Do I have to disclose to LEOs?

[MikeStone]

I was in a situation this weekend where a law enforcement officer responded to a domestic disturbance call. I was more a by-stander than anything, but I could not leave the situation. Under those circumstances, should I/must I disclose to the LEO that I have a CHL and am currently carrying?

(I know the basic rule is to avoid those situations. However, a friend was involved and I couldn't physically leave, in fact I made the call for LEO to de-escalate the situation...)

[seamusTX]

In general, you are not legally obligated to say one word to a LEO except in response to a direct question or command.

There are a very few exceptions such as reporting a felony or child abuse.

Why do I think announcing spontaneously that you have a weapon might not work out all that well?

- Jim

[Scott in Houston]

I know when I was new with this, I had this same kind of issue in my head. Ultimately, it was that discomfort of being armed around a cop for the first time ever which made me feel like I needed to "confess".

It's pure emotion. There's no logic at all to telling any officer unless directly asked.

[MikeStone]

Right you are! Emotion and adrenaline...I've only been carrying for a few weeks. Thanks for the advice.

[RPB]

Actually a news story this last weekend; Couple decided on separation temporarily; dispute over property, she dials 911; everyone calms down so guy starts moving his stuff out, police arrive, he shows them he's carrying a gun, now she's a widow instead of separated and says it was a misunderstanding.

If asked for ID by a peace officer, I produce my CHL also; if I'm driving I'll also hand over proof of insurance.

[recaffeination]

There's a requirement to display your CHL when the peace officer asks for your ID and youre not allowed to lie buttheres no requirement to volunteer information about being armed.

[Purplehood]

I was in a situation this weekend where a law enforcement officer responded to a domestic disturbance call. I was more a by-stander than anything, but I could not leave the situation. Under those circumstances, should I/must I disclose to the LEO that I have a CHL and am currently carrying?

(I know the basic rule is to avoid those situations. However, a friend was involved and I couldn't physically leave, in fact I made the call for LEO to de-escalate the situation...)

To be specific:

- If you are carrying, and, if asked for ID by a LEO...Yes.

[seamusTX]

I think maybe twice I've been asked for ID and showed both cards. It was NBD. These were not traffic stops. One was reporting a burglary and the other was a false alarm at my house.

Anything like saying, "I have a gun," or showing it to them is just nuts.

BTW, a couple of weeks ago I heard a radio interview with a retired detective who was a technical adviser to some CSI-type TV show. He said in his experience that half the time they could get a suspect to talk himself into handcuffs without asking any questions that would invoke Miranda.

People just seem to have an urge to talk themselves into trouble.

- Jim

[JALLEN]

The laws here in CA are different of course, and CHL holders are even more rare than Republicans.

Some years ago, a house I was responsible for was burglarized, some vehicles stolen etc. The house was unoccupied but fully furnished, and it was discovered when the police arrested the perps joy riding in the stolen car. As trustee of the trust which owns the property, I had to go up and meet the investigating officer from SDPD. The house had been moderately ransacked and we would have to climb over and around some furniture, etc.

Since I could not anticipate what this fellow might do if he saw that I was carrying (I use a IWB holster under a knit golf shirt), when he arrived and I introduced myself, I told him I was a CHL holder and was carrying. He looked surprised at first but indicated he appreciated me mentioning it. I think 1) it had never crossed his mind, and 2) I was the first one he had ever run into. There are only about 1800 or so of us in San Diego, a county of ~3,000,000 or so. There were no others around to freak out, also.

[bkj]

I think maybe twice I've been asked for ID and showed both cards. It was NBD. These were not traffic stops. One was reporting a burglary and the other was a false alarm at my house.

Anything like saying, "I have a gun," or showing it to them is just nuts.

BTW, a couple of weeks ago I heard a radio interview with a retired detective who was a technical adviser to some CSI-type TV show. He said in his experience that half the time they could get a suspect to talk himself into handcuffs without asking any questions that would invoke Miranda.

People just seem to have an urge to talk themselves into trouble.

- Jim

I always tell my students to tell the officer they have a CHL never, never, never say "I have a GUN"

[seamusTX]

Mr. Allen,

You never know how a particular individual police officer will deal with the situation.

Probably the vast majority understand that a CHL holder has passed background checks, obtained training, etc., and is not going to present a problem.

But every now and then on this forum we hear about an officer disarming a person with a CHL and treating him like a criminal suspect. Of course, in those cases we don't know the cop's side of the story.

- Jim

[WildBill]

Mr. Allen,

You never know how a particular individual police officer will deal with the situation.

Probably the vast majority understand that a CHL holder has passed background checks, obtained training, etc., and is not going to present a problem.

But every now and then on this forum we hear about an officer disarming a person with a CHL and treating him like a criminal suspect. Of course, in those cases we don't know the cop's side of the story.

- Jim

As a former resident of California I can appreciate JALLEN's experience. In urban California, the encounter between an LEO and a lawful CCW holder is extremely rare. The average San Diego LEO has probably arrested more penguins for speeding than he has encountered citizens with a concealed weapon permit.

[JALLEN]

Mr. Allen,

You never know how a particular individual police officer will deal with the situation.

Probably the vast majority understand that a CHL holder has passed background checks, obtained training, etc., and is not going to present a problem.

But every now and then on this forum we hear about an officer disarming a person with a CHL and treating him like a criminal suspect. Of course, in those cases we don't know the cop's side of the story.

- Jim

In this case, I was presumably on the side of the law, assisting in the investigation of a auto theft and residential burglary, and, being an inordinately placid and jovial, mature citizen in good standing, there was no need or cause for the LEO to be nervous. OTOH, like WildBill said in his post, and I indicated, CHL holders are like dinosaurs around here, you hardly ever see one these days. What I did not want is to be climbing around inside the house and have this fellow, who I didn't know either, glimpse an outline etc, and get jumpy on me with unpredictable reactions.

It all worked out OK and I was satisfied I had done it.

[ELB]

The Statute:
Government Code, Sec. 411.205. REQUIREMENT TO DISPLAY LICENSE. If a license holder is carrying a handgun on or about the license holder's person when a magistrate or a peace officer demands that the license holder display identification, the license holder shall display both the license holder's driver's license or identification certificate issued by the department and the license holder's handgun license.

My interpretation (IANAL and all that): if carrying a handgun and if asked for ID, then the law says you are supposed to show the CHL+DL (or state ID); note it does not say you have to verbalize it, just "display" it. In a tense situation, I think "display license" is a superior form of communication, versus any form of verbalization where one might blurt out "gun" in any form.

Recall that the legal penalty for failing to display a CHL was removed legislative session before last (I think it was two sessions ago). That's not to say that the peace officer will be happy if he finds out you didn't display a CHL when asked for ID, despite the lack of "legal" penalty.

Given the tenseness of the situation in the OP, I think "display" is better then "tell," and then ONLY if directly asked for ID. The officer(s) have enough to figure out in a domestic situattion, no need to clutter his mind with info he did not ask for.

[Jim88]

To be specific:

- If you are carrying, and, if asked for ID by a LEO...Yes.

You aren't obligated but it's also a good idea even if you aren't carrying. If the LEO calls your DL in, he's going to find out you have a CHL. If you haven't already presented your CHL at this point, he's going to wonder why you didn't show it to him.