Embarassed to call myself a Republican-leaning Independent

[flintknapper]

While I doubt the Senator has a degree in computer sciences...I wouldn't be so quick to label him a bumpkin. Yes, his "analogy" was something less than stellar, but I feel certain he is not "clueless" in regards to the internet.

I think you have chosen to read what he said in a literal sense. While some of us "old guys" didn't actually build our own computers, we do understand that internet information does not travel down "PVC pipe", and the Senator is no exception.

Further, if you have any real concerns about the Senator's understandings (or lack of), then... a polite letter written with respect, and containing helpful information would be more appropriate IMO.




About Senator Ted Stevens


A member of the Senate for 37 years, Ted Stevens is Alaska's senior Senator. Stevens' tenure in the Senate makes him the fourth-most senior member among his colleagues, and first among Republicans. Stevens holds the position of Senate President Pro Tempore. He also is the Chairman of the Senate Committee on Commerce, Science, and Transportation, which has oversight of the Departments of Commerce and Transportation. In addition, the Committee's broad jurisdiction covers issues including telecommunications, fisheries, oceans and maritime policy, the Coast Guard, aviation (including the Transportation Security Administration), rail, highway safety, global climate change, interstate commerce, space, science, technology, economic development, trade, tourism, consumer issues, product safety, and sports.

As President Pro Tempore, Stevens presides over the Senate in the absence of the Vice President and is third in the line of succession for the Presidency, following the Vice President and the Speaker of the House. In addition, the President Pro Tempore is a member of the party leadership team.

Senator Stevens has previously chaired the Senate's Ethics, Rules, and Governmental Affairs Committees. From 1997 through 2004, Stevens held the position of Chairman of the Senate Appropriations Committee (except for an 18 month period when he was the Ranking Member). Senator Stevens is a long-time leader in national defense oversight. As Chairman of the Defense Appropriations Subcommittee, working with the Senior Senator from Hawaii, Senator Dan Inouye, he has kept track of defense requirements to ensure our security. Stevens has continually worked for smarter, more efficient programs that can better meet the twenty-first century's realities and future threats to our nation.

Ted Stevens was born in Indianapolis, Indiana, on November 18, 1923. During World War II he was a pilot in the China-Burma-India theater, supporting the Flying Tigers of the 14th Air Force. He received two Distinguished Flying Crosses, two Air Medals, and the Yuan Hai medal awarded by the Republic of China. Following the war he graduated from UCLA and Harvard Law School, and practiced law in Washington, D.C. In the early 1950s he moved to Alaska, at the time a territory of the U.S. He practiced law in Fairbanks, and subsequently was appointed U.S. Attorney in Fairbanks in 1953, a position he held for three years.

He transferred to Washington, D.C. in 1956 to work as legislative counsel and then as an assistant to Secretary of the Interior Fred Seaton. In 1960, he was appointed Solicitor (chief counsel) of the Department of the Interior by President Eisenhower. While in Washington, Stevens worked successfully for Alaska's and Hawaii's admissions to the Union.

Stevens returned to Alaska to practice law in Anchorage and in 1964 he was elected to the Alaska House of Representatives. In his second term in Alaska's legislature he became the House Majority Leader.

Following the death of Senator E.L. Bob Bartlett in December of 1968, Governor Walter Hickel appointed Stevens to fill the vacancy. Under Alaska law, Stevens sought election in 1970. Stevens was subsequently elected for a full term in 1972, and re-elected in 1978, 1984, 1990, 1996 and 2002.

From 1977 to 1985 Stevens served as the Assistant Republican Leader (the Whip). In 1994, Stevens became Chairman of the Senate Rules Committee. He next served as Chairman of the Senate Governmental Affairs Committee in 1996. Stevens also has served as Chairman of the Senate Ethics Committee, and the Arms Control Observer Group.

In addition to his duties on the Senate Commerce Committee and Defense Appropriations Subcommittee, Stevens serves on the Appropriations Subcommittees on Commerce, Justice, State and Judiciary; Interior; Labor, Health, Human Services and Education; and Legislative Branch. He also is a member of the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs, the Senate Committee on Rules and Administration, and is Chairman of the Joint Committee on the Library of Congress.

Known as a "Work Horse" of the Senate, Stevens tries to find time for his hobbies: tennis, reading, and his favorite pastime - reeling in his catch while fishing. The 71-pound Kenai Peninsula King Salmon he caught is displayed in his Washington, D.C. office.

When tough issues arise in the Senate, Ted's motto has always been, "Do what's best for Alaska." And he has. Virtually every Senator is aware that Alaska is one-fifth the size of the entire United States and has half of the country's coastline, thanks to Stevens' reminders on the Senate floor and elsewhere.

Senator Stevens is married to Catherine Ann Chandler of Anchorage, a fourth generation Alaskan. They have one child and eleven grandchildren. He also has five other children by his first wife Ann Cherrington of Denver, now deceased. Three of Stevens' six children currently reside in Alaska.



But, all of this has nothing to do with the fact that I need to order a fiber-optic front sight for the SP-101 today. (gun related content).

[jimlongley]

I wonder if Stevens took one of my Data Communications Basics courses about thirteen years ago. In that course I likened the internet to pipes, but the analogy pretty much stopped there. One of the reasons I used that example was to describe how packets of information are carried disceretely through the pipe, rather than mixed together like, say, water.

[nitrogen]

As a network engineer, the pipes analogy is actually a pretty good one, only it's poorly used and misappropriated here.

Network lines are like pipes, insomuch that they can "back up" like water or sewer pipes if they have too much stuff on them.

What he fails to understand is that, unlike plumbing, your traffic has multiple ways to get to it's destination. In fact, to continue on the silly analogy, if Mr. Steven's "Internet" (I assume he meant e-mail) "pipe" was clogged, the network would find a better route to deliver his "internet".

if it couldn't, it'd just wait until it could.

His little story could actually be modified slightly to explain why net neutrality is a good idea. Imagine if the company that sold him his "internet" decided not to pay AT&T's bribes. Senator Stevens could wait quite a bit for his "internet" to get to him, even if the "pipes" are empty...

[KBCraig]

This is Sen. "Bridge To Nowhere" Stevens.

A ranting, self-puffed buffoon.

[cyphur]

As a network engineer, the pipes analogy is actually a pretty good one, only it's poorly used and misappropriated here.

Network lines are like pipes, insomuch that they can "back up" like water or sewer pipes if they have too much stuff on them.

What he fails to understand is that, unlike plumbing, your traffic has multiple ways to get to it's destination. In fact, to continue on the silly analogy, if Mr. Steven's "Internet" (I assume he meant e-mail) "pipe" was clogged, the network would find a better route to deliver his "internet".

if it couldn't, it'd just wait until it could.

His little story could actually be modified slightly to explain why net neutrality is a good idea. Imagine if the company that sold him his "internet" decided not to pay AT&T's bribes. Senator Stevens could wait quite a bit for his "internet" to get to him, even if the "pipes" are empty...

+1 here. NetAdmin myself.


That Senator represents the majority of what is wrong with our Legislative Branch. Full of stupid, oblivious shmucks who care only about "getting theirs" and furthering their careers. I'm suprised George Washington and crew haven't risen to the grave and done something about it. Its absolutely pathetic.

[nitrogen]

A little bit of history, for those interested, as to why AT&T, and other network providers feel they can do this, and why they feel it's a good idea:

Back in the olden days of telephone service, only one company, Bell, had any infrastructure. Being a monopoly, they could charge whatever they wanted.

After Divestiture, in 1984, The individual bell operating companies were broken up, and maintained the local infrastructure. Bell, now AT&T, owned the national infrastructure.

How AT&T made money after Divestiture was this:

AT&T would like, say, a call from California (Pacific Bell) territory to New Jersey. (Bell Atlantic territory)

AT&T was acting, in indusrry terms, as an Interexchange carrier. They carry traffic between LATA's (phone networks, basically). They would then charge Pacific Bell for all the traffic that flowed across their interexchange network.

AT&T, and other carriers would like to return to this model. Unfortunately, if this were to happen, it would kill the openness that is today's Internet.

[lrb111]

Good description Nitro. Bell has had a huge resentment over supporting the infrastructure, and then being required to sell line usage and time on their lines.

It's just been in the last 5 years, with the advent of fiber optics and willing entities other than the Bells that we now have lines to upload/satellite isp centers in Dallas from West Texas.
The ISP that I work for uses about 20Mb of the bandwidth, and that's so small that they don't even consider that chump change.

[flintknapper]

This is Sen. "Bridge To Nowhere" Stevens.

A ranting, self-puffed buffoon.

And from the "Washington Post" no less. Hmmmm, imagine that.




Still haven't ordered my sights yet. (gun content).

[jimlongley]

Back in the olden days of telephone service, only one company, Bell, had any infrastructure. Being a monopoly, they could charge whatever they wanted.

When I started as a phone man, in 1966, there were 84 telephone companies in NY State alone, and only one of them was "Bell." Most, but not all, phone companies acted as monopolies (albeit heavily regulated "franchises") only after passage of the Communications Act of 1934, before that competition was usual and cutthroat.

I can remember maintaining telephones in people's houses, in way upstate NY, where they had two telephone lines, one for the Bell company and the other for the independant, because it was cheaper than making toll calls between the two.

My grandfather used to tell tales of living in communities where he had to have two or three phone lines to keep in touch with his workers because there were several competing companies and they didn't always interconnect.

My father worked as a lineman in Auburn, NY in the late 20s and early 30s when there were two competing telephone companies there, and the workers would sabotage each other's wires, cables, poles, vehicles, etc. He told tales of two brothers, who worked for the competing companies, who would conspire to creat overtime for each other when their budgets were tight.

During the depression "Ma Bell" never laid off or furloughed one worker. They worked short hours and did drudge work, but they still worked.

AT&T only owned a percentage of the interexchange network even before the 1984 debacle, MCI, GT&E, Eastern Message, and numerous other companies had plenty of bandwidth for themselves, the big problem that they were always whining about was the "Ma Bell" wouldn't allow them to interconnect or to provide local services in "Ma Bell" territories. The 1984 shame changed that.

I could go on; been there, done that, get the retirement check, but for brevity's sake let's just say I think divestiture was a bad thing.

[nitrogen]

Back in the olden days of telephone service, only one company, Bell, had any infrastructure. Being a monopoly, they could charge whatever they wanted.

When I started as a phone man, in 1966, there were 84 telephone companies in NY State alone, and only one of them was "Bell."

Wow. Learn something new every day.
I was 8 when divesteture hit, so what would I know, other than what I read in books.

As far as it being a bad thing, I think it's mixed. It's definately been HE Double Hockey Sticks on the infrastructure. It's been so nickled and dimed in some areas, I expect to see quite a failure somewhere within the next 10 years.
Sure, long distance is dirt cheap, but we're going to "pay" for it.

Having said that, having the market forced open is what made the internet what it is today. If it wasn't for the market the way it is today, sites like this one couldn't afford to exist.

[flintknapper]

I understand that taking what he said literally would be pretty silly, and I wasn't. I was more ripping on how he chose to portray it than anything else.

It just disgusts me that they legislate on issues that affect the future of America so much, yet don't take the time to actually sit down and research these issues so they understand it.

Welcome to politics Sir, it "reeks" on both sides.

[KBCraig]

This is Sen. "Bridge To Nowhere" Stevens.

A ranting, self-puffed buffoon.

And from the "Washington Post" no less. Hmmmm, imagine that.

If you're concerned with partisan bias, consider that Stevens' rant was directed at a fellow Republican, Sen. Tom Coburn of Oklahoma, who proposed redirecting Alaska's pork-barrel bridge money, towards rebuilding the I-10 bridge across Lake Pontchartrain in the immediate aftermath of Hurricane Katrina.

Coburn has a short but proven record as a fiscal conservative. Stevens has proved himself a whore.

Still haven't ordered my sights yet. (gun content).

Got a .38 in my pocket.

Kevin

[KBCraig]

A little bit of history, for those interested, as to why AT&T, and other network providers feel they can do this, and why they feel it's a good idea:

Back in the olden days of telephone service, only one company, Bell, had any infrastructure. Being a monopoly, they could charge whatever they wanted.

It's important to note that any monopoly status Ma Bell ever had, was one that was dictated by the government. Jim Langley posted about the variety of phone services available when be began working as a phone guy. People found free market solutions: they had two or more phone lines from different companies, because that was cheaper than calling between services. Voila, the free market works!

The government response was to "simplify" things by requiring a single carrier. Which wound up costing consumers more, but no one was "forced" to subscribe to multiple services.

In a free market economy, only the government has the ability to create a monopoly. The same Department of Justice that prosecuted Microsoft as a monopoly, also mandates that only Microsoft operating systems may be used on DOJ computers, and only Microsoft Internet Explorer can be used as a browser on DOJ networks (even for access to the internet).

It's funny, but MS have never forced me to use their OS or browser. (And I don't; I use Firefox on MacOS X. I'm 100% MS-free at home.) The only time I use Windows or MSIE is when I'm forced to, at work... working for the same Justice Department that prosecuted Microsoft for being a monopoly.

"Overwhelming market dominance" is not the same as "monopoly". The threat of competition is as real as actual competition, and keeps market prices low. Actual monopoly can only exist where force exists.

As an example, I have no options for local telco service, nor cable service, nor electricity, nor water, nor sewer, nor trash collection. All those things are monopolized by my local government. Western Waste doesn't have a monopoly because they're big, bad, and evil; they have a monopoly because my city government says so. There are other waste services in the area, but it's illegal for them to even place a dumpster on my property (for my re-roofing project, for example), much less provide weekly trash pickup.

Likewise for telephone service, TV cable, electricity, and natural gas: my local government dictates monopolies, and that only certain "franchised" companies may provide those services.

That's not freedom.

Kevin