Who has authority to ask you to leave?

[Dave2]

So, how many people would leave and join another church if this happened and the pastor upheld the no-carry policy?

Gun bans are a work of the devil and I can't trust spiritual guidance from anyone who yet believes the father of lies.

I don't think I'd elevate a political ideology, however logical it might be, to the level of God's Truth.

I would, though, attend a church that doesn't prohibit me from protecting myself.

[tacticool]

We are endowed by our creator with certain unalienable rights. Those who violate those rights oppose the will of God.

[gigag04]

The pastor has probably given the LEO permission to have a gun inside the church. The LEO wants to be the only one there with a gun. It's probably a control thing with him.

He is the only one professional enough to handle a gun in church.

Especially if it's a Glock FOWTAY

FYP

Tried (unsuccessfully) to look it up.
Found references, but no definition.
What does FOWTAY mean?

Just say it out loud a few times!

[sjfcontrol]

Just say it out loud a few times!

Yeah, I got it already!

[barstoolguru]

any one that directly works for the church and is an employee of the church has the authority to ask you to leave and that includes security guards that are hired by the church. You might want to clear it up afterwards or not go back but if asked to leave you must or take a chance of getting arrested

[snatchel]

Wow a security team at church.

My have things changed since I was a boy. I remember that Catholic churches were always left unlocked day or night so you could come in and pray at any time. I suppose that has probably changed.

Is everyone on the security team armed. I hope so. I would hate to be a member of a security team and be unarmed. That blocking bullets with your body thing probably doesn't make your day.

I just sort of like CHL allowed and encouraged, so if the devil decides to make a visit, they will find they are unwelcome.

I am Catholic, but don't know if my church's doors are open 24/7 or not.

The security team, unless they are license PI's or something like that, cannot be armed.

I can give you some insight in this..

I am pretty active in our parish and diocese... and the Bishop, Rev's, and Deacons are all anti-carry. As far as I know, no Texas diocese has come out and made an official no-carry statement, they definatly do not support it IN CHURCH.

I am really good friends with a Semenarian, now a Deacon waiting to be ordained a Priest, and this info has come from him. However, he does hve a CHL and does carry to every mass. He will continue carrying once he is a Priest. I carry as well.... we don't have a "security team." I bring my own security

I forget where it was, somewhere up north though, but a State Diocese actually came out with written policy saying something to the effect of: Although our state does recognize the legality of carrying in church, we would appreciate you not doing so.. but as far as MY diocese, nothing like that has happened.

As far as the church being left open 24/7, mine is not. It closes around 7 in the evening. We do have a Eucharistic Adoration Chapel that is open and manned 24\7 though, that way parishoneers in the city can come in and pray or whatever.

[WildBill]

I forget where it was, somewhere up north though, but a State Diocese actually came out with written policy saying something to the effect of: Although our state does recognize the legality of carrying in church, we would appreciate you not doing so...

I could live with that type of policy.

[C-dub]

Wow a security team at church.
I can give you some insight in this..

I am pretty active in our parish and diocese... and the Bishop, Rev's, and Deacons are all anti-carry. As far as I know, no Texas diocese has come out and made an official no-carry statement, they definatly do not support it IN CHURCH.

I am really good friends with a Semenarian, now a Deacon waiting to be ordained a Priest, and this info has come from him. However, he does hve a CHL and does carry to every mass. He will continue carrying once he is a Priest. I carry as well.... we don't have a "security team." I bring my own security

I forget where it was, somewhere up north though, but a State Diocese actually came out with written policy saying something to the effect of: Although our state does recognize the legality of carrying in church, we would appreciate you not doing so.. but as far as MY diocese, nothing like that has happened.

As far as the church being left open 24/7, mine is not. It closes around 7 in the evening. We do have a Eucharistic Adoration Chapel that is open and manned 24\7 though, that way parishoneers in the city can come in and pray or whatever.

That is surprising. I don't doubt you, but it is surprising. The way the church keeps up with the laws, if they have this attitude towards CC, I would think they would post their premises, but they do not. And this is another reason why I don't ask about such things. My church is not posted, but I do not want to be given oral notice. We do have several LEOs in our church and I have seen a few of them openly carrying in their civilian clothes, even taking the sacrament, with no apparent issues.

[snatchel]

I found this while trying to locate that letter I was talking about. It's entertaining.....

http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=341764" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

FOUND IT! Woohoo.

http://freedomeden.blogspot.com/2011/11 ... hurch.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Whatever an individual parish decides to do regarding its policy on concealed weapons, we ask that all people seriously consider not carrying weapons into church buildings as a sign of reverence for these sacred spaces.

[C-dub]

I found this while trying to locate that letter I was talking about. It's entertaining.....

http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=341764" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

FOUND IT! Woohoo.

http://freedomeden.blogspot.com/2011/11 ... hurch.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Whatever an individual parish decides to do regarding its policy on concealed weapons, we ask that all people seriously consider not carrying weapons into church buildings as a sign of reverence for these sacred spaces.

Yup. Entertaining and yet, infuriating.

[The Annoyed Man]

He is the only one professional enough to handle a gun in church.

Especially if it's a Glock FOWTAY

FYP

Tried (unsuccessfully) to look it up.
Found references, but no definition.
What does FOWTAY mean?

Just say it out loud a few times!

Does that mean that a FOWTAY is a FOATIE-FIE set on stun?

[RPB]

Reminds me, after showing my new sights on my Taurus PT709 to the retired LEO in the church kitchen today before church (I, at the church where my membership is, have authority there as property under my control, much as at my home-I may be the only Deacon there soon; sadly, others having some health issues at Hospice level ) and telling him I had my XD45 with the same sights, and he should borrow it, I let him get away without setting a specific range time. I better give him a call tomorrow. His girlfriend, who sits by him has a pink Ruger she just got back from the gunsmith.

Nahum 2:1 He that dasheth in pieces is come up before thy face: keep the munition, watch the way, make thy loins strong, fortify thy power mightily

Luke 22:36 But now ...

Luke 22:38 ... have a BUG (Back Up Gun) too
Luke 22:38 The disciples said, "See, Lord, here are two swords." "That is enough," he replied.

So, I always carry two, since He said to have two, and usually I carry at least 3, though 2 is enough everyone should have one BUG ... I have the third so I could toss the third to the retired LEO if his girlfriend's pink Ruger misfires... I know I have my two, I don't know if she followed the scriptures and brought her two, or just one ... so I like to be able to help those less fortunate or less prepared ...

[philip964]

Whatever an individual parish decides to do regarding its policy on concealed weapons, we ask that all people seriously consider not carrying weapons into church buildings as a sign of reverence for these sacred spaces.

In the movie "Highlander", the immortals could not fight on holy ground as the church was sanctuary. Church sanctuary was recognized by English law from the fourth to the seventeenth century. Unfortunately modern criminals do not respect these ancient holy customs.

"There can be only one"

[Rrash]

I work at a church. My advice is to either stay concealed, or show the pastor (or an elder - maybe one who is pro 2nd amendment?) the law and make a respectful argument for your case. Worst case, you may have to leave your weapon in the car, but hopefully, they are taking the security thing seriously. I was talking to an LEO at my church, and he said the same thing, which I quickly informed him he was wrong. His response, "Oh, my bad...Cool." It didn't bother him one bit. I have noticed a few people carrying here and there, and it makes me feel a little safer.

Unfortunately, while I can legally carry, it is in the employee handbook that I am not to carry any weapons, so I simply respect that request, as they can legally fire me. While I am unarmed, I feel pretty secure knowing that our security team (the Church is about 5K people over 4 services) is made up of 3-5 Sheriff deputies in uniform, a plain clothed security group (made up of off-duty LEO's that go to our Church and volunteer their time), and a well designed plan for keeping children safe.

Ultimately, I'm in God's hands, so I really don't stress too much on this one. I carry every day - everywhere I legally can - just not when I'm at work.

[RPB]

12 minutes ago

police: church attacks kill 15, wounds 40
http://jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/2012 ... lead5.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Gunmen killed two policemen guarding a church, snatched their rifles and then opened fire on the congregation from inside and out yesterday, killing at least 15 people and wounding 40, security officials said.

Some things just sound tooooo foolish and I won't fall for the trick

Delegating responsibility for your own safety... What DID Jesus do?

Matt 4:6
And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.

Jesus recognized that not to exercise personal responsibility was foolishly tempting God ...

The rod and the staff of the guys you hired, they comfort me ... but not much ... (see above story hired police rifles kill 15, wound 40 in church today)

I also don't shop at stores where they don't think any grownups of any age are mature enough to handle their own business.