The law is what it is, and there’s always going to be a bad apple cop somewhere who makes it up as he/she goes along. As long as this is true ... and it has always been true ... there will always be a need for lawyers.

And I do not mean to imply that all cops are bad apples. Many, probably most, have a healthy respect for and a decent working knowledge of the law at the street level. But humans being imperfect, there’s always going to be one who is more concerned with making arrests than with upholding the Constitution. And that is a police academy or agency training/education issue. There’s already too many damned laws on the books.

And consider this... once there’s a law on the books affirming the legality of a thing, that law can be reversed, and the ignorant would then interpret that to mean that that thing's default status was "unlawful", and that it’s unlawfulness was restored....which defies centuries of legal tradition.
Give me Liberty, or I'll get up and get it myself.—Hookalakah Meshobbab
I don't carry because of the odds, I carry because of the stakes.—The Annoyed Boy
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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#20

Post by Papa_Tiger » Thu May 30, 2019 3:22 pm

The Annoyed Man wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 1:42 pm
There’s already too many damned laws on the books.
As I'm fond of saying, "Mankind couldn't keep one rule, we can't keep 10, what makes you think another one will change that?"

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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#21

Post by The Annoyed Man » Thu May 30, 2019 5:30 pm

Papa_Tiger wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 3:22 pm
The Annoyed Man wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 1:42 pm
There’s already too many damned laws on the books.
As I'm fond of saying, "Mankind couldn't keep one rule, we can't keep 10, what makes you think another one will change that?"
Exactly.
Give me Liberty, or I'll get up and get it myself.—Hookalakah Meshobbab
I don't carry because of the odds, I carry because of the stakes.—The Annoyed Boy
My dream is to have lived my life so well that future generations of leftists will demand my name be removed from buildings.

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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#22

Post by G.A. Heath » Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:25 pm

Just an update, while checking my email I saw Alice Tripp had sent out an email with the subject line of "Balanced and Rhetoric Free" that contained a quote from an email sent by Joe Bartozzi. He is the president of the NSSF and in his email he says:
This year, we are happy to announce that we have received a $1 million grant from the state of Texas to distribute educational materials and cable locks to Texas residents through a network of law enforcement and community partners.
So this big bruhaha that the media and anti-gun-rights folks were claiming as a victory actually meant that money went to the gun industry's own association, a twist I find rather ironic. :rolll
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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#23

Post by Bitter Clinger » Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:38 pm

Maybe Gun Storage in Texas should start with the DPD: :banghead:

http://www.fox4news.com/news/dallas-pol ... police-car
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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#24

Post by jason812 » Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:59 am

Bitter Clinger wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:38 pm
Maybe Gun Storage in Texas should start with the DPD: :banghead:

http://www.fox4news.com/news/dallas-pol ... police-car
Are police rifles not stamped with a manufacturer name? I wonder if this one had a fun switch? When it's used in a crime, will the rifle be used to further the anti gun narrative?


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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#25

Post by jason812 » Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:02 am

G.A. Heath wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:25 pm
Just an update, while checking my email I saw Alice Tripp had sent out an email with the subject line of "Balanced and Rhetoric Free" that contained a quote from an email sent by Joe Bartozzi. He is the president of the NSSF and in his email he says:
This year, we are happy to announce that we have received a $1 million grant from the state of Texas to distribute educational materials and cable locks to Texas residents through a network of law enforcement and community partners.
So this big bruhaha that the media and anti-gun-rights folks were claiming as a victory actually meant that money went to the gun industry's own association, a twist I find rather ironic. :rolll
Other than gun shops, does anybody actually use the cable locks that are required to be with a new gun when purchased? I'm going to guess very few people use these and this is a waste of tax payer money and a feel good bill.


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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#26

Post by roadkill » Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:33 am

jason812 wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:02 am
G.A. Heath wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:25 pm
Just an update, while checking my email I saw Alice Tripp had sent out an email with the subject line of "Balanced and Rhetoric Free" that contained a quote from an email sent by Joe Bartozzi. He is the president of the NSSF and in his email he says:
This year, we are happy to announce that we have received a $1 million grant from the state of Texas to distribute educational materials and cable locks to Texas residents through a network of law enforcement and community partners.
So this big bruhaha that the media and anti-gun-rights folks were claiming as a victory actually meant that money went to the gun industry's own association, a twist I find rather ironic. :rolll
Other than gun shops, does anybody actually use the cable locks that are required to be with a new gun when purchased? I'm going to guess very few people use these and this is a waste of tax payer money and a feel good bill.
My son uses one of mine on a recycled feed supplement bucket that he stores his welding hood and clothes in at school. I suspect that there are many others using these locks in another manner than intended. But hey at least they are being utilized in some manner rather than thrown in the garbage.

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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#27

Post by oljames3 » Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:08 am

jason812 wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:02 am
G.A. Heath wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:25 pm
Just an update, while checking my email I saw Alice Tripp had sent out an email with the subject line of "Balanced and Rhetoric Free" that contained a quote from an email sent by Joe Bartozzi. He is the president of the NSSF and in his email he says:
This year, we are happy to announce that we have received a $1 million grant from the state of Texas to distribute educational materials and cable locks to Texas residents through a network of law enforcement and community partners.
So this big bruhaha that the media and anti-gun-rights folks were claiming as a victory actually meant that money went to the gun industry's own association, a twist I find rather ironic. :rolll
Other than gun shops, does anybody actually use the cable locks that are required to be with a new gun when purchased? I'm going to guess very few people use these and this is a waste of tax payer money and a feel good bill.
We hardly ever use the locks that came with our pistols. We own four pistols. Three are consistently in use. The other is in a locked case. If I am not carrying my backup Ruger LCR, for some strange reason, and we have minors visiting, I'll put the padlock through the Ruger's cylinder.
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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#28

Post by DynamicDan » Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:15 am

I never use any of the locks on my guns. It' s just me and my wife. If some one comes over with children we make sure that guns and ammo are not available.

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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#29

Post by Bitter Clinger » Fri Jun 07, 2019 10:38 am

jason812 wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:02 am
G.A. Heath wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:25 pm
Just an update, while checking my email I saw Alice Tripp had sent out an email with the subject line of "Balanced and Rhetoric Free" that contained a quote from an email sent by Joe Bartozzi. He is the president of the NSSF and in his email he says:
This year, we are happy to announce that we have received a $1 million grant from the state of Texas to distribute educational materials and cable locks to Texas residents through a network of law enforcement and community partners.
So this big bruhaha that the media and anti-gun-rights folks were claiming as a victory actually meant that money went to the gun industry's own association, a twist I find rather ironic. :rolll
Other than gun shops, does anybody actually use the cable locks that are required to be with a new gun when purchased? I'm going to guess very few people use these and this is a waste of tax payer money and a feel good bill.
You could donate your unused locks to the Dallas Police Department so that they can secure their firearms from theft and misuse.
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Re: Gun Storage programs in Texas?

#30

Post by strogg » Fri Jun 07, 2019 11:52 am

I have a bin full of cable locks. It's next to my pile of youth firearm safety whatever handouts. Do I use them? No. That's what my safe is for. I'd donate them to DPD per Bitter Clinger's suggestion, but I"m afraid they won't know how to use them. I can imagine them being attached to the trigger guard like key chains. Haha

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