Other Concealable Options?

[Will938]

Hey I didn't really see a good forum to stick this in so forgive me if I put it in the wrong place.

Concealed handguns are basically our heavily regulated trump card, so heavily regulated that as a student I'm forced to leave my pistol behind throughout the day. In effect my CHL is useless most of the time.

My question is, what weapons are available to us in situations we might not necessarily be allowed to carry a pistol concealed?

People on this forum seem pretty well versed in the Texas Penal Code, so does anyone have any insight on tools like OC or a 3 inch pocket knife?

OC would work great for school, but I'm pretty sure thats illegal. A pocket knife on the other hand I'm not so sure about.

What if you've been out drinking, could you legally carry OC or a pocket knife?

Any other situations you can think of where you can't carry a pistol but could substitute something else?

[txinvestigator]

Hey I didn't really see a good forum to stick this in so forgive me if I put it in the wrong place.

Concealed handguns are basically our heavily regulated trump card, so heavily regulated that as a student I'm forced to leave my pistol behind throughout the day. In effect my CHL is useless most of the time.

My question is, what weapons are available to us in situations we might not necessarily be allowed to carry a pistol concealed?

People on this forum seem pretty well versed in the Texas Penal Code, so does anyone have any insight on tools like OC or a 3 inch pocket knife?

OC would work great for school, but I'm pretty sure thats illegal. A pocket knife on the other hand I'm not so sure about.

What if you've been out drinking, could you legally carry OC or a pocket knife?

Any other situations you can think of where you can't carry a pistol but could substitute something else?

Texas does not prohibit the carry of OC, as long as you carry a small, commercially available device sold for personal protection.

You can carry a knife with a blade less than 5 1/2 inches as long as;

it does not have a blade that folds, closes, or retracts into the handle or sheath, and that opens automatically by pressure applied to a button or
other device located on the handle; or opens or releases a blade from the handle or sheath by the force of gravity or by the application of centrifugal force, or

is not a hand instrument designed to cut or stab another by being
thrown, a dagger, including but not limited to a dirk, stilletto,
and poniard; a bowie knife; a sword; or a spear.

[Will938]

Alright, so then whats the skinny or where OC/pocket knives can and can't go?

I know OC is prohibited at school...if not by law then by the school itself.

What if you're at a bar?
Federal facility?
ect ect

[txinvestigator]

Alright, so then whats the skinny or where OC/pocket knives can and can't go?

I know OC is prohibited at school...if not by law then by the school itself.

What if you're at a bar?
Federal facility?
ect ect

State law does not restrict. See Texas Weapons laws;

http://tlo2.tlc.state.tx.us/statutes/do ... m#46.01.00

[Will938]

It says that chemical dispensing devices are prohibited and in that immediate section doesn't give any exemptions for personal protection. I'll keep looking.

§ 46.05. PROHIBITED WEAPONS. (a) A person commits an
offense if he intentionally or knowingly possesses, manufactures,
transports, repairs, or sells:
(1) an explosive weapon;
(2) a machine gun;
(3) a short-barrel firearm;
(4) a firearm silencer;
(5) a switchblade knife;
(6) knuckles;
(7) armor-piercing ammunition;
(8) a chemical dispensing device; or
(9) a zip gun.

[lrb111]

It says that chemical dispensing devices are prohibited and in that immediate section doesn't give any exemptions for personal protection. I'll keep looking.

If you look at this link, you will see two larger cans in the picture. "(one pound) Those are the "dispensing devices", and they are for LEO only. They use them as crowd control, etc.

The two and four ounce units are legal for personal carry and defense in Texas.

Fox 5.3 has the highest recommendation.

[40FIVER]

What link?

[lrb111]

What link?

would you believe disappearing ink? ok,,,

http://www.selfdefenseproducts.com/pepper/Fox/index.htm

thanks for the heads up.

[KBCraig]

It says that chemical dispensing devices are prohibited and in that immediate section doesn't give any exemptions for personal protection. I'll keep looking.

Ah, but you forgot to check the definition of "chemical dispensing device":

§ 46.01. DEFINITIONS. In this chapter: ( . . . )
(14) "Chemical dispensing device" means a device,
other than a small chemical dispenser sold commercially for
personal protection, that is designed, made, or adapted for the
purpose of dispensing a substance capable of causing an adverse
psychological or physiological effect on a human being.

In other words, a "small chemical dispenser sold commercially for personal protection" is not a "chemical dispensing device", and is not prohibited in Chapter 46.

When reading Texas code, always check the definitions. They matter.

Kevin

[Will938]

Ok then, from what I think I'm seeing (as txinvestigator pointed out), you can carry knives and OC if you go drinking.

As I understand then you can carry whatever is permitted by the post secondary school, which in my case is a pocket knife. That sucks, because I'd much rather have the option to spray someone then be stuck with a knife...though a knife is the better deterrent.

[DustinB]

Personally I wouldn't really pay attention to what the school says about no OC spray. They tell me not to smoke in my vehicle, but texas law says my vehicle is my property, therefore I will smoke in it while having respect for others by not smoking around doorways. I would take any option I had not to have the possibility of having to stab someone as long as the law says it's ok. Besides, the school won't ever see what is in your pockets. Now as for drinking, I wouldn't recommend having a knife or OC spray on me. Don't go out alone, bring friends to watch your back/deter BGs from trying something.

[MrDrummy]

Not trying to hijack this thread, but TX, I've got an old pocket knife that I can very easily swing out just by pushing the blade out just a hair, and whipping my hand down. The blade is of legal length, and everything is legal with it, but that worries me sometimes when I carry it around.

Should I be worried? Since it isn't "DESIGNED" that way, am I in the clear? What do you think?

[DustinB]

Should be perfectly legal. Blade under 5 1/2". Does not open by button or lever. Folding knife, not designed to throw.

(11) "Switchblade knife" means any knife that has a
blade that folds, closes, or retracts into the handle or sheath, and
that:
(A) opens automatically by pressure applied to a
button or other device located on the handle; or
(B) opens or releases a blade from the handle or
sheath by the force of gravity or by the application of centrifugal
force.

I posted this portion because it talks about centrifugal force. I suspect this was listed as a way to describe the "butterfly" knife.

[Will938]

Personally I wouldn't really pay attention to what the school says about no OC spray. They tell me not to smoke in my vehicle, but texas law says my vehicle is my property, therefore I will smoke in it while having respect for others by not smoking around doorways. I would take any option I had not to have the possibility of having to stab someone as long as the law says it's ok. Besides, the school won't ever see what is in your pockets. Now as for drinking, I wouldn't recommend having a knife or OC spray on me. Don't go out alone, bring friends to watch your back/deter BGs from trying something.

The only thing about that is that cops are everywhere here and the chance of being pat down for "weapons" when they question you is a real possibility. If that happens I could get kicked out. Then in the case that I actually do defend myself I likely would be kicked out.

Last week my friend went out drinking for a bachlor party in Austin, some guy got mad that his girlfriend was paying attention to him and gave him one to the face. They got him up and while his friends were dealing with the guy, he wondered out of the bar and ended up by I-35. He started to sober up and realized that he needed a ride home, he was approached by a bum who pointed him in the direction of a taxi, and then started choking him (attempted to mug him I guess). My friend isn't a big guy, maybe 5'4" 170 pounds, he finally got his knife out and ended up stabbing the guy to get away. I guess the moral of the story is, I trust myself not to do anything stupid if I have a knife on me and if I end up needing it, I'd rather have it.

[txinvestigator]

Personally I wouldn't really pay attention to what the school says about no OC spray. They tell me not to smoke in my vehicle, but texas law says my vehicle is my property, therefore I will smoke in it while having respect for others by not smoking around doorways. I would take any option I had not to have the possibility of having to stab someone as long as the law says it's ok. Besides, the school won't ever see what is in your pockets. Now as for drinking, I wouldn't recommend having a knife or OC spray on me. Don't go out alone, bring friends to watch your back/deter BGs from trying something.

The only thing about that is that cops are everywhere here and the chance of being pat down for "weapons" when they question you is a real possibility.

What do you do that you believe the chance of the police questioning you is more than miniscule?

last week my friend went out drinking for a bachlor party in Austin, some guy got mad that his girlfriend was paying attention to him and gave him one to the face. They got him up and while his friends were dealing with the guy, he wondered out of the bar and ended up by I-35. He started to sober up and realized that he needed a ride home, he was approached by a bum who pointed him in the direction of a taxi, and then started choking him (attempted to mug him I guess). My friend isn't a big guy, maybe 5'4" 170 pounds, he finally got his knife out and ended up stabbing the guy to get away. I guess the moral of the story is, I trust myself not to do anything stupid if I have a knife on me and if I end up needing it, I'd rather have it.

No, the moral of the story is don't get so drunk that you become stupid.

If you intend to carry a knife for self-defense, I have a few questions for you;

Is the knife a deadly weapon?

If you pull out the knife and threaten someone with it, what could you be charged with? What possible legal defenses might you have for pulling it out?

Would cutting or stabbing a person with a knife always be deadly force? Do you know what deadly force is?

Under what conditions are you legally justified in using deadly force?

Do you know what happens if you take a knife to a gun fight?