Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

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philip964
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Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#1

Post by philip964 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:03 am

https://news.yahoo.com/mormon-leaders-c ... 24523.html

Due to new Texas law, Morman Church takes public stand against guns in church.

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LucasMcCain
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#2

Post by LucasMcCain » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:22 am

Do you want your churches to be targeted for shootings? Because that's how you get your churches to be targeted for shootings.
I carry a gun so that I can go home to my family, and if need be, help you go home to yours.

I am not a lawyer.

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RoyGBiv
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#3

Post by RoyGBiv » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:33 am

I have some small first-hand experience with a local LDS church, having helped with some activities during their emergency preparedness festival. Based on what I saw there and discussed with church members, I'd bet heavily against them complying with this new mandate.
I am not a lawyer. This is NOT legal advice.!
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WildBill
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#4

Post by WildBill » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:38 am

RoyGBiv wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:33 am
I have some small first-hand experience with a local LDS church, having helped with some activities during their emergency preparedness festival. Based on what I saw there and discussed with church members, I'd bet heavily against them complying with this new mandate.
:iagree:
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Lena
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#5

Post by Lena » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:51 am

We estimate close to 15-20% of our members weekly are armed here weekly maybe more, also a security team in place armed, very pro 2nd and firearm oriented, no OC allowed
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#6

Post by Grayling813 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 10:54 am

LucasMcCain wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:22 am
Do you want your churches to be targeted for shootings? Because that's how you get your churches to be targeted for shootings.
:iagree:
"Churches are dedicated for the worship of God and as havens from the cares and concerns of the world," the revised policy says. "With the exception of current law enforcement officers, the carrying of lethal weapons on church property, concealed or otherwise, is prohibited."
Now if only evil people intending murder cared about and complies with your policy.....

....and rights for some special classes of people but not for thee.
Keep asking the question, “Cui bono?” (For whose benefit?)
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#7

Post by EastTexasRancher » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:05 am

Holy cow. I cannot imagine going to church unarmed. We all know that churches have been, and mostly likely will, be targeted places. Putting this policy "out there" like this could make those parishioners ducks-in-a-barrel.

The day my church says "no guns" is the day I quit attending. I know I want to meet Jesus one day, I just don't want to rush the event, or make the event any more brutal than it should be.

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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#8

Post by ELB » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:41 am

This is very bad sign for the future direction of the "corporate" LDS church.
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#9

Post by puma guy » Tue Aug 27, 2019 12:10 pm

The letter from the LDS group cites the synagogue shooting, the Charleston and Sutherland Springs shootings , but the Fallon, Nevada shooting targeted an individual. Like others have said I don't believe there will be overwhelming compliance. JMB is shaking his head and doing a facepalm right now.
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Re: Mormon Church takes stand against guns in church

#10

Post by Hoodasnacks » Tue Aug 27, 2019 12:25 pm

As a member of the Church of Jesus Christ, I also believe that there will be little to no compliance with this policy (as it really isn't a change in policy and there hasn't been compliance in the past). The Church itself is very pro gun--and the members are even more so. The Church teaches preparation and self reliance more than most organizations. It is also may be the only religion that has been under military threat by the U.S. Government and nearly had to rely on their second amendment rights for its original purpose. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utah_War). It's members and leaders all understand this concept to an above-average degree.

I believe that the Church is not intending to pull back on its self-reliance stances, nor is it an enemy of 2A people--it is merely noting that sacred buildings are sacred, and weapons can detract from their sacred nature (so maybe we should leave it to Gods will here). It is not a completely irrational stance as I am sure we have a pretty good split of people here that carry at church (that would be an interesting poll).

I disagree that we are diminishing a house of worship by concealed carrying. God gave man agency and therefore there are good guys and bad guys. He also gave us the ability to protect ourselves and expects us to do so. If my bishop tells me I am trespassing, I will let you know. I highly doubt it will happen though--he has a CHL and I know of at least 10 others in my small congregation. We have a lay clergy--if he kicked us out he would have to teach the Sunday school lessons for various groups ;-) .

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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#11

Post by Lena » Tue Aug 27, 2019 12:45 pm

As we told our church lets have a vote of members from 3 services pre announced in a 3 week time frame and go from there, 93% approvals. Since the church has a few paid employees they took notice and adopted state law. We even have LTC classes for members. Several more close also do.
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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#12

Post by carlson1 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 1:02 pm

I will never understand the philosophy of people making whatever policy they want and thinking criminals obey policy’s.

Yesterday my bank put up a sign that said,“No hoodies allowed.” I went into to see the President for a few minutes. We have a great relationship as me being the Pastor of my church and we are in the bank weekly. He did post a 30.07 sign and I have zero problem with that and at that time I even told him thank you for not posting a 30.06 sign because we have done business there for over 20 years and I would hate to leave as a customer. But I brought up the new sign and asked him if thought someone that was determined to rob the bank would remove their hoodie first? He laughed and said that ladies up front was bothered by each person who walked in with a hoodie so he posted to make them happy. It is August in Texas and people still wear hoodies, but either way criminals could care less about laws much less policies.
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Re: Mormon Church takes stand against guns in church

#13

Post by RoyGBiv » Tue Aug 27, 2019 1:21 pm

Hoodasnacks wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 12:25 pm
As a member of the Church of Jesus Christ, I also believe that there will be little to no compliance with this policy (as it really isn't a change in policy and there hasn't been compliance in the past). The Church itself is very pro gun--and the members are even more so. The Church teaches preparation and self reliance more than most organizations. It is also may be the only religion that has been under military threat by the U.S. Government and nearly had to rely on their second amendment rights for its original purpose. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utah_War). It's members and leaders all understand this concept to an above-average degree.

I believe that the Church is not intending to pull back on its self-reliance stances, nor is it an enemy of 2A people--it is merely noting that sacred buildings are sacred, and weapons can detract from their sacred nature (so maybe we should leave it to Gods will here). It is not a completely irrational stance as I am sure we have a pretty good split of people here that carry at church (that would be an interesting poll).

I disagree that we are diminishing a house of worship by concealed carrying. God gave man agency and therefore there are good guys and bad guys. He also gave us the ability to protect ourselves and expects us to do so. If my bishop tells me I am trespassing, I will let you know. I highly doubt it will happen though--he has a CHL and I know of at least 10 others in my small congregation. We have a lay clergy--if he kicked us out he would have to teach the Sunday school lessons for various groups ;-) .
Thanks for sharing your insider perspective. About what I expected, honestly. :tiphat:
I am not a lawyer. This is NOT legal advice.!
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Hoodasnacks
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Re: Mormon Church takes stand against guns in church

#14

Post by Hoodasnacks » Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:17 pm

RoyGBiv wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 1:21 pm
Hoodasnacks wrote:
Tue Aug 27, 2019 12:25 pm
As a member of the Church of Jesus Christ, I also believe that there will be little to no compliance with this policy (as it really isn't a change in policy and there hasn't been compliance in the past). The Church itself is very pro gun--and the members are even more so. The Church teaches preparation and self reliance more than most organizations. It is also may be the only religion that has been under military threat by the U.S. Government and nearly had to rely on their second amendment rights for its original purpose. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utah_War). It's members and leaders all understand this concept to an above-average degree.

I believe that the Church is not intending to pull back on its self-reliance stances, nor is it an enemy of 2A people--it is merely noting that sacred buildings are sacred, and weapons can detract from their sacred nature (so maybe we should leave it to Gods will here). It is not a completely irrational stance as I am sure we have a pretty good split of people here that carry at church (that would be an interesting poll).

I disagree that we are diminishing a house of worship by concealed carrying. God gave man agency and therefore there are good guys and bad guys. He also gave us the ability to protect ourselves and expects us to do so. If my bishop tells me I am trespassing, I will let you know. I highly doubt it will happen though--he has a CHL and I know of at least 10 others in my small congregation. We have a lay clergy--if he kicked us out he would have to teach the Sunday school lessons for various groups ;-) .
Thanks for sharing your insider perspective. About what I expected, honestly. :tiphat:
No problem. In an interesting side note, everyone I know with a CHL (including myself) was ~10 minutes late for church last week so we really didn't receive the oral notice from someone in authority. They will have to tell us later I guess...

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Re: Morman Church takes stand against guns in church

#15

Post by AJSully421 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 5:29 pm

I will not comply. My rear end and my gun will be in the pews for Sacrament Meeting this Sunday... just like always. This is man’s policy, not God’s. Put in armed guards and metal detectors if you want to stop me.

I am also a licensed Body Guard and my wife and kids are under contract, so I am not subject to 30.06/07 or 46.035 anyhow.
"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so." - Ronald Reagan, 1964

30.06 signs only make criminals and terrorists safer.

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