OC Carry question

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b322da
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by b322da »

JALLEN wrote:...No misunderstanding, I don't think. Maybe a bit of semantics. The AG issues an opinion. The Courts issue opinions in deciding cases. What's the diff?....
What's the diff? One might say that the diff is that while an appellate judge issues his opinion in deciding a case, unwritten at the end of that opinion is, "and my opinion is correct [unless, that is, I should be reversed by a superior court], therefore this is my decision." ;-)

I do not think you and I have any misunderstanding, JALLEN, nor do we disagree on anything of any substance. I have tried to avoid getting into a discussion of civil/criminal procedure, which has again proved to confuse a discussion rather than clarify it. Lawyers are good at doing that. :smile:

Jim
Last edited by b322da on Mon Aug 10, 2015 4:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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JALLEN
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by JALLEN »

b322da wrote:
JALLEN wrote:...No misunderstanding, I don't think. Maybe a bit of semantics. The AG issues an opinion. The Courts issue opinions in deciding cases. What's the diff?....
What's the diff? One might say that the diff is that while a judge issues his opinion in deciding a case, unwritten at the end of that opinion is, "and my opinion is correct [unless, that is, I should be reversed by a superior court], therefore this is my decision." ;-)

I do not think you and I have any misunderstanding, JALLEN, nor do we disagree on anything of any substance. I have tried to avoid getting into a discussion of civil/criminal procedure, which has again proved to confuse a discussion rather than clarify it. Lawyers are good at doing that. :smile:

Jim
I have no idea what your first paragraph means.

In trial courts, judges do not write opinions, usually. Federal District Court judges sometimes do. A jury finds facts, and reaches a verdict based on instructions from the judge, which in every case I've been involved in were proposed by the lawyers, argued over and accepted by the judge. In judge trial, there is often a Findings of Fact and Conclusions of Law" or similarly titled document which forms the basis of the judgment.

We've not delved into criminal procedure as such, merely the characterization of judge's rulings compared to AG opinions, and the structure of the courts system.
Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.
b322da
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by b322da »

JALLEN wrote:
b322da wrote:
JALLEN wrote:...No misunderstanding, I don't think. Maybe a bit of semantics. The AG issues an opinion. The Courts issue opinions in deciding cases. What's the diff?....
What's the diff? One might say that the diff is that while a judge issues his opinion in deciding a case, unwritten at the end of that opinion is, "and my opinion is correct [unless, that is, I should be reversed by a superior court], therefore this is my decision." ;-)

I do not think you and I have any misunderstanding, JALLEN, nor do we disagree on anything of any substance. I have tried to avoid getting into a discussion of civil/criminal procedure, which has again proved to confuse a discussion rather than clarify it. Lawyers are good at doing that. :smile:

Jim
I have no idea what your first paragraph means.

In trial courts, judges do not write opinions, usually. Federal District Court judges sometimes do. A jury finds facts, and reaches a verdict based on instructions from the judge, which in every case I've been involved in were proposed by the lawyers, argued over and accepted by the judge. In judge trial, there is often a Findings of Fact and Conclusions of Law" or similarly titled document which forms the basis of the judgment.

We've not delved into criminal procedure as such, merely the characterization of judge's rulings compared to AG opinions, and the structure of the courts system.
I obviously should have said "an appellate judge" in my first paragraph rather than "a judge." I will edit it to correct my gross error. I guess I must have thought it would be apparent.

I will try again to agree with you -- where you say that trial court judges usually do not write opinions. Of course, as you recognize, they sometimes do. As a trial court judge in a bench criminal trial, for example, I did on at least one occasion write what could be called an opinion, to "educate," if you will, both the appellate court and the public a bit on my thinking, as an appeal in this case was guaranteed due to the sentence. I must admit that I have been criticized for that (but not by the appellate court), and accused of undertaking the burden of counsel.

After later being privileged to be an appellate judge you might think I would be capable of writing in a manner understandable, but again I have here demonstrated otherwise. :oops: The only excuse I can offer is "another senior moment." I just celebrated (??) my 80th birthday.

Do I understand that you have returned to Texas?

Jim
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WildBill
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by WildBill »

C-dub wrote:We all have outliers that pop up every now and then. :biggrinjester:
Indeed we do. :thumbs2:
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JALLEN
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by JALLEN »

b322da wrote: I obviously should have said "an appellate judge" in my first paragraph rather than "a judge." I will edit it to correct my gross error. I guess I must have thought it would be apparent.

I will try again to agree with you -- where you say that trial court judges usually do not write opinions. Of course, as you recognize, they sometimes do. As a trial court judge in a bench criminal trial, for example, I did on at least one occasion write what could be called an opinion, to "educate," if you will, both the appellate court and the public a bit on my thinking, as an appeal in this case was guaranteed due to the sentence. I must admit that I have been criticized for that (but not by the appellate court), and accused of undertaking the burden of counsel.

After later being privileged to be an appellate judge you might think I would be capable of writing in a manner understandable, but again I have here demonstrated otherwise. :oops: The only excuse I can offer is "another senior moment." I just celebrated (??) my 80th birthday.

Do I understand that you have returned to Texas?

Jim
Congratulations on reaching 80! I will be 70 in a few months myself.

I have returned to Texas, about 2 years ago, after 45 years in San Diego, where I was sent as a brand new Navy officer right out of UT, in the middle of the VN war. I retired here after being diagnosed with pulmonary fibrosis about 4.5 years ago, to get close to a lung transplant center, and into a single story house with all electric, no pilot lights or open flame to accommodate my supplemental O2.

I'm glad you chimed in here. It certainly had me thinking, never a bad thing. I wondered if, like Aunt Gracie sometimes said, maybe I had misunderstood what you read. We were closer to the same page than I imagined.

Not everyone can be a judge. It takes a certain type of person to do it full time, enjoy it and look forward to getting down to the courtroom every morning. I served as a pro tem judge for some time, a couple of days a month, and as an arbitrator, and decided it wasn't for me. The best judges I appeared before were happy, enthusiastic and eager to get it right. When I think of what they had to endure, the often absurd and idiotic antics, I marvel at how they did it.
Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.
b322da
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by b322da »

JALLEN wrote:Congratulations on reaching 80! I will be 70 in a few months myself.

I have returned to Texas, about 2 years ago, after 45 years in San Diego, where I was sent as a brand new Navy officer right out of UT, in the middle of the VN war. I retired here after being diagnosed with pulmonary fibrosis about 4.5 years ago, to get close to a lung transplant center, and into a single story house with all electric, no pilot lights or open flame to accommodate my supplemental O2.

I'm glad you chimed in here. It certainly had me thinking, never a bad thing. I wondered if, like Aunt Gracie sometimes said, maybe I had misunderstood what you read. We were closer to the same page than I imagined.

Not everyone can be a judge. It takes a certain type of person to do it full time, enjoy it and look forward to getting down to the courtroom every morning. I served as a pro tem judge for some time, a couple of days a month, and as an arbitrator, and decided it wasn't for me. The best judges I appeared before were happy, enthusiastic and eager to get it right. When I think of what they had to endure, the often absurd and idiotic antics, I marvel at how they did it.
Bless you sir, and may you have many long years. You have come to the right place if you are not too far from Houston.

I must assume that you, given your demonstrated knowledge and background, have consulted an attorney both experienced and competent in handling asbestosis/mesothelioma/pulmonary fibrosis lawsuits from the plaintiffs' side. Your ailment encourages me to stop complaining about my diabetic neuropathy and the possibility of the onset of dementia, as I am quite familiar with your ill. For many years I practiced the defense of toxic tort litigation, this being a good area for contracting ailments like yours, as well as for seeking treatment after they are contracted, given the harm many have suffered or have been alleged to have suffered, due, primarily, to the presence of our petroleum industry and others. Similarly, steel mills and such have dragged me off to elsewhere in Texas and to many other states.

Thank you for challenging the old man here. I retired more than 15 years ago, after deciding that I was tired of the lawyer's word games, but, to my surprise, I have enjoyed being challenged again. My doctor says that serious thinking is one of the best ways to control or avoid dementia.

Best regards,

Jim
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JALLEN
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by JALLEN »

b322da wrote:
JALLEN wrote:Congratulations on reaching 80! I will be 70 in a few months myself.

I have returned to Texas, about 2 years ago, after 45 years in San Diego, where I was sent as a brand new Navy officer right out of UT, in the middle of the VN war. I retired here after being diagnosed with pulmonary fibrosis about 4.5 years ago, to get close to a lung transplant center, and into a single story house with all electric, no pilot lights or open flame to accommodate my supplemental O2.

I'm glad you chimed in here. It certainly had me thinking, never a bad thing. I wondered if, like Aunt Gracie sometimes said, maybe I had misunderstood what you read. We were closer to the same page than I imagined.

Not everyone can be a judge. It takes a certain type of person to do it full time, enjoy it and look forward to getting down to the courtroom every morning. I served as a pro tem judge for some time, a couple of days a month, and as an arbitrator, and decided it wasn't for me. The best judges I appeared before were happy, enthusiastic and eager to get it right. When I think of what they had to endure, the often absurd and idiotic antics, I marvel at how they did it.
Bless you sir, and may you have many long years. You have come to the right place if you are not too far from Houston.

I must assume that you, given your demonstrated knowledge and background, have consulted an attorney both experienced and competent in handling asbestosis/mesothelioma/pulmonary fibrosis lawsuits from the plaintiffs' side. Your ailment encourages me to stop complaining about my diabetic neuropathy and the possibility of the onset of dementia, as I am quite familiar with your ill. For many years I practiced the defense of toxic tort litigation, this being a good area for contracting ailments like yours, as well as for seeking treatment after they are contracted, given the harm many have suffered or have been alleged to have suffered, due, primarily, to the presence of our petroleum industry and others. Similarly, steel mills and such have dragged me off to elsewhere in Texas and to many other states.

Thank you for challenging the old man here. I retired more than 15 years ago, after deciding that I was tired of the lawyer's word games, but, to my surprise, I have enjoyed being challenged again. My doctor says that serious thinking is one of the best ways to control or avoid dementia.

Best regards,

Jim
Pulmonary fibrosis is idiopathic, or at least mine is said to be. That's doctor speak for "we have no idea what causes it."

It would be fascinating to know the actual cause. I do have some involvement with petrochemical substances. I was born in Houston. That right there was dangerous, surrounded by the stench of refineries back then. My dad was a dry cleaner, and I worked in the plant, up to my elbows in dry cleaning fluids, and surrounded by steam pipes insulated with asbestos, and my dad's "chemistry set." Later, my wife and I set about building a Rutan design airplane, and after a few years became allergic to the resins used in the fiberglassing process.

They suspect it may be hereditary. An aunt died of it, as did my youngest sister. My other siblings have no symptoms. As you know, there is no cure, and no treatment, although there is a newly approved drug which shows some promise to slow development. You get worse, either quickly, or slowly, until you die. I'm not worrying about what tie to wear to my granddaughters' weddings. While at U.T., I came to know a little, and admire greatly, Governor John Connally. We corresponded sporadically for years, and I had a very pleasant visit with the Connallys when he briefly ran for
President in 1980 and was in La Jolla for a fund raiser. I had often thought what a fine thing it would be to grow up to be like John Connally, and now at least in this small respect I am. He died of IPF, and do will I.

I practiced real estate law, and managed investments, and have never been involved or interested in medical malpractice, or toxic torts, or any torts really except arising out of real estate ownership and transactions, boundary disputes, easements, usual and customary swindling, etc.
Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.
Aggie_engr
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by Aggie_engr »

Do I understand this correctly, in that the mere location of an openly visible firearm placed not more than 3 feet from your person has generated 4 pages of discussions? Geez what is wrong with the world today. I'm just taking a step back and looking at this rationally, not taking sides or agreeing/disagreeing with anyone, but when one thinks about it this whole debate is just silly. I've always had the same rational approach to openly carrying, the mere presence of a piece of cloth or lack thereof determined if you were a criminal or not. And we say humans have evolved. :roll:

Not faulting anyone either for discussing the topic as it can have major implications for some, I just can't believe this is a topic which in today's world needs discussing, or AG opinion, or DPS clarification, or Supreme Court ruling.
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ScottDLS
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by ScottDLS »

Aggie_engr wrote:Do I understand this correctly, in that the mere location of an openly visible firearm placed not more than 3 feet from your person has generated 4 pages of discussions? Geez what is wrong with the world today. I'm just taking a step back and looking at this rationally, not taking sides or agreeing/disagreeing with anyone, but when one thinks about it this whole debate is just silly. I've always had the same rational approach to openly carrying, the mere presence of a piece of cloth or lack thereof determined if you were a criminal or not. And we say humans have evolved. :roll:

Not faulting anyone either for discussing the topic as it can have major implications for some, I just can't believe this is a topic which in today's world needs discussing, or AG opinion, or DPS clarification, or Supreme Court ruling.
Which is better M-16/M-4 or AK-47???? Bwahhhhhahhhhhahhhh!! :reddevil "rlol" "rlol"
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"
Taypo
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by Taypo »

ScottDLS wrote:
Aggie_engr wrote:Do I understand this correctly, in that the mere location of an openly visible firearm placed not more than 3 feet from your person has generated 4 pages of discussions? Geez what is wrong with the world today. I'm just taking a step back and looking at this rationally, not taking sides or agreeing/disagreeing with anyone, but when one thinks about it this whole debate is just silly. I've always had the same rational approach to openly carrying, the mere presence of a piece of cloth or lack thereof determined if you were a criminal or not. And we say humans have evolved. :roll:

Not faulting anyone either for discussing the topic as it can have major implications for some, I just can't believe this is a topic which in today's world needs discussing, or AG opinion, or DPS clarification, or Supreme Court ruling.
Which is better M-16/M-4 or AK-47???? Bwahhhhhahhhhhahhhh!! :reddevil "rlol" "rlol"
"rlol"

1. Glocks suck
2. Kimbers suck
3. Ford sucks
4. Chevy sucks
5. 9mm sucks
6. .45 sucks

Miss anything?
MeMelYup
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Re: OC Carry question

Post by MeMelYup »

Taypo wrote:
ScottDLS wrote:
Aggie_engr wrote:Do I understand this correctly, in that the mere location of an openly visible firearm placed not more than 3 feet from your person has generated 4 pages of discussions? Geez what is wrong with the world today. I'm just taking a step back and looking at this rationally, not taking sides or agreeing/disagreeing with anyone, but when one thinks about it this whole debate is just silly. I've always had the same rational approach to openly carrying, the mere presence of a piece of cloth or lack thereof determined if you were a criminal or not. And we say humans have evolved. :roll:

Not faulting anyone either for discussing the topic as it can have major implications for some, I just can't believe this is a topic which in today's world needs discussing, or AG opinion, or DPS clarification, or Supreme Court ruling.
Which is better M-16/M-4 or AK-47???? Bwahhhhhahhhhhahhhh!! :reddevil "rlol" "rlol"
"rlol"

1. Glocks suck
2. Kimbers suck
3. Ford sucks
4. Chevy sucks
5. 9mm sucks
6. .45 sucks

Miss anything?
Depends on what kind of lover you are.
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