Do I REALLY Need to Carry? (Long)

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pfgrone
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Do I REALLY Need to Carry? (Long)

Post by pfgrone »

Please, please repond to this question without flames or any macho rants. My wife and I are seriously considering whether or not to carry and have not made up our minds yet.

Here's the scenario:
We're both over 65. We practice at a target range about once a week.
She shoots a Kahr 9 mm. I shoot a S&W .38 snubbie (Ouch) and a Bersa .380 plus a couple of .22LRs so we're not newbies to handguns.
The handguns were purchased for home defense and target shooting. Two handguns come out of the safe each night and are put on night stands. The bedroom has a deadbolt so we are serious about self defense. I do not have a moral problem with taking a life to protect my own or a loved one. She may be taking a position in a state-wide organization which would require her to drive to various locations in Texas.

Right now we actively practice awareness of our surroundings when out. We lead quiet lifestyles and live in a small town. The TxDPS annual survey of crime indicates our risk levels are very low compared to locations such as Dallas, Houston, or even Austin. We carry oc spray on our persons and have it in hand when going to the car from a mall, etc. We believe the best first line of defense is avoidance if at all possible. The next level of defense is deescalation and lastly spray and RUN.

I am concerned whether we really need to carry outside the home and whether I will escalate greatly the risk of doing something stupid due to adrenaline and perhaps, at a minimum, getting into legal problems because I pulled the gun, or, much worse, harming an innocent person with a poorly placed shot. I know that adrenaline does wicked things to your ability to cooly reason.

Please remember that I am not questioning in any way your decision to carry. I'm trying to make a completely rational decision for myself - whether my wife agrees with me or not. Sincere advice will be appreciated. Paul G.
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nitrogen
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Post by nitrogen »

Here's my take on the whole "carry" thing.

I'd carry. Just because you carry doesn't mean you have to draw and use it.
The fact that you're aware of all the problems due to carrying would make me, personally, worry about you a lot less. Being aware of the possible issues is your best defense.


And ok, I'm half your age, but please don't discount that! :roll:
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Post by nemesis »

I am concerned whether we really need to carry outside the home and whether I will escalate greatly the risk of doing something stupid due to adrenaline and perhaps, at a minimum, getting into legal problems because I pulled the gun, or, much worse, harming an innocent person with a poorly placed shot.
I'm 60 and I carry everywhere I go. At this age, I am long past any testosterone fueled confrontations and trust that my judgement has matured with me.

Having a CHL doesn't mean that you have to carry but it gives you a choice. If you choose to carry and become embroiled in a conflict; you still have a choice of action.
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Post by BlakeTyner »

Mr. Paul,

The fact that you're looking so seriously into it indicates, to me at least, that you would probably be an incredibly safe gun-toter. However, as you well know, it's a personal decision mitigated by a number of factors.

I will say this, though: you and your wife shoot far more than I do, and probably far more than most CHL holders (and LEO's in all liklihood.) Hence, your muscle memory is much more developed than mine, and I'd consider myself to be a pretty good shot. How I'd perform under pressure...well, I honestly don't know. I made the choice to take the class because I didn't want to bring a knife to a gunfight (so to speak) if it ever came to it, which I hope it doesn't.

As a gut reaction, I'd say carry, absolutely. But your decision will be the one that matters, and I'm confident that you'll make the right one for you.
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stevie_d_64
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Post by stevie_d_64 »

Your maturity and skill will dictate your actions...

The fact that you are going out and asking a very good question is not indicative of your desire to hurt anyone...Or does it mean you are looking for a "blessing" or "excuse" to do so...

Since it appears that you both are used to shooting the very instruments that you could carry, when you do decide to obtain the CHL, tells me that you might not have too much of a problem with the idea of doing so...

You've come to the right place to ask "yourself" this question...You will get what I feel is the absolutely the best commentary, and positive feedback, regardless of what you decide to do, on this website...

The one question I would have to ask you is this...And don't take this as me talking down to you at all...

"Are you ready to accept the responsibility, and to also be equally accountable for everything you do in regards to carrying a firearm?"

I would assume you are already...

You and my Dad are the same age...So I am intrigued enough to ask him a rather pointed question...Considering he now lives (retired, for almost 10 years) in rural North East Texas...

"Dad, why do you keep renewing your CHL?"

I think that would be an excellent question to ask as well...

I hope you continue to participate on this website, and ask lots of questions...As I am also sure you have lots of things to offer from your experiences...

I also don't think anyone will tell you "not" to go get your CHL either...

Thats almost a gimme...

Look forward to hearing back from you soon...
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Post by jbirds1210 »

I have lived near downtown Houston and have lived in far east texas. I did not change my practice in either place. I have always enjoyed the option of being able to protect myself and family. I am glad that you are weighing your options. Carrying a firearm is a huge responsibility that should never be taken lightly.
BTW, I don't think you really have to worry about flaming on this board. We are all here to learn and improve our skills.
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Re: Do I REALLY Need to Carry? (Long)

Post by txinvestigator »

pfgrone wrote:Do I REALLY Need to Carry?
I dunno. I DO know that deciding after the fact is too late. ;)
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Post by RPBrown »

Welcome aboard. I don't think you would be flamed by anyone on this board for such a serious question. Although we do kid sometimes, I for one have learned more from this board than any other that I visit, Including PDO. Its the first and last I visit each day.

+1 to the all of the above posts.

One thing to think about though, do you really feel safe when you go out. I carry 24/7 and it has made me more aware of my surroundings. As is stated many times, the best defense you have is between your ears.

I hope that I never have to use mine, but it's nice to know that I have it if that time ever does come.

But as stated above, only you can make that choice and I can see where it could be a difficult choice. So choose wiely my friend, because it is a big respossibility.

You are not much older than I am. The thing that helped me make the choice was my 6 grandkids. Although I would lay down my life for any of my family, with all of the meanness in this world, I would die if something happened to them and I couldn't do anything to protect them.
Last edited by RPBrown on Mon Jan 23, 2006 10:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by BobCat »

Paul,

In about 1980, my girlfriend (now wife) asked my why I did not have a credit card. I answered that I was afraid I might sit up at night, ordering all sorts of un-needed things from the advertisers in the back of Popular Mechanics - that is, I was afraid I might misuse it.

She asked me if I really thought that little of my self-control and I had to answer no, I have pretty good impulse control. So what's the big deal?

I can positively state that, since I've been carrying, I am much more able to ignore insults / road ragers / verbal assaults - sticks and stones, you know? Where I might once have answered back, I now smile and keep my silence and my head.

Not saying do or don't - but I think you probably can figure for yourself whether you are prone to letting your emotions get the best of you.

My main worry is that I will see "it" coming but not really believe it - having lead a fairly calm life so far, recognizing an actual "threat" or "attack" as such, in time to respond, might be a challenge. I'm not worried about flying off the handle and shooting someone without cause - too many times it could have happened and didn't.

Your worry about hitting an innocent with a stray round is valid. However, it seems you spend time at the range and are likely to hit what you are shooting at; and your .38 snubbie is not likely to have taught you to shoot wildly and fast, without aiming.

Anyway, having the license gives you the option, each day, of carrying or leaving it home.

I hope this is useful.

Regards,
Andrew
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Post by stevie_d_64 »

I think this simple thread needs to be bumped to an FAQ or maybe a "sticky" status...

The rationale, advice and commentary in my opinion (by everyone) is classic...And well thought out...

This is why I think this is the best Pro-2nd Amendment and Pro-CCW discussion website on the internet...

Just ask me sometime what website is the first one I visit everyday...
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Post by longtooth »

Welcome aboard. :seeya: You & your wife will never get flammed here. I am 56 & my wife will be 56 in April. I carry 24-7 absolutely, & she almost that much. Not at work. While you decide try something. when I did this it shocked me out of my socks. :shock: :shock: It willl take some discipline. Start keeping records, write it down, when you read in the paper of major trouble at or close to a place you frequent. Opps! that shoe store that was robbed yesterday is only 2 blocks from where we fill up w/ gas. That sort of thing. I now keep a folder titled, "Why I Carry 24-7" When asked I show it to folks & the say "I remember that & I have been there pretty regular too." The last recorse you stated if assaulted was to spray & RUN. If you and YOUR WIFE can outrun young street thugs then you are in far better shape than 80% + of the men & women on this forum. What I found when I began keeping records. I live in a good area & a city that is not considered high crime. Last year 4 banks in Angelina county were robbed at gunpoint. I am in two of them on regular basis. One I was in 2 days before the robbery & at that one the robber said, I have aids & nothing to loose." He did not shoot anyone. Still no guarantee. DPS & Deputy sheriffs spiked the tires of a meth lab runner on highway 69 well north of Lufkin. He ran on rims for a long way stopped at a General Dollar store parking lot. They tackled him before he got in. He was well armed. It is less than half a mile from our house & we shop there regular. After Hurricane Rita a street thug shot & killed an elderly lady in the Randall's parking lot for one bag of groceries. Good part of town. We shop there some. My above bank is in the same area. Albertson's parking lot a checker going to work & abducted by two young thugs. Repeatedly rapped, shot & thrown in Sam Rayburn Lake. We shopped there some. Definately not the seedy part of town. How fast can you spray & RUN? Really only one other grocery chain in our town. At least one of the locations keeps uniformed off duty LE hired on premisis. We don't go there. Local plumbing supply store here. Good part of town & reputable bussiness. I trade there. Mad employee fired & returns w/ rifle, said, "I will clean this place out." Thank you Lord he was arrested before anyone shot. There are others in my folder. None that are the 2:00 AM holdup at the local stop & rob because I am not there & neither will you be. When you read these in the paper one at a time you tend to forget the others. Have them on paper all together & you realize in the last 2 yrs there has been major trouble in places that I go at times of the day that good people are out more frequently that once every 6 months. If you will dilligently watch & write it down while you continue to think about it I think you may be surprised too. What ever you do I know it will be the right decission for you & your wife. Friend of mature age. We are longtooth & bride. 37 yrs next Monday.
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Post by longtooth »

A little on the lighter side now. Man you sure hand her a fine firearm. :thumbsup: Good for you. My bride shoots a Sig 232 in .380. My Mother (75) also shoots the same. Mom carries too. :grin: A little slow but shot a 237 out of 250 when she took her test. Prowd son. ;-) She practices & reloads w/ us. Renews next yr. See you later in the posts. Welcome aboard.
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Post by flintknapper »

Mr. Paul;

Welcome Sir.

Let me say (as others have), that you will never be "flamed" for bringing a sincere and well thought out question to those who are members here.

It sounds as if you and your wife have already taken a number of steps to "take responsibility" for your own safety.

From what I have read, you have already purposed to defend yourself in your home. Apparently, you are willing to include the use of "deadly force" if absolutely necessary (but as a last resort). Statistically, you are probably safer in your home....than when you are out in public. With this in mind, it begs the question: Why limit yourself the ability to defend against a deadly threat, simply because you are outside of your home?

I am glad to live in a State that allows its honest, law abiding citizens...the opportunity to add that "final layer" of protection to their self defense plan.

As others have pointed out, carrying is an option. You needn't carry if you feel that your journeys that day do not warrant it, but... you reserve the "option" to.

You question how you might react in a "situation". I can not answer that, but will say... that you sound like a reasonable person.

My own criteria for self defense (at any level) is: When the consequences of an attackers actions become unacceptable to me!

Naturally, this will vary from person to person, and your response must remain within the confines of the law.

Don't be in any hurry to decide. I am sure you will come to some resolve.

Thank you for your question, and again... welcome.
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Re: Do I REALLY Need to Carry? (Long)

Post by RioShooter »

pfgrone wrote:

Right now we actively practice awareness of our surroundings when out. We lead quiet lifestyles and live in a small town. The TxDPS annual survey of crime indicates our risk levels are very low compared to locations such as Dallas, Houston, or even Austin. We carry oc spray on our persons and have it in hand when going to the car from a mall, etc. We believe the best first line of defense is avoidance if at all possible. The next level of defense is deescalation and lastly spray and RUN.
I wonder how many people eating at Luby's in Killeen felt the same way you do before the gunfire started?
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Post by Crossfire »

As txinvestigator said:
I dunno. I DO know that deciding after the fact is too late. ;)
It's definitely better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it. My advice is: spend the money, take the CHL class, and then make your decision. Many people have come to my class all "gung ho" about carrying and then, at the end of the day, decide that they don't want to carry after all.
You have to know yourself, know what you are willing to do to protect yourself and your family, and then make that decision. Just because you have a CHL does not mean you HAVE to carry, but if you don't have the CHL then you don't have any options.
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