Range Report: Winchester SXT Ammo - Not Good!

[Charles L. Cotton]

This will be short and to the point. I shot only about 40 rounds of Winchester Ranger SXT, both +P and standard, in a tweaked Colt Commander and a friend’s Springfield Champion. Both guns had multiple FTF’s, primarily with the bullet jamming against the top of the chamber. Both guns ran fine (as they have been) using everything from 200 pswc to 230 gr. FMJ’s, Hydra-Shoks, and Golden Saber’s.

This was really surprising and disappointing, since everything I’ve read about the SXT’s has been positive. I also like Jerry’s prices and was planning on switching to SXT’s for all of the 45's my wife and I carry. I’m still going to test the government model’s we have, along with Martha’s Kimber Ultra Carry and my Officer’s ACP. The 5" guns may run better, but I’d be shocked of the 3 ½" and 3" guns like the SXT’s, in view of the problems with the Commander and Champion.

Regards,
Chas.

[Texasdoc]

I have a Kimber CPD and Shoot the SXT out of and it works great and in my cheap (that was the Deal) Charles Daly they shoot fine. in the wife's Wilson Combat I had a few FTF and 2 stovepipes but after a little work on the ramp it works good.

I hope you get your guns to take the SXT's they are great rounds for protection.



Paul

[HighVelocity]

Were these the black box SXT or the Ranger SXT in the tan box?

If it was the Ranger then I am really surprised. The 230gr +P and non +p rounds have run flawlessly in every 45 I own.

One thing I did notice though is that in my Springfield Champion, the Ranger ammo and Wilson 47d mags did not work well together. Novak mags and Springfield mags were fine.

[dolanp]

Probably more of a picky gun issue than the ammo itself being "bad" or anything.

[Paladin]

Wow, good info Chas.

I will say I shot 30-40 rounds of standard Ranger SXT through my USP45 fullsize this weekend and had no issues.

The Ranger's do have an unusual shape to them. Guess they don't feed well in every gun.

Shot 30-40 rounds of Federal Tactical +P through my USP45 too. No issues with that either. The Federal Tactical's have a more conventional shape.

[Charles L. Cotton]

Were these the black box SXT or the Ranger SXT in the tan box?

They were the tan box Rangers (RA45T and RA45P). I was really surprised, based upon all the good comments I’ve seen. Also, I’ve heard of more guns having FTF problems with Golden Saber’s than any other single round, which makes this even more surprising. My gun has fired at least 1,000 rds of my reloads with 230 gr. GS, so I would never have thought the SXT’s would be a problem. If my friend hadn’t had the same experience, I would have suspected something went south in the Commander. (Not really, I shot the others after the problems surfaced.)

Oh well, I’ll try them in the 5" guns, but I guess they aren’t for the Commander. BTW, I used the following mags: Wilson 47, CMC Shooting Star (Wolff springs) and CMC Power Mags.

Regards,
Chas.

[txinvestigator]

Were these the black box SXT or the Ranger SXT in the tan box?

They were the tan box Rangers (RA45T and RA45P). I was really surprised, based upon all the good comments I’ve seen. Also, I’ve heard of more guns having FTF problems with Golden Saber’s than any other single round, which makes this even more surprising. My gun has fired at least 1,000 rds of my reloads with 230 gr. GS, so I would never have thought the SXT’s would be a problem. If my friend hadn’t had the same experience, I would have suspected something went south in the Commander. (Not really, I shot the others after the problems surfaced.)

Oh well, I’ll try them in the 5" guns, but I guess they aren’t for the Commander. BTW, I used the following mags: Wilson 47, CMC Shooting Star (Wolff springs) and CMC Power Mags.

Regards,
Chas.

We have them at the range. I'll run a box thru my CDP and see how they do.

[onerifle]

Paladin- do you know of a reliable supplier for Federal Tactical? I've been looking for some in .40 and 9mm to check out...

Chas- just a hunch, but have you checked the differences in OAL between the GS and the Ranger? It's the first I've heard of Ranger feeding issues in .45. I've been lucky that my PM9 hasn't had issues with Ranger (or anything yet!) and my Glock 23 feeds Ranger...well everything, actually...like a Glock... :)

It might be a worth a trip to the 'smith to tune your guns to the Ranger load...but I'd suspect you'd be well served by both the 230 gr. GS's and Gold Dots...

[HighVelocity]

I really want to know what the problem is and I hope you can figure it out and let us all know.
This is my carry ammo we're talking about.

[onerifle]

I really want to know what the problem is and I hope you can figure it out and let us all know.
This is my carry ammo we're talking about.

As long as you've cycled 100-200 rounds of a specific load through your carry gun, you should be ok. I wouldn't carry any load for defense without running at least 100 rounds first.

[HighVelocity]

I really want to know what the problem is and I hope you can figure it out and let us all know.
This is my carry ammo we're talking about.

As long as you've cycled 100-200 rounds of a specific load through your carry gun, you should be ok. I wouldn't carry any load for defense without running at least 100 rounds first.

I've run 300 rounds of it though my carry gun with zero failures. However, should I ever have a similar problem with this ammo in a different gun, I would like to have an idea of why.

[Charles L. Cotton]

Chas- just a hunch, but have you checked the differences in OAL between the GS and the Ranger?

This is a excellent thought and you may be on to something, with one aberration with Hydra-Shoks. Here are the numbers (OAL for each round; all 230 gr. unless otherwise stated; all function fine in Commander, unless otherwise stated):

Ranger SXT (RA45T) = 1.213"
Ranger SXT (RA45P) = 1.213"
Federal Hydra-Shok = 1.206"
Golden Saber (factory) = 1.231"
Golder Saber (my reloads) = 1.248"
Black Talon (S45A) = 1.215"
West Coast Bullet, 200 gr. pswc = 1.215" (multiple FTF's in Commander; none in 5: gun)
West Coast Bullet, 200 gr. pswc = 1.260"
Hou. Bullet Co. 200 gr. swc = 1.238"
Montana Gold FMJ = 1.246"
ICC 155 gr. Frangible = 1.210" (Run fine in 5" guns; haven't tried in Commander)

So, it's clear that the Ranger SXT's have the shorter OAL's except for Hydra-Shok's. Hydra-Shok's work fine in the Commander, but the bullet design is significantly different from the SXT's.

The shorter reloads using WC 200 gr. pswc at 1.215" are not reliable in the Commander, but run fine in the 5" guns.

I haven't tried the 155 fr. frangibles at 1.210", so I'll try them this weekend.''

The shorter OAL may be the problem. It is well known that 5" guns are more forgiving of "short" rounds than Commanders and it gets worse as the slide/barrel gets shorter. I wish I could buy the 230 gr. JHP used in the Ranger so I could load a longer OAL and give that a try. There's no point pulling the rounds to reload them, if the bullets aren't available anyway.

I'll post an update after I try the frangibles. I'm also going to get Marc to try some of these other rounds in his Champion, so we can see if the FTF's remain consistent between the guns. Some folks are understandably concerned about this report, but if you've run a 100 or more test in your carry gun, I wouldn't worry about it.

Regards,
Chas.

[onerifle]

It is well known that 5" guns are more forgiving of "short" rounds than Commanders and it gets worse as the slide/barrel gets shorter.

Just an insomnia-induced thought ...since the Rangers are designed for ahem..."LEO"...ONLY my guess is that they may have been designed and tested in the 5" 1911's, for regular duty, not the Commander sized and smaller framed guns designed primarily for concealment...

Then again...I'm half asleep...so that's probably a groundless assumption...


:?

Let us know what happens!!!

[Paladin]

Paladin- do you know of a reliable supplier for Federal Tactical? I've been looking for some in .40 and 9mm to check out...

It was pretty hard to find. I talked to a number of suppliers. I ended up getting it off of gunbroker.com. Don't know for sure if they've got .40cal or 9mm.

[Baytown]

Wow Chas., I want a 1911 that shoots those RA45P's with and OAL of 2.213". :P

Do you have to get a special magazine for them?

Glenn