Is this a legit sign?

CHL discussions that do not fit into more specific topics

Moderators: carlson1, Charles L. Cotton

Soap
Deactivated until real name is provided
Posts: 192
Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2015 11:57 pm

Re: Is this a legit sign?

Post by Soap »

ELB wrote:I believe the Attorney General has already opined on this issue.

Hays County DA asked the AG this question:
(1) Does a sign that says, "Weapons Free Zone," but which does not
include the language of [subsection] 30.06(c)(3)(A), violate the
restrictions imposed on the government by [section] 411.209,
generally (i.e., whether or not the Hays County Government
Center constitutes court premises)?
The AG replied at length (and understand there were other questions that form the context of his answer), but I think the following excerpt is key:
To effectuate the Legislature's intent to prevent governmental entities from seeking to
wrongly exclude handguns from where they are lawful, a court would likely construe section
411.209 to be implicated by any type of notice that seeks to improperly prohibit handguns. Thus,
any oral notice given by a governmental entity regarding the prohibition of handguns, if given
where handguns are lawful, can serve as an improper exclusion in violation in section 411.209.
And the sign about which you inquire that does not use the statutory language but states that the
Center is a "Weapons Free Zone," if placed in an area where handguns are allowed, would
similarly invoke the enforcement mechanism of section 411.209
.
Texas AG Opinion KP-049

Thus it appears to me that a government entity cannot legally post a sign that forbids handguns where they may legally be carried with a license.

In other words, regardless of what the city ordinance says, the sign that the OP is talking about is illegally posted and worthy of a formal complaint.

So I should report it?
User avatar
RogueUSMC
Senior Member
Posts: 1513
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:55 pm
Location: Smith County
Contact:

Re: Is this a legit sign?

Post by RogueUSMC »

They are only prohibiting what is already prohibited.
A man will fight harder for his interests than for his rights.
- Napoleon Bonaparte
PFC Paul E. Ison USMC 1916-2001
Soccerdad1995
Senior Member
Posts: 4340
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2016 8:03 pm

Re: Is this a legit sign?

Post by Soccerdad1995 »

Soap wrote:
ELB wrote:I believe the Attorney General has already opined on this issue.

Hays County DA asked the AG this question:
(1) Does a sign that says, "Weapons Free Zone," but which does not
include the language of [subsection] 30.06(c)(3)(A), violate the
restrictions imposed on the government by [section] 411.209,
generally (i.e., whether or not the Hays County Government
Center constitutes court premises)?
The AG replied at length (and understand there were other questions that form the context of his answer), but I think the following excerpt is key:
To effectuate the Legislature's intent to prevent governmental entities from seeking to
wrongly exclude handguns from where they are lawful, a court would likely construe section
411.209 to be implicated by any type of notice that seeks to improperly prohibit handguns. Thus,
any oral notice given by a governmental entity regarding the prohibition of handguns, if given
where handguns are lawful, can serve as an improper exclusion in violation in section 411.209.
And the sign about which you inquire that does not use the statutory language but states that the
Center is a "Weapons Free Zone," if placed in an area where handguns are allowed, would
similarly invoke the enforcement mechanism of section 411.209
.
Texas AG Opinion KP-049

Thus it appears to me that a government entity cannot legally post a sign that forbids handguns where they may legally be carried with a license.

In other words, regardless of what the city ordinance says, the sign that the OP is talking about is illegally posted and worthy of a formal complaint.

So I should report it?
I would. The actual process involves a complaint to the city agency before you file a formal report, though.
Soap
Deactivated until real name is provided
Posts: 192
Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2015 11:57 pm

Re: Is this a legit sign?

Post by Soap »

Soccerdad1995 wrote:
Soap wrote:
ELB wrote:I believe the Attorney General has already opined on this issue.

Hays County DA asked the AG this question:
(1) Does a sign that says, "Weapons Free Zone," but which does not
include the language of [subsection] 30.06(c)(3)(A), violate the
restrictions imposed on the government by [section] 411.209,
generally (i.e., whether or not the Hays County Government
Center constitutes court premises)?
The AG replied at length (and understand there were other questions that form the context of his answer), but I think the following excerpt is key:
To effectuate the Legislature's intent to prevent governmental entities from seeking to
wrongly exclude handguns from where they are lawful, a court would likely construe section
411.209 to be implicated by any type of notice that seeks to improperly prohibit handguns. Thus,
any oral notice given by a governmental entity regarding the prohibition of handguns, if given
where handguns are lawful, can serve as an improper exclusion in violation in section 411.209.
And the sign about which you inquire that does not use the statutory language but states that the
Center is a "Weapons Free Zone," if placed in an area where handguns are allowed, would
similarly invoke the enforcement mechanism of section 411.209
.
Texas AG Opinion KP-049

Thus it appears to me that a government entity cannot legally post a sign that forbids handguns where they may legally be carried with a license.

In other words, regardless of what the city ordinance says, the sign that the OP is talking about is illegally posted and worthy of a formal complaint.

So I should report it?
I would. The actual process involves a complaint to the city agency before you file a formal report, though.
I saw that, I almost feel bad complaining to them. lol.
thetexan
Senior Member
Posts: 770
Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 8:18 pm

Re: Is this a legit sign?

Post by thetexan »

There's nothing "illegal" about the sign. It's just meaningless to those who are licenced and has no effect. As stated numerous times the city can't make the prohibition and if they could it would have to be by .06/.07 signage.

So there is no sign, 06/07 or otherwise, that is enforceable by a political government entity against LTC holders. There's a similar sign stating what the city of Tyler ordinance is against carrying.

Silly people.
Texas LTC Instructor, NRA Pistol Instructor, CFI, CFII, MEI Instructor Pilot
Papa_Tiger
Senior Member
Posts: 867
Joined: Fri May 24, 2013 9:55 am

Re: Is this a legit sign?

Post by Papa_Tiger »

thetexan wrote:So there is no sign, 06/07 or otherwise, that is enforceable by a political government entity against LTC holders...
...unless license holders are prohibited from carrying a handgun on the premises or other place by Section 46.03 or 46.035, Penal Code
User avatar
RogueUSMC
Senior Member
Posts: 1513
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:55 pm
Location: Smith County
Contact:

Re: Is this a legit sign?

Post by RogueUSMC »

As I said before. it is an ordnance that states (more than likely...it does in Tyler) that it does not apply to licensed carriers. There is nothing to complain about.
A man will fight harder for his interests than for his rights.
- Napoleon Bonaparte
PFC Paul E. Ison USMC 1916-2001
Post Reply

Return to “General Texas CHL Discussion”