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I thought they carried the Sig 226 .357 Sig now....is the DAO a Sig Sauer? Is it a Sig 226? I didn't know Sig Sauer came in DAO...or that Sig Sauer even made a DAO gun.

Every DPS Trooper I see has a Sig somethingorother in his holster (All I see is the grip)

Commander wrote:My research results - According to the two long time Troopers I just asked: The first gun transition from the Model 28 was to either a 9mm or a .45 - Troopers choice (both Sigs). Then they transitioned to a .357 Sig with decock; then they moved to the current .357 Sig DAO.

I stand corrected on the .45, I just didn't remember that one.

Do you happen to know what model the 9mm was? I've been able to find lots of information on the .45 P220s they issued, but I haven't been able to find anything about the 9mm. I'd suspect it might have been either the 225 or the 228. Not that it matters, but it would be interesting to know for the sake of curiosity.

Doug.38PR wrote:I thought they carried the Sig 226 .357 Sig now....is the DAO a Sig Sauer? Is it a Sig 226? I didn't know Sig Sauer came in DAO...or that Sig Sauer even made a DAO gun.

Every DPS Trooper I see has a Sig somethingorother in his holster (All I see is the grip)

It's not a traditional DAO, it's a lighter DA with reset (partially cocked) called the DAK, for Double Action Kellerman.
http://www.sigsauer.com/Products/ShowCa ... oductid=89

"for the sake of curiousity" methinks that if some of the advancements we have in ammo today was as widely available back then, they might have just ran with the 9mm - which is the same .355" bullet as the ".357 Sig" bullet anyway. An LEO buddy's stock Glock 17 spits the Wincherster Ranger +P+ 127 grainers out at 1,372 fps, which ain't far off the numbers with the legendary 125 grainers out of 4" .357 Mags ...

The truck driver shooting supposedly involved a pair of Texas Highway Patrolmen, but I don't have full details of the shooting.

One of the troopers still had a Sig 220 and the .45 didn't penetrate the truck windshield. The younger trooper had a new (at that time) Sig 226 and the .357 round took care of business. If I recall correctly it was a one-shot stop.

Our department reviewed this shooting and conducted quite a bit of on-site testing prior to us being authorized to carry the P-226 in .357 Sig. Our testing showed the same as DPS's - it's very close to the .357 Mag revolver performance.

Greybeard wrote:"for the sake of curiousity" methinks that if some of the advancements we have in ammo today was as widely available back then, they might have just ran with the 9mm - which is the same .355" bullet as the ".357 Sig" bullet anyway. An LEO buddy's stock Glock 17 spits the Wincherster Ranger +P+ 127 grainers out at 1,372 fps, which ain't far off the numbers with the legendary 125 grainers out of 4" .357 Mags ...

Your comment made me curious, and I went back to look at my numbers where I compared the .357 Mag and 357 Sig rounds. That same day I also fired Winchester 127gr +P+ rounds out of my 9mm BHP.

BHP: Hornady 124 .357Sig JHP/XTP - 1361 fps avg, approx 10 inches penetration (wetpack)
M19: Hornady 125 .357Mag JHP/XTP - 1340 fps avg, approx 10 inches penetration (wetpack)
BHP: Win Ranger 127 9mm SXT - 1223 fps avg, approx 8 inches penetration (I did get a 12" penetraton of wetpack also, but I disregarded it since it was somewhat closer to an edge of the wetpack bundle)

So out of my 9mm, not quite in the same speed range as the 357 rounds, but not too shabby either. These numbers are based on only about four or five rounds apiece -- I may try this again with more rounds some time.

elb

Commander wrote:My research results - According to the two long time Troopers I just asked: The first gun transition from the Model 28 was to either a 9mm or a .45 - Troopers choice (both Sigs).

When they made that move, I asked one of my neighbors down the street about it (at the time, the first three houses on my street were Troopers). He liked the Sig, and said about 90% chose .45s.

Doug.38PR wrote:I thought they carried the Sig 226 .357 Sig now....is the DAO a Sig Sauer? Is it a Sig 226? I didn't know Sig Sauer came in DAO...or that Sig Sauer even made a DAO gun.

Every DPS Trooper I see has a Sig somethingorother in his holster (All I see is the grip)

Its a Sig P226.....I just looked at one personaly.

CHL/LEO wrote:

The truck driver shooting supposedly involved a pair of Texas Highway Patrolmen, but I don't have full details of the shooting.

One of the troopers still had a Sig 220 and the .45 didn't penetrate the truck windshield. The younger trooper had a new (at that time) Sig 226 and the .357 round took care of business. If I recall correctly it was a one-shot stop.

Our department reviewed this shooting and conducted quite a bit of on-site testing prior to us being authorized to carry the P-226 in .357 Sig. Our testing showed the same as DPS's - it's very close to the .357 Mag revolver performance.

One of the Troopers I talked to this morning about the .45 Sigs said that one reason they changed was that the particular type of ammo they were using was not only penetrating the suspect but was passing through and hitting someone else.

^
The .45 ACP.....had was MORE likely to overpenetrate the bad guy and hit a good guy than a .357 Sig????

(with the .357 sig having similar performance) I thought a common complate against police using the .357 Magnum way back was that it was more likely to overpenetrate than a .38 Spl or .45 ACP.

One of the reasons DPS went with the .357 Sig was its performance against barriers like windshield glass, car doors, etc.

txinvestigator wrote:One of the reasons DPS went with the .357 Sig was its performance against barriers like windshield glass, car doors, etc.

I heard that they liked it because it made a lot of noise.

Doug.38PR wrote:^
The .45 ACP.....had was MORE likely to overpenetrate the bad guy and hit a good guy than a .357 Sig????

(with the .357 sig having similar performance) I thought a common complate against police using the .357 Magnum way back was that it was more likely to overpenetrate than a .38 Spl or .45 ACP.

Beats me, but that is what he said....he talked about the type of round that was used forming into a "cutter" of some type.?? Seems like they would have tried a different type ammo....

Do we know how well 357 Sig performs with heavier loads such as the 140 and 147 compared to .357 Magnum heavier loads like 148 (isn't there a bullet with this weight in .357?) 158 and 180

In the early '70s there was a highway patrolman stationed in Post, Texas. Most all the troopers I knew carried S&W Model 28. But this one was issued a Colt Trooper MarkIII. He wasn't the only one. Just to throw another kink in the discussion.