Selling a Pistol

[cyphertext]

Again, the law requires that you not knowingly transfer a firearm to someone who is prohibited... why advocate more restrictions? If you are going to have all of these extra steps above and beyond what is required by law, then why not support background checks for every transfer? Why not mandate that even private sales must go through an FFL?

[omegaman]

That's cute. Maybe you should get back under your bridge and let the grown ups talk.

Totally uncalled for. Everyone has a right to their opinion without being slammed.

[Taypo]

I am surprised that on a gun board where members advocate carrying firearms past signs that do not meet the requirement of the law, that they would require so much more than what is required by law to sell a firearm privately!

The law does not require anything more than you not knowingly selling a firearm to a prohibited person. Checking DL or CHL can give you a warm fuzzy regarding residency or that they are a good guy, but a bill of sale or other documentation is not needed, NOR REQUIRED, by law.

Now, I'm trying to figure out if you are an anti, or one of those OCT radicals. People on here were simply giving what they felt to be helpful advice to the OP; anyone is free to follow it or not.

Neither, and not sure how you would come up with that. The man asked what was required, by law. The law requires that you do not KNOWINGLY transfer a firearm to a prohibited person, or someone under the age of 18. All the rest of it, such as documenting the sale, is more in line with the gun control way of thinking...

Why add additional constraints that the law does not require?

Making sure that I cover myself and do what I can to ensure that I'm not selling to someone that I shouldn't be is "in line with gun control way of thinking"? Are you serious? You may be perfectly comfortable providing a weapon to someone you just met on the internet, but others may not be. Going so far as to compare that behavior to gun control is a little much.

[Taypo]

Again, the law requires that you not knowingly transfer a firearm to someone who is prohibited... why advocate more restrictions? If you are going to have all of these extra steps above and beyond what is required by law, then why not support background checks for every transfer? Why not mandate that even private sales must go through an FFL?

I DO support backgrounds checks for every transfer and purchase. Luckily Texas has done the work for me with CHL holders.

[cyphertext]

I DO support backgrounds checks for every transfer and purchase. Luckily Texas has done the work for me with CHL holders.

Then you DO support gun control. We have a difference of opinion. Luckily, the law still supports my side of the argument.

[Taypo]

I DO support backgrounds checks for every transfer and purchase. Luckily Texas has done the work for me with CHL holders.

Then you DO support gun control. We have a difference of opinion. Luckily, the law still supports my side of the argument.

[cyphertext]

I am surprised that on a gun board where members advocate carrying firearms past signs that do not meet the requirement of the law, that they would require so much more than what is required by law to sell a firearm privately!

The law does not require anything more than you not knowingly selling a firearm to a prohibited person. Checking DL or CHL can give you a warm fuzzy regarding residency or that they are a good guy, but a bill of sale or other documentation is not needed, NOR REQUIRED, by law.

Now, I'm trying to figure out if you are an anti, or one of those OCT radicals. People on here were simply giving what they felt to be helpful advice to the OP; anyone is free to follow it or not.

Neither, and not sure how you would come up with that. The man asked what was required, by law. The law requires that you do not KNOWINGLY transfer a firearm to a prohibited person, or someone under the age of 18. All the rest of it, such as documenting the sale, is more in line with the gun control way of thinking...

Why add additional constraints that the law does not require?

Making sure that I cover myself and do what I can to ensure that I'm not selling to someone that I shouldn't be is "in line with gun control way of thinking"? Are you serious? You may be perfectly comfortable providing a weapon to someone you just met on the internet, but others may not be. Going so far as to compare that behavior to gun control is a little much.

Yes, requiring documentation of a sale is in line with gun control thinking. Again, if you want to see a CHL, fine, I'll show it to you... but I'm not letting anyone make copies of it, or writing down the info from it. It isn't required by law, and if we just met on the internet, I don't know what you plan to do with that info...

I have an acquaintance that sold a pistol that was later used in a robbery. He had purchased it new, so he was contacted by law enforcement. He told them he sold it on or around such date... they asked if he had a bill of sale, he responded no, as it is not required by law. The officer thanked him for his time and left. End of story. Follow the law and there is no need for CYA...

[The Wall]

So now I know sale must be to a Texas resident thanks to this forum. Can you ship a handgun to someone that is a resident without FFL transfer?
If I want to sell a gun to a friend in Houston can I Fedex it to him as an example?

[cyphertext]

So now I know sale must be to a Texas resident thanks to this forum. Can you ship a handgun to someone that is a resident without FFL transfer?
If I want to sell a gun to a friend in Houston can I Fedex it to him as an example?

Yes, you can... however, it is expensive. USPS will not ship a handgun for you as a private party. You would have to check with UPS and FedEx to find out what their current policies are regarding the intrastate shipping of firearms. Previously, they would only do it with the next day air / overnight shipping option. I do not know what their current policy is.

Also, you can sell to a non-resident. The transaction just has to go through a FFL.

[LSUTiger]

Personally, for any gun sale that has a paper trail that leads back to me or for guns I buy, I like to have at least a bill of sale (preferably notarized) and preferably at least a copy of the buyers/sellers DL. I would prefer a CHL. I am willing to give them a copy of mine if they reciprocate. If they are willing to go to an FFL then that's OK by me.

Legally binding paperwork on a gun transaction, while not required on a private transaction is a form of protection, for the seller, against any future crimes that may be committed with that firearm or for the buyer, protection from crimes committed previously .

The person you sell to may not be a criminal but the person he may sell it to later might be.

No background check is done.

It just shows when you took/gave up legal possession and points to who has/had it before and after you in case the need arises. Once the gun leaves your possession it is out of your control.

I think it makes sense. When police find a gun used in a crime they will trace it back to the manufacturer then back to the FFL and back to the original purchaser and then if the original purchaser has paperwork they can trace it back to someone he sold it to an on and on until the paper trail ends or they can prove who had the gun at the time of the crime. IDK for sure, I've never had it happen to me, so I don't know exactly what would happen if a gun you sold later was used in a crime. I suppose that the evidence shows who committed the crime, and if there is no link between victim and the seller then you'll probably never even hear about it and the police will assume the gun was sold or you might get a phone call to see if it was stolen. Assuming a paper trail leads to you.

Perhaps someone with more knowledge can elaborate?

So for me, I see it as a form of legal protection than a form of registration or gun control. No paper work exists with an FFL.

[JALLEN]

.......

The man asked what was required, by law. The law requires that you do not KNOWINGLY transfer a firearm to a prohibited person, or someone under the age of 18. All the rest of it, such as documenting the sale, is more in line with the gun control way of thinking...

Why add additional constraints that the law does not require?

Actually, I asked about "..... the requirements, do's and don'ts, the "smart" tips to avoid selling to Julio the gangbanger or Ahmed the terrorist, wannabe, and other undesirables, if you get my drift?"

Some years ago, I had the unpleasant experience of having a pistol stolen, probably by a workman in my home, that was found a few days later under the seat of a car in the parking lot of a high school, at ~4 AM, occupied by a couple of "dudes" who had no business having a gun.

I wish to comply with all legal requirements, of course, but also to do what I can to avoid putting a firearm in the wrong hands. Anything less than that is stupid and careless.

[cyphertext]

.......

The man asked what was required, by law. The law requires that you do not KNOWINGLY transfer a firearm to a prohibited person, or someone under the age of 18. All the rest of it, such as documenting the sale, is more in line with the gun control way of thinking...

Why add additional constraints that the law does not require?

Actually, I asked about "..... the requirements, do's and don'ts, the "smart" tips to avoid selling to Julio the gangbanger or Ahmed the terrorist, wannabe, and other undesirables, if you get my drift?"

Some years ago, I had the unpleasant experience of having a pistol stolen, probably by a workman in my home, that was found a few days later under the seat of a car in the parking lot of a high school, at ~4 AM, occupied by a couple of "dudes" who had no business having a gun.

I wish to comply with all legal requirements, of course, but also to do what I can to avoid putting a firearm in the wrong hands. Anything less than that is stupid and careless.

I understand the desire to avoid selling the firearm to the wrong person, however, a bill of sale does not prevent that. Trust your gut... You probably shouldn't sell to the guy with the tear drop tattoo by his eye and 13 tattooed on his neck. In my opinion, asking me to show ID is fine, however if you wish to copy my ID, that is where I draw the line. I will not give my DL # or CHL info to a complete stranger for them to copy for a private transaction. I do not know what you intend to do with that info, nor do I know how you will protect it.

If you are that concerned that you will sell to the wrong person, then either require the transaction to go through an FFL, or sell the firearm on consignment at a shop.

[Javier730]

The buyer is not required to be 21 in a private sale. Federal law states that a licensed dealer can not sell to anyone under the age of 21, but it does not pertain to private sale.

I purchased a few pistols through private sales at some booths at the Saxet when I was under 21.

[rotor]

I have never sold a gun but I may make an exception for the Taurus which is back at the factory. I do buy guns and have used texasguntrader.com. I would not buy a gun from anyone that I didn't previously know without a bill of sale and their proof of ID such as CHL or drivers license and I do want their drivers license number for the record. Is it required legally, no. Is it smart to have that info, I sure believe it is. I personally would be suspicious selling a gun to someone that did not want to fill out the info on a bill of sale. As a buyer I might have to prove someday that I legally acquired the firearm and from whom it was acquired. If I were a seller I would want to cover my rear with documentation just in case. May not be required but if there is no bill of sale I would walk away from the deal. I have never had a seller refuse to fill out a bill of sale and provide a DL# either.

[cb1000rider]

Do you actually ask for ID at the time of the sale and check it against the DL provided?
I've been on the buyer side of this a few times - and it's just as risky there, if not more. It'd be relatively simple to provide a means to cross check serial numbers. Instead, the only real option is to ask for assistance from law enforcement (post sale) - and then it's really too late.

No argument that asking for a bill of sale and DL is a good idea, but how far are you willing to take it?