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Abraham wrote:WildBill,

My post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek, but if they don't teach how to comport oneself during an LE traffic stop in Drivers-Ed and make it part of the written test they ought too...we'd probably have more survivors during traffic stops.

Also, maybe start a Public Service Announcement on radio and T.V. about what to do (and not do...) during a traffic stop.

Does that sound like we're leaning toward a police state?

Maybe, I'm not sure, but getting blasted because you're not up on 'how to act' during a traffic stop seems a worthy cause to me.

Well in ancient times I remember being told if pulled over, get out of the car and walk to the police officer. If the old guy has been pulled over in decades (or ever) how would he know what the procedure is or be faulted for that.

Note: I'm not faulting the police officer either if he gave multiple warnings to the old guy. Tragedies happen.

Cedar Park Dad wrote: Note: I'm not faulting the police officer either if he gave multiple warnings to the old guy. Tragedies happen.

This event does not fit my understanding of the word tragedy. This is a crime.

Anygunanywhere

Cedar Park Dad wrote:

Abraham wrote:WildBill,

My post was somewhat tongue-in-cheek, but if they don't teach how to comport oneself during an LE traffic stop in Drivers-Ed and make it part of the written test they ought too...we'd probably have more survivors during traffic stops.

Also, maybe start a Public Service Announcement on radio and T.V. about what to do (and not do...) during a traffic stop.

Does that sound like we're leaning toward a police state?

Maybe, I'm not sure, but getting blasted because you're not up on 'how to act' during a traffic stop seems a worthy cause to me.

Well in ancient times I remember being told if pulled over, get out of the car and walk to the police officer. If the old guy has been pulled over in decades (or ever) how would he know what the procedure is or be faulted for that.

Note: I'm not faulting the police officer either if he gave multiple warnings to the old guy. Tragedies happen.

he told him to put the gun down after he shot him.

I can't open the video either. I'm just going by the earlier quote.

Basically, the old man got out of the pickup truck when he was pulled over for speeding at night and started walking towards the police car. He reached in and pulled a cane out of the pickup bed. Looked like the cane was momentarily swinging in the officer's direction. Meanwhile, the officer is on video screaming, "Drop the gun, drop the gun, drop the gun, . . . " as he shoots him.

If the police officer was issuing instructions before he shot then its very understandable. If not, it aint.

Cedar Park Dad wrote:I can't open the video either. I'm just going by the earlier quote.

Basically, the old man got out of the pickup truck when he was pulled over for speeding at night and started walking towards the police car. He reached in and pulled a cane out of the pickup bed. Looked like the cane was momentarily swinging in the officer's direction. Meanwhile, the officer is on video screaming, "Drop the gun, drop the gun, drop the gun, . . . " as he shoots him.

If the police officer was issuing instructions before he shot then its very understandable. If not, it aint.

He said sir two or three times then started firing. Then said drop the gun.

I'm surprised non of the links work for you. Have you tried looking it up on YouTube? Search "old man cane shot by cop".

mojo84 wrote:

Cedar Park Dad wrote:I can't open the video either. I'm just going by the earlier quote.

Basically, the old man got out of the pickup truck when he was pulled over for speeding at night and started walking towards the police car. He reached in and pulled a cane out of the pickup bed. Looked like the cane was momentarily swinging in the officer's direction. Meanwhile, the officer is on video screaming, "Drop the gun, drop the gun, drop the gun, . . . " as he shoots him.

If the police officer was issuing instructions before he shot then its very understandable. If not, it aint.

He said sir two or three times then started firing. Then said drop the gun.

I'm surprised non of the links work for you. Have you tried looking it up on YouTube? Search "old man cane shot by cop".

The video is easily found on You tube and Fox news. The officer said nothing about dropping a gun until after shooting and before he make the commands to drop the gun. He then waited until after he transmitted "shots fired" before making the drop the gun commands. I pointed this out in my posts when some one said the old man failed to comply. Also the the chief defended the officer's action by stating the victim failed to comply with the officer's shouts. It's that sort of statement that irks me. Whether the cop was hyper reacting, has poor eye sight, is trigger happy or whatever I'll leave to the viewer. So I will let anyone make their own judgements for as to why the officer decided to shoot, justified or not, but if judgment is based on the old man not complying with the officer's commands it's absolutely baseless. Only after shooting did he say anything about a gun. Anyone, including the chief, who says the reason he was shot was failure to comply is someone who, I won't use the term I'm thinking, but I wouldn't want on my jury.

puma guy wrote:

mojo84 wrote:

Cedar Park Dad wrote:I can't open the video either. I'm just going by the earlier quote.

Basically, the old man got out of the pickup truck when he was pulled over for speeding at night and started walking towards the police car. He reached in and pulled a cane out of the pickup bed. Looked like the cane was momentarily swinging in the officer's direction. Meanwhile, the officer is on video screaming, "Drop the gun, drop the gun, drop the gun, . . . " as he shoots him.

If the police officer was issuing instructions before he shot then its very understandable. If not, it aint.

He said sir two or three times then started firing. Then said drop the gun.

I'm surprised non of the links work for you. Have you tried looking it up on YouTube? Search "old man cane shot by cop".

The video is easily found on You tube and Fox news. The officer said nothing about dropping a gun until after shooting and before he make the commands to drop the gun. He then waited until after he transmitted "shots fired" before making the drop the gun commands. I pointed this out in my posts when some one said the old man failed to comply. Also the the chief defended the officer's action by stating the victim failed to comply with the officer's shouts. It's that sort of statement that irks me. Whether the cop was hyper reacting, has poor eye sight, is trigger happy or whatever I'll leave to the viewer. So I will let anyone make their own judgements for as to why the officer decided to shoot, justified or not, but if judgment is based on the old man not complying with the officer's commands it's absolutely baseless. Only after shooting did he say anything about a gun. Anyone, including the chief, who says the reason he was shot was failure to comply is someone who, I won't use the term I'm thinking, but I wouldn't want on my jury.

It wasn't failure to comply because the officer never gave any comands but the officer was trying to get the mans attention. Sir! being yelled like that is a demand for attention and the man either couldn't hear or figure that he was going to finish what he started to do before dealing with the cop. The officer should of taken better verbal control of the situation and have given a command like stop , or get back in the truck. From the viewpoint of the camera, which would be different in quality and angle, I think that officers actions were not unreasonable because I don't doubt that the cop was sure he was seeing a gun pointed at himself. His state of mind was about defending himself and that was why he shot.

While I agree that the officer thought he was defending himself when he shot the victim, there was no real threat. Using deadly force in response to a non existent threat doesn't strike me as a viable defense no matter how scared you are. His spray and pray combat shooting also put the passenger at significant risk. Personally, I think he should face criminal charges as well as the civil suit he will face.

EEllis wrote:[It wasn't failure to comply because the officer never gave any comands but the officer was trying to get the mans attention. Sir! being yelled like that is a demand for attention and the man either couldn't hear or figure that he was going to finish what he started to do before dealing with the cop. The officer should of taken better verbal control of the situation and have given a command like stop , or get back in the truck. From the viewpoint of the camera, which would be different in quality and angle, I think that officers actions were not unreasonable because I don't doubt that the cop was sure he was seeing a gun pointed at himself. His state of mind was about defending himself and that was why he shot.

The time lapse between the officer yelling "sir, sir, sir" and the first of 6 rapid fire shots is less than a second. The man didn't have time to decide he was "going to finish what he started to do before dealing with the cop". I think the man DID respond to the officer yelling "sir, sir, sir"...by turning toward him as he picked up his cane to see what he was yelling about.

mojo84 wrote:

Cedar Park Dad wrote:I can't open the video either. I'm just going by the earlier quote.

Basically, the old man got out of the pickup truck when he was pulled over for speeding at night and started walking towards the police car. He reached in and pulled a cane out of the pickup bed. Looked like the cane was momentarily swinging in the officer's direction. Meanwhile, the officer is on video screaming, "Drop the gun, drop the gun, drop the gun, . . . " as he shoots him.

If the police officer was issuing instructions before he shot then its very understandable. If not, it aint.

He said sir two or three times then started firing. Then said drop the gun.

I'm surprised non of the links work for you. Have you tried looking it up on YouTube? Search "old man cane shot by cop".

Youtube blocked here but I have no reason to disbelieve you.

CowboyEngineer wrote:While I agree that the officer thought he was defending himself when he shot the victim, there was no real threat. Using deadly force in response to a non existent threat doesn't strike me as a viable defense no matter how scared you are. His spray and pray combat shooting also put the passenger at significant risk. Personally, I think he should face criminal charges as well as the civil suit he will face.

Well you may be right in SC but you would be wrong here in Texas based on the law.

Anyone else wondering what happened to the rest of this thread? There was another page of posts yesterday... Hmmm, looked at some other forums on here and it looks like some glitch wiped out a number of posts on several threads that I had read about middle of the afternoon yesterday.

Never mind...should have checked the site issues forum first...already addressed there

Coincidence?

Tic Tac wrote:Coincidence?

A déjà vu is usually a glitch in the Matrix. It happens when they change something.