Share your way of converting the Antis: Arguing Methods

Stupid · Post by **Stupid** » Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:26 pm

What is your way?

1. I ask why do we allow criminals to be better equipped and better trained? They have guns, why don't we?

2. I forward this article to them
http://www.firearmsandliberty.com/kasle ... ction.html

3. I take them shooting where I show them gun safety.

4. I give them a copy of Hotel Rwanda and ask them to watch it and tell me again why we do not need guns.

That pretty much settles everything.

Lumberjack98 · Post by **Lumberjack98** » Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:33 pm

Good post and I'm interested to read others responses.

I can't get the link in #2 to open. Can you verify that it's correct?

stevie_d_64 · Post by **stevie_d_64** » Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:54 pm

An "anti" is someone who is already committed to their side of the issue...And not someone I care to waste time in converting...

I can ususally tell with a high degree of confidence who is an "anti" or one who is ignorant of the issue, adopts a "gasp, its a gun!" reaction to the topic...

The latter being someone that may or may not warm up to the discussion about the issue...

If its someone who displays an interest, yet does not know a lot about it, I certainly do not push them into thinking I know all there is to know either...

I show them a few websites...Mostly hardware websites, that cater to the physical side of the issue...

Show them a website to a range I know about...

Tell them that my wife is an avid shooter when she's not busy learning how to teach kids...That she was not into "it" before she met me, and she took an interest in it from a "couple" activity, and then got serious about the self-defensive aspect of firearms...And got licensed to carry in Texas and Utah, etc etc...

I never ask right away if they'd like to go shoot...But I let them know I go out every now and then to practice...

Eventually they start to mention things like they don't have too many things to do on a weekend coming up...At which point I may offer to meet them and see if they'd like to spend about 30 minutes at the range to get the feel for the activity...

Pretty soon they take off themselves and do a little research, and from then on its either they like it or not...Mostly they like it...

Then the "gunshow" bug bites...

And you pretty much have a convert then...

Stupid · Post by **Stupid** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:12 am

I guess my way is a little too confrontational. That link really opens some people's eyes. Most expect police to protect them, but the reality is we are paying for a service which comes with no warranty.

The movie Hotel Rwanda opened my eyes and also my own experience of Rita taught me a lot.

Hotel Rwanda tells us three things:

1. Guns don't kill people - a million were slaughtered in the course of a week or so with machets and blades, not guns.

2. Those who do not have guns are just sitting ducks - or what we say "meat on a cutting board".

3. America is a great country to live in, except for Cali., because we can have the best way to protect ourselves.

Ranger+P+ · Post by **Ranger+P+** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 1:05 am

Here is my Argument:

GUN OWNER??

VICTIM??

CHECK ONE THAT APPLIES

glocklvr · Post by **glocklvr** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 5:27 am

I use several tactics which have been fairly sucessful considering that my proudest "conversion" was a 3rd generation anti and is now a glock owner and CHL holder. It took 3 yrs but he is now very much 1 of us and will be for life.

1. patience- I have found that this is by far the best tool of them all

2. I point out the statistics of crime in areas with loose gun laws vs areas with gun control and they get most people's attention real quick.

3. I point out news events in which a law abiding citizen with a gun could have or did have have a positive impact on a bad situation.

4. I make it a point to make sure they see by my actions that I am always very safety oriented and responsible with my gun and not some gun slinging idiot asking for trouble. I also make it known that I will avoid confrontation when possible even if it means looking like a "wimp" to avoid the need to shoot.

5. I take them shooting and show them how much fun shooting can be when done legaly, responsibly and most importantly safely and stress those 3 key words

BTW stupid very good article I printed a copy to show to some of my friends both pro and anti.

jbirds1210 · Post by **jbirds1210** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 7:38 am

I just live my normal life......talk about guns, shooting, gun show, gun safety, or IDPA until they either learn to love it or get away from me because they are tired of listening to it.

Either way is fine with me......I am who I am. Win someone over with your personality and passion for Christ and your fellow man. This way they will see that guns can be a lot of fun and not something to fear.
Jason

seamusTX · Post by **seamusTX** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:13 am

"Stupid," all your ideas are good.

What I do:

I don't argue with people. I ask them questions. For example, when the "assault weapons ban" was up for renewal, I asked several people what they thought it banned. They all thought it banned machine guns.

I ask them what they would do if someone were breaking down their door. They always say they would call 911. I ask them if they know how long it takes the police to respond. If they say three minutes, I suggest we sit quietly for three minutes. (It's a long time when you do that.)

I ask why, if marijuana, heroin, and cocaine have been completely illegal for over 70 years, kids can still buy them everywhere. And if guns were illegal, why would the situation be any different?

If you ask enough questions, people may begin to see that their point of view is illogical.

Some people are fanatics and you will never change their minds. We just have to isolate them as much as possible.

- Jim

Wildscar · Post by **Wildscar** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 9:55 am

I was in an online game when the subject came up. Someone asked me where I was getting a new computer. I replied that I was currently debating between a new computer or getting in a new hobby that I always wanted to do which is shooting. Almost immediately I was catching flak for even bringing the gun subject up. It went on for about 5 mins and all kind of argument came about. I finally told them all.

"Would you rather have one and not need then need one and not have it."

That line seemed to smack them square in the head and none of them could come up wit an argument then. This was my first encounter with antis. And the weird part is I have know them for about 5 years now and never thought that it would be a big to do to bring it up around them. Guess you never know where one will be.

Edited for spelling. One day Ill rember to do that before I submit the post.

Will938 · Post by **Will938** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 11:33 am

All the standard arguments for people who are mild anti's.

The rabid ones get the treatment, make them look like awful people who have the same mindset that got people burned at the stake.

Foreigners, their main argument is that "the police are there to handle it, so owning firearms are foolish". And a great comeback "Who is going to make contact with the criminal first, the victim or the officer?"

I take anyone even remotely interested to the range, maybe 2 or 3 people a month. And I'm trying to get a big group together in may. I always teach safety first and correct people of course, but I keep it fun and entertaining. Like jumping from platform to platform, caliber to caliber, paper target to coke can to fruit. Its all new to them and if you can keep them from getting bored they might take an interest and join the cause.

HankB · Post by **HankB** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:26 pm

I forget exactly how the topic came up, but the most extreme "anti" I ran into was a woman I encountered at a party who felt that there was NEVER a reason to shoot someone.

NEVER.

So I asked her what she'd do if some big guy were threatening her.

Nope. Never. She wouldn't shoot him. Even the bad guy's life is precious.

Then I asked if she'd shoot a man threatening her child.

Nope. Never. She wouldn't shoot him. Even the bad guy's life is precious.

So I told her to seek psychological help, as she seemed to place a very low value on her own life . . . and the fact that she admitted that she in effect valued the bad guy's life more than that of her own child suggested she'd failed to form any sort of mother-child bond with the kid, which was distinctly unhealthy. Heck, even I, someone she'd never met before, would do more to protect her own child than she would!

I then continued on and told her that if she has a shred of honesty, she's already informed the rest of her family of the low regard she had for them, and that basic decency demanded that she inform them that they wouldn't be able to trust her in a crisis.

I doubt I convinced her, but afterwards, a couple of the ladies who'd heard me said I'd given them something to think about . . . and that there's NO WAY they'd EVER let someone harm one of THEIR children.

seamusTX · Post by **seamusTX** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:55 pm

Someone like that is nuts, but very few people are like that.

Most of the people that we call antis (not including elected officials or people who run anti organizations) are just misinformed, ignorant, or have fears that can be reasoned with.

- Jim

sparx · Post by **sparx** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:56 pm

seamusTX wrote:I ask why, if marijuana, heroin, and cocaine have been completely illegal for over 70 years, kids can still buy them everywhere. And if guns were illegal, why would the situation be any different?

That's good, and I had never thought to use a reference like that before. I've always asked why they think a criminal would obey the law and NOT have one, when they're perfectly willing to break other laws, but that would make the concept of "only criminals would have guns" even more clear.

seamusTX · Post by **seamusTX** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 1:00 pm

sparx wrote:That's good, and I had never thought to use a reference like that before.

Thanks. Be careful, though. I've been flamed for comparing firearms (which we have a right to keep and bear) to illegal drugs.

My point is that criminal organizations can import things like drugs by the ton, and if there is a criminal demand for weapons, they'll import them.

You can also add that countries which have banned nearly all private ownership of firearms, like the U.K. and Australia, have increasing violent crime for just this reason: criminals import what they can't buy or steal locally.

- Jim

srothstein · Post by **srothstein** » Thu Mar 01, 2007 8:42 pm

I don't usually try to convert the anti's, but I will use facts in any reasonable debate with one. Most of the time, this does nothing to convince the anti, but may help with a fence sitter who is listening/watching.

For the other fence sitters, I will usually invite them to go shooting with me and make sure I take the kids with. I find that a lot of them are shocked at first to see the kids shooting, but when they see they are having fun and learning the rules of safety, it helps to loosen them up. Then a few lessons for them and let them try it. I find very few fence sitters on the issue stay that way after actually pulling the trigger a few times.