Gun Buster Sign

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Bayoutalker
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Gun Buster Sign

#1

Post by Bayoutalker » Fri Apr 22, 2016 6:58 pm

We went to supper tonight and when we turned into the parking lot of the shopping center this sign was posted just as you turn in the drive. This is not a legal sign and I don't believe they can legally make the entire parking lot off limits. Correct me if I am wrong. There is another drive entering the shopping center and there is no sign posted at the second entrance.

Should this type of sign be reported?
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Cliff H.
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CleverNickname
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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#2

Post by CleverNickname » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:06 pm

Bayoutalker wrote:Should this type of sign be reported?
To whom, for what reason?

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WildBill
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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#3

Post by WildBill » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:08 pm

Bayoutalker wrote:We went to supper tonight and when we turned into the parking lot of the shopping center this sign was posted just as you turn in the drive. This is not a legal sign and I don't believe they can legally make the entire parking lot off limits. Correct me if I am wrong. There is another drive entering the shopping center and there is no sign posted at the second entrance.

Should this type of sign be reported?
Report it to whom? This sign is NOT illegal. It is not enforceable, but it is not illegal to post it.

If you were to report it to the shopping center they might decide to post a proper sign.

If the sign was posted on a government owned building it would be a different matter.

IMO, keep it to yourself. :tiphat:
Last edited by WildBill on Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Bayoutalker
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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#4

Post by Bayoutalker » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:12 pm

CleverNickname wrote:
Bayoutalker wrote:Should this type of sign be reported?
To whom, for what reason?

I guess that was my question. I'm sure there is no point in trying to talk to whoever posted it.
Cliff H.
Beaumont, TX


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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#5

Post by Bayoutalker » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:15 pm

WildBill wrote:
Bayoutalker wrote:We went to supper tonight and when we turned into the parking lot of the shopping center this sign was posted just as you turn in the drive. This is not a legal sign and I don't believe they can legally make the entire parking lot off limits. Correct me if I am wrong. There is another drive entering the shopping center and there is no sign posted at the second entrance.

Should this type of sign be reported?
Report it to whom? This sign is NOT illegal. It is not enforceable, but it is not illegal to post it.

If you were to report it to the shopping center they might decide to post a proper sign.

IMO, keep it to yourself. :tiphat:
I'm sure it would do no good to talk to whoever posted it so that was not a consideration.

If they did post a .06/.07 would it be legal if posted at that location to make the whole parking lot off limits? I don't know of any of the businesses in the complex that are posted.
Cliff H.
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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#6

Post by CleverNickname » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:20 pm

Bayoutalker wrote:
CleverNickname wrote:
Bayoutalker wrote:Should this type of sign be reported?
To whom, for what reason?
I guess that was my question. I'm sure there is no point in trying to talk to whoever posted it.
They would be the last person who you'd want to notify. As it is, that sign is unenforceable, and licensees are legal to carry there. The best thing that could happen is that they remove the sign, and any licensee would still be legal to carry there. Effectively nothing changes. What's more likely is that they post a 30.06 sign. There's no possible positive outcome.


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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#7

Post by Bayoutalker » Sat Apr 23, 2016 7:38 am

But would the .06 sign be legal for the entire parking lot?
Cliff H.
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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#8

Post by ScottDLS » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:12 am

Bayoutalker wrote:But would the .06 sign be legal for the entire parking lot?
Theoretically yes and would prevent you from CC in the parking lot, but you could still keep in your car without breaking the law.
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"


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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#9

Post by imkopaka » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:27 am

IANAL, but I do not believe so. The school carry laws prohibit carry in a parking lot, but amusement park carry laws specifically say: "The term does not include any public or private driveway, street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area." So the law is sort of divided.

Not only that, employee parking lot carry laws prohibit a business from restricting the carry and storage of firearms by their employees in the parking lot.The sign you posted would attempt to do exactly that, meaning that this sign is not only non-compliant, it is illegal as the language makes no exception for employees. If any employee decided to report the sign, it would have to come down.
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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#10

Post by ScottDLS » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:44 am

imkopaka wrote:IANAL, but I do not believe so. The school carry laws prohibit carry in a parking lot, but amusement park carry laws specifically say: "The term does not include any public or private driveway, street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area." So the law is sort of divided.

Not only that, employee parking lot carry laws prohibit a business from restricting the carry and storage of firearms by their employees in the parking lot.The sign you posted would attempt to do exactly that, meaning that this sign is not only non-compliant, it is illegal as the language makes no exception for employees. If any employee decided to report the sign, it would have to come down.
- School carry laws do not legally prohibit carry in a parking lot (unless a school sponsored activity is taking place there).

- The employer parking lot law applies only to employees and simply makes it illegal for the company to fire you for leaving a gun in your car. It only applies to employees, but 30.06 doesn't apply to carry in your car, so visitors would be allowed to drive past a 30.06, but not exit the car while carrying.

-The definition of "premises" applies to all of 46.035, including amusement parks, and excludes walkways and parking areas, but 30.06 refers to PROPERTY, so carrying in a parking lot (outside your car) after receiving proper notice would be a class C misdemeanor, even if you are an employee.
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"


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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#11

Post by Bryanmc » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:48 am

But... The entire shopping center is private property, and likely owned by a single entity (be it an individual or a company). Wouldn't they have a right to post the entire property 30.06 if they so desired?

*edit* posted same time as Scott.


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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#12

Post by mr1337 » Sat Apr 23, 2016 10:13 am

Bryanmc wrote:But... The entire shopping center is private property, and likely owned by a single entity (be it an individual or a company). Wouldn't they have a right to post the entire property 30.06 if they so desired?

*edit* posted same time as Scott.
They would have the right to post a 30.06 sign for the entire property including the parking lot, but you may still be able to carry concealed in your vehicle under the Motorist Protection Act which allows people to carry concealed inside their vehicles without a license. (Remember, 30.06 only applies to licensees.) I say "may" because I'm not a lawyer and I don't know if this has ever been proven in court. But it seems to be a popular opinion.
Keep calm and carry.

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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#13

Post by Tracker » Sat Apr 23, 2016 10:35 am

WildBill wrote:
Bayoutalker wrote:We went to supper tonight and when we turned into the parking lot of the shopping center this sign was posted just as you turn in the drive. This is not a legal sign and I don't believe they can legally make the entire parking lot off limits. Correct me if I am wrong. There is another drive entering the shopping center and there is no sign posted at the second entrance.

Should this type of sign be reported?
Report it to whom? This sign is NOT illegal. It is not enforceable, but it is not illegal to post it.

If you were to report it to the shopping center they might decide to post a proper sign.

If the sign was posted on a government owned building it would be a different matter.

IMO, keep it to yourself. :tiphat:
Since the sign has no legal standing why would it be a different matter if it's government owned and it doesn't refer to section 30.06? The reason I asked, and haven't gotten an answer, is because Dallas has this type of sign on all of its Love Field Airport's main entrances (for the unsecured areas).


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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#14

Post by Bayoutalker » Sat Apr 23, 2016 11:05 am

In this case it sounds like I'll stop doing business with all of the businesses in this shopping center. Even if the sign has no power it does convey to me their intent and that intent is to not want my business.
Cliff H.
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Re: Gun Buster Sign

#15

Post by Mavs00 » Sat Apr 23, 2016 12:09 pm

Bayoutalker wrote:In this case it sounds like I'll stop doing business with all of the businesses in this shopping center. Even if the sign has no power it does convey to me their intent and that intent is to not want my business.
A very prudent, and wise business decision.

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